GERMANS WANT TO GERMANIZE KOPERNIK (COPERNICUS)! OUTRAGE!

Because this is nothing more than some rulers having common interest. While you again confuse royalist loyalty with national loyalty.

What interests would that be, pray tell?

You know..let's count...it's about people who share the same:
language
customs
tradition
heritage
and even goals in not becoming subjugated and a tax-and slaves giving
province of the roman empire like their neighbours, the Gauls!

What do you think makes it different to any other nation?
Or more precisely WHAT are they lacking? In your opinion that is...

Well..for us it was one of the most important battles in our (GERMAN) history and one of the most important in Europe ever.
But then...you aren't a German, what would you know! :):):)

Arminius' monument:

Stop referring to me as to £ukasz.


I just wanted to show how crazy this idea is but I realized that you don't care about JustysiaS but about final result. :)

Your Nazi vision is stupid. :)

Yes,and US troops were at Plzen.The fate of all these regions had been decided in Yalta.

But you are £ukasz!

ROFL!!! :):):)

You know...it's these "gems" of yours which make you
so easily identifiable every time you slimed back onto the board
after you were kicked out...again!

Oh man.......you guys are STILL at it?
*shakes head and wanders off*

:)

Does it not make you an impression why the Germans want Copernicus so much since they have so many scientists and philosophs?Why do they need one more so desperate?

I think it is because the Poles do not have anyone more.

I told you we would share...but why should we agree to wrong facts and a wrong telling of history? That's about it!
Just sitting back and nodding for the sake of peace? How should we react?

How about if you guys all get a copy of Call Of Duty: World at War, and play it together online? hehe

I could make a thread to bet on the winning factions!
Could be interesting.....

enjoy:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Poles

edit. Here is something new (after quick look on list) Koprowski ;)
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hilary_Koprowski


No we have different view on some issues than Germans. We are proud of it :)
No way :)) Kopernik is Polish name there are people with this name in Poland its latin version is Copernicus. :) Koper in Polish means "dill" so it is very Polish name 130 people have this name.

Germans have strange mentality and old history of changing facts ...

The past of different tribes which became part of Germany, may be considered as a heritage of German nation. However this doesn't make 'the Germans' out of those people, this is just how nationalist propaganda describe them.

£ukasz, didn't you say you were leaving?

Well...even Tacitus called them that way 2000 years back because they were so similiar to each other and clearly different to the Celts and the Gauls!

Tacitus Germania:
unrv.com/tacitus/tacitusgermania.php

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Istvaeones

And that was already written two millennias back but you know better of course...oooookaaaaay...:):):)


Maybe you should just read and accept how Kopernikus described himself:


Why are you ignoring that?

Well you use name Kopernikus and this name doesn't exist in reality ... it only exists in German books. Kopernik is real name and it exists mostly in Poland in places connected with Kopernik history.

moikrewni.pl/mapa/kompletny/kopernik.html

Check your German versions or Latin versions !!!! They don't exist in reality!!!
Kopernik was loyal Polish citizen ... there are people with this name in Poland ( 130 people) and in Germany (about 58 - many of them in places with minorities) !!! Face some facts.

Another story is that remains of Prussians (you) in Berlin or generally in eastern Germany should rather think about present time because they are not very successful people ... only one thing they have is dream about 19th century great Prussia.... Look on Poles on the other side of border and learn what does hard work mean and determination in purpose achievements.

There was a world of difference between a Saxon speaking Plattdeutsch and Bavarian up to 19th century. You are sounding more like Crow now with your Pan-*insert your ethnicity here* talk :)

Well Bratwurst boy believes himself to be German even if he is from Silesia (Part of Poland). Most of the Germans got expelled from Silesia after ww2, how come they didn't kick out your family too then?

Gash i wont destroy your dreams, if you wish the be a German so be it.

I trust people who prove they can be trusted. Trust and respect should be something you gain through hard work, through being a helpful or even useful person, and all the things you contribute to your environment?

I mean, if someone doesn't have or lost track of her or his roots, that's not always their fault?

If you look at the world's history, and go back to the earliest days of humanity, you can see that all humans once travelled around, met, exchanged culture, beliefs, traded, and really most of them were hunters and nomads..

So basically we all came from the same continent, only much and much later people settled and slowly began to forge territories, which later became larger domains, which eventually became the countries we now live in..

My point is, you're not that much different from me or anyone else just because you were born in Germany?

Give it some thought then.. Suppose that you would have a family of your own, and tomorrow Germany was going to be at war again, and they would lose the fight and some foreign force occupied Germany. (Suppose!) Suppose they would persecute a certain group of people and you happened to belong to that group of people. (Suppose!)

Suppose you would flee to America to ensure the future and safety of your children. (Which is honourable.) Your children would slowly lose their roots, and become what you call Cosmopolitans. And finally, ask yourself this question;

Would you see yourself as a totally different person if you were forced to live somewhere else? Would you see yourself as a person who should be mistrusted just because he had to move?



She's not lecturing any of you Grzegorz. She basically said: You have the right to live your life just like others have the right to live theirs. Nobody should tell eachother what to think, because that should be something you can do for yourself being a grown man (Or woman!) and all..


I think we should look at the past and learn from it, and not bring the past back to the future. Everything changes. Always. If things never changed, people in general wouldn't have invented so much..

I think it's good to treasure the past, but I think we can all be proud (Or sometimes ashamed!) of major breakthroughs and human achievements throughout our history..

I'm just as proud of a German person who invents a nature-friendly car than I would be of a Polish person who would do the same..(Or any other nationality for that matter!) All that should matter is, that it's a positive change and we should be proud of anyone who does something positive for all of us? If we'd all work together and shared our expertise we could probably invent and develop a lot of useful technology and probably much faster..

I'd rather be proud of a single person who can prove he deserves my admiration than to be proud or even admire a group of people who didn't prove anything yet and who sometimes seem to think that pride, respect or even admiration is their birthright?

Respect and pride are like salary, you have to earn all of that through the hard work you deliver, or through the actions you perform.

That seems to be the only difference in thinking between us? Also I want to add this: If you mistrust people because of things they cannot help themselves, then those people will feel your mistrust. They will doubt, and they will in turn, start to mistrust you..

You could say that this is where all the fear, lying and decieving starts. Simply because we think we're so much different from eachother while infact, we all have the same basic needs, instincts and emotions.

In addition: I like football, especially when the national team plays. It connects people, and gives them something to be proud of. So yes, I too can feel a bit of nationalism and what it means sometimes, but it shouldn't ever be a reason to mistrust, or to hate someone else for.

I know some guys who will shout at any German. I never did this. I've made some jokes (I admit I have a bad sense of humour sometimes!) but really, that's it. You'll never see me judge someone else based on skincolour or nationality..

In the end, if you go back long enough, we all have the same roots, we all have the same origin, and we all have the same mother.. The world was called Gaia, it was one continent without boarders or even nationalities.

So it seems history will repeat itself? I think we will globalize at some point, and I also think there's no need to be afraid of that..

Copernicus was a great mind, and he probably was a freethinker, (With the Church persecuting almost anyone who didn't agree with them that the world was flat along with some other ridiculous ideas.) and above all else, he was a human being, so why can't we just admire the man for what he achieved, instead of admiring him only for where he came from?

You don't really need someone else to feel better about yourself. You can do that yourself, just by being the someone you would like to be.

That's what being a freethinker means. That's what being a cosmopolitan means. So treasure our differences, because our differences make us stronger, our differences make us more versatile and very able to adapt to anything that is being thrown at us as a people..

Maybe we should all go back to our roots and pass the peace pipe around for a while?

Spot on APU Arien. Instead of praising the praiseworthy, we try to belittle their achievements.

In today's climate of information sharing, we place too much emphasis on patenting and other such claims. We take too much for granted.

When I give lessons on inventions, students are shell-shocked when I tell them the contributions many Scots have made. They automatically get defensive and say, 'well, we've done this and this'. Immediately, they try to turn it into some kind of competition and that's where it all goes wrong.

Now, where's that peace-pipe?

What is the source? This fragment have little sense, why not to reveal whole quote to understand the context?

Anyway, if you really consider him to be German, then he must be also awful traitor of German nation. Right? :) I read that German National Socialists also claimed that Copernicus was 'purely German'. I fail to understand why they wanted such a traitor of 'Germanic race' being recognized 'German'. :)

It depends on a consideration of many factors. He was subjected to a very 'Germanic' environment as a child. However, he was born in Torun. It may be interesting to note that authoritative encyclopaedias regard him as Polish.

However, international regard is no guarantee of fixed status. There'd have to be an in-depth debate along modern international law lines. It just wasn't as significant back then.

You are new on this board, aren't you...


They got THAT one right...


Erm...why?


There still is...:)


Most encyclopedias speak about his city of birth who was in that moment polish...doesn't make the man polish though...


I just stopped smoking...but what the hell! :)

No, it doesn't make him Polish but, invariably, ur birthplace tends to dictate ur nationality.

He was named after his father who was Polish. His mother was German, right? Watzenrode?

Usually yes...but between Poland and Germany borders seem to fluctuate more than somewhere else...just a few years back and he would have been born in the German town of Torn.


Well..we don't know it exactly...there is an indication that he was German too as we know that he held a position in the towns court which was at that time only open to Germans!

His family name was Kopperlingk, his mother was a born Watzenrode...

Gee, I dunno if we'd be having this debate in Scotland. We have enough inventors of our own and wouldn't feel the need to squabble over one guy.

economicexpert.com/a/Copernicus:nationality.htm
I hope this sheds some light on the debate

He...I posted that link already some pages back in this thread Seanus.
We were actually over most of the arguments several times...:)


For there isn't a debate anymore actually as Kopernikus himself described his nationality quite clearly! But these stubborn Poles...:)

Oops, sorry, I didn't rewind back that far. His upbringing seemed to be more German tho.

Poland has enough inventors: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Poles


False he described himself as from Toruń.

Germans want to call EU project using German name but it doesn't exist in reality.

Only Polish version Kopernik is in use (Mostly in Poland and some in Germany -many of them in regions with Slavic miniority) In Poland Kopernik's live in places connected with Koperniks history. German name mentioned in your link doesn't exist in reality (in Germany and Poland)

ONLY POLISH VERSION : moikrewni.pl/mapa/kompletny/kopernik.html

And why do you think that is?
:)

It's quite real:

google.com/search?hl=en&q=EU+project+Kopernikus&btnG=Google+Search&aq=f&oq=


Nope: