Poland no Unemployment benefits after paying taxes for 20 years

ufo973 10 | 88

5 Aug 2014 / #1

His £120,000-a-year salary with an international pharmaceutical company in the capital Warsaw meant he could live very well.
After 20 years of working, paying taxes and National Insurance, he lost his job at the age of 59.
However, when Joe turned up at the employment office to register, he was in for a shock.
Read more: express.co.uk/news/uk/412968/No-benefits-here-for-you-Poles-tell-jobless-Briton

Meanwhile Polish moms receiving child benefits from UK in their homes in Poland...read it here
dailymail.co.uk/news/article-483225/1m-child-benefit-paid-month--mothers-Poland.html

This shows how the Poland's welfare & social benefit system (ZUS) is a failed system and that's why young Poles are leaving this disastrous country and system leaving behind an aging population.

Less777 - | 48

5 Aug 2014 / #2

I'm sure there is a thread about it somewhere on PF.

Monitor 13 | 1810

6 Aug 2014 / #3

@Ufo: Have you read this article? The gut didn't know the law and is surprised that applying too late can cause loosing benefits:

"They told me that, basically, in order to qualify for benefits you have to register as soon as you lose your job.

This shows how the Poland's welfare & social benefit system (ZUS) is a failed system

No, that shows that the guy is an idiot. It's his fault, but he went to press in order to complain.

Harry

6 Aug 2014 / #4

It's his fault

It's his fault that he first tried not to be a burden to the state?

he went to press in order to complain.

No he didn't. I know both Joe and Ed (the journalist who wrote the story) well.

Monitor 13 | 1810

6 Aug 2014 / #5

It's his fault that he first tried not to be a burden to the state?

I think that he can go for social help now if he is completely broke, maybe will get warm soup. And yes it's his fault.

No he didn't. I know both Joe and Ed (the journalist who wrote the story) well.

But he must have given consent to publish his story.

Harry

6 Aug 2014 / #6

But he must have given consent to publish his story.

That is not what you said. You claimed "he went to press in order to complain" and that very simply is not true.

Monitor 13 | 1810

6 Aug 2014 / #7

I only assumed that. It rarely happens other way.

smurf 38 | 1940

6 Aug 2014 / #8

It's really his own fault for not registering as soon as he was fired.

The rule is the same in the UK, it's the same in Ireland. As soon as you lose your job you must register with the social welfare system.

I've sympathy for the poor bloke, but the rules are the same for Poles in Britain and Ireland who wish to claim welfare following losing a job.

Harry

6 Aug 2014 / #9

The rule is the same in the UK, it's the same in Ireland. As soon as you lose your job you must register with the social welfare system.

I can't see that rule here: gov.uk/jobseekers-allowance/eligibility

Monitor 13 | 1810

6 Aug 2014 / #10

No he didn't. I know both Joe and Ed (the journalist who wrote the story) well.

This journalist writes in tabloid style. He accuses Poland for discrimination of foreigners:

Under EU law, Poland has the same obligations to foreigners as Britain does.

But the fact is that any person working in Poland who would fail to meet the deadline would loose the right to benefits.

If he was fair he could write about absurdity of such deadlines, but then it wouldn't be a good topic for the newspaper, because British are not interested in details of Polish law.

Anglo

6 Aug 2014 / #11

Am sorry to inform the ill - informed but I lost my job in the October of one year and put in a claim the following July and still recieved my full unemployment benefit.

You do not have to register immediately with the DWP to receive benefit it is not time limited in the UK.

Harry

6 Aug 2014 / #12

This journalist writes in tabloid style.

Duh: it's a tabloid newspaper.

jon357 73 | 23131

6 Aug 2014 / #13

If he'd been getting £120,000 a year in the UK he'd get short shrift from the dole office too. Unless he'd spent it all.

Meanwhile Polish moms receiving child benefits from UK in their homes in Poland...read it here

If the head of the family is paying UK tax, he or she is entitled to tax credits for their children.

This shows how the Poland's welfare & social benefit system (ZUS) is a failed system

Tell us something we don't know

The rule is the same in the UK, it's the same in Ireland. As soon as you lose your job you must register with the social welfare system.

No. You can wait in the UK.

He accuses Poland for discrimination of foreigners:

There's plenty of that.

Anglo

6 Aug 2014 / #14

If he had been a recipient of 120k salary he would be in a high tax band which would mean higher 40 - 45% tax rate.

Unless he had savings over 16k at the time of claiming he would be fully entitled to Contribution Based Unemployment Benefit regardless of how high his salary was.

jon357 73 | 23131

6 Aug 2014 / #15

If he was on £120k per year, one would expect savings of far more than that.

Marysienka 1 | 195

6 Aug 2014 / #16

Well, as we are discussing Poland, Polish citizens need to have been employed for at least 365 days in the last 18 months to be able to get benefit in Poland. I guess this applies to EU citizes as well. Guy had almost half a year to register and he forgot?

Anglo

6 Aug 2014 / #17

True about 120k salary.

So what happens to someone in Poland if they have not worked in the last 18 month's ?, are they eligible for an income based benefit like the UK.

Marysienka 1 | 195

6 Aug 2014 / #18

Also, he would have gotten 5340 for half a year ( if he really worked over 20 years) (831,10*3+652,6*3)*120%, before Tax and ZUS.

smurf 38 | 1940

6 Aug 2014 / #19

I can't see that rule here:

From Irish literature:

Apply for a jobseeker's payment as soon as you can after
losing your job so that you don't lose out on payment.
You can download the form for Jobseeker's Benefit and
Allowance (called UP 1) from welfare.ie

from a PDF available here: losingyourjob.ie/losingyourjob_leaflet.pdf

Maybe you can wait in the UK, as Jon says, I'm trying to find info on UK sites, but by God, your government doesn't like making websites easy to find stuff on.

The reason for doing it straight away in Ireland is so that your pension payments, PAYE & PRSI are still kept up, otherwise you'll lose out on a few payments and a few payments of dole because I think it takes around 9-11 weeks for the decision to be made.

Marysienka 1 | 195

6 Aug 2014 / #20

If they have very low/ no income , yes. But I don't know the rules. I've been unemployed few times so I know the rules, but income based benefits are social care, and I never applied there.

I just checked and you have to be in bad situation, social worker comes and verifies.

Harry

6 Aug 2014 / #21

Apply for a jobseeker's payment as soon as you can after losing your job so that you don't lose out on payment.

Smurf, they mean that if you don't claim it, you lose it (i.e. if you don't claim it, you do not get it and cannot apply for it retrospectively), not that you lose the right to claim it in the future.

jon357 73 | 23131

6 Aug 2014 / #22

Maybe you can wait in the UK, as Jon says, I'm trying to find info on UK sites

I know nothing about the rules in Ireland, but I do have a bit of fairly recent experience in the UK. Income-based Jobseekers' Allowance is based on your present situation so they base the claim from the date you register - you don't have to sign up for it when you lose a job.

In Poland, even if you don't have any entitlement to dole (or any legal income) you can register as unemployed (without that time limit) and that will entitle you to free healthcare.

Marysienka 1 | 195

6 Aug 2014 / #23

In Poland, even if you don't have any entitlement to dole (or any legal income) you can register as unemployed (without that time limit) and that will entitle you to free healthcare.

that is true, you can also be beneficent of scholarships, courses and other programs for registered unemployed, if you fit other criteria like age, gender, place of living length of unemployment, disability etc.

Anglo

6 Aug 2014 / #24

And is the social care aspect of the Polish benefit system available to all EU citizen's or is this limited.

Monitor 13 | 1810

6 Aug 2014 / #25

limiting is illegal

Marysienka 1 | 195

6 Aug 2014 / #26

a quick serach shows that you need residency, permission to stay in Poland, be in Poland, and of course all conditions for Polish citizens also apply.

infolink.wroclaw.pl/node/339?language=en

smurf 38 | 1940

6 Aug 2014 / #27

they mean that if you don't claim it, you lose it (i.e. if you don't claim it, you do not get it and cannot apply for it retrospectively), not that you lose the right to claim it in the future.

yep, you'd be right there......unless there is a cut off point time wise. Need to check that.

Still though, ignorance of the law is no excuse. He got fired, he really should've know what he had to do. Obviously he's an educated man (with such a high wage). I'm sure he can afford some swanky lawyers that can help him out. Going to the British press ain't going to do him any help though, can't imagine a Polish judge wouldn't frown upon that.

you don't have to sign up for it when you lose a job.

Righto

a quick serach shows that you need residency, permission to stay in Poland

That;s the bit I don't get. Since Poland is an EU country and most of use immigrants here...on this forum at least....are EU citizen how come we need permission to be here?

Complete nonsense so it is.

Marysienka 1 | 195

6 Aug 2014 / #28

I translated from polish , and didn't know formal terms, it's residence permit. You know what it is better than I do.

smurf 38 | 1940

6 Aug 2014 / #29

it's residence permit

yea, that's more or less it.
You move here and get a temporary one for 3 years, then you get one for 10 years and I don't know what's after that.

Pointless though, as an EU citizen you have freedom to move between the EU states.

Then again, I read an interesting article that Poles suffers the worst surveillance by their government of all the European countries. So Big Brother is always watching.

Monitor 13 | 1810

6 Aug 2014 / #30

Pointless though, as an EU citizen you have freedom to move between the EU states.

Not exactly, because you can have your right to stay in other country for longer than 3 months revoked if you don't meet some conditions. For example in Germany you must prove to have enough money to provide for yourself and have German health insurance. I've also heard Dutch saying that they'll be deporting EU immigrants who will not find a job in 3 months. Regardless of Schengen you can still be banned to enter any EU country.

europa.eu/legislation_summaries/justice_freedom_security/free_movement_of_persons_asylum_immigration/l33152_en.htm

The right of residence for more than three months remains subject to certain conditions. Applicants must:

either be engaged in economic activity (on an employed or self-employed basis);
or have sufficient resources and sickness insurance to ensure that they do not become a burden on the social services of the host Member State during their stay. The Member States may not specify a minimum amount which they deem sufficient, but they must take account of personal circumstances;
or be following vocational training as a student and have sufficient resources and sickness insurance to ensure that they do not become a burden on the social services of the host Member State during their stay;
or be a family member of a Union citizen who falls into one of the above categories.