Who is poor in Poland?

People don't get rich by taking out a loan. People can get rich by taking out the loan, investing the money and growing money. Spending the loan money for consumerism makes you a beggar if you are not capable to pay the debt off. Assume you've taken a loan, bought a house for that, then there's a stock market panic and the bank tells you return the loan. You get evicted. Such things hardly happen in Poland.


The hamburger bit was a slight suggestion you could learn English somewhat better.


Mostly debit cards. Another proof how little you know about Poland.


Really embarrassing. Use a spell-checker.

Here is a story for you Antek, about 18 months ago I was in Land rover, next to Panorama, looking at a new car for my wife, I was speaking to the sales manager and asked him how business was doing, his response was business is only good for us when the stock market performs well. So I asked him to explain, he informed, Polish people don't buy for cash, if they have 150-300,000 PLN they put it in funds or the stock market and pay off the car on a lease agreement.

Thanks a lot, warsz! The leasing business has worked that way for a long time here, true. The point with leasing is you have to pay over defined term to the leasing company, then you can "buy" the car from them, right?

True, but ...

I suspect there would have been a lot more of this about if the banking sector had had another 3 years to get its teeth into people before the **** hit the fan. It was only in the final couple of years, around 2007, where 100% mortgages were offered and that did of course put a lot of people into negative equity. Of course, with many credits taken in CHF it wasn't in the banks' interest to recoup and sell either because they'd have bad debt to the Swiss money markets at the same time as the PLN was heading south.

This didn't stop at least one bank in 2009 trying it on with its customers and threatening to foreclose on people who were making their credit payments on time and without problems. A constitutional or higher court threw this silliness out, but it strikes me that there are still a lot of people in the financial services industry here who haven't quite got the rules of the game.

Thanks for the correction, english is my second language.


Stop talking rubbish Antek, seems you have no recovered from the nights activity. Pull the other one!

English is my third language.

And stay on topic, please. It seems your arguments are exhausted and you start using argumentum ad persona.

Although with 9,051 euros the citizens of the Polish capital Warsaw are almost 64 per cent higher than the national average, their disposable income is around 3,500 euros lower than the benchmark figure for Europe. And there are considerable variations within the capital itself. Whereas people in the poorest part of the city only have 7,717 euros at their disposal, the figure for the most affluent district is 10,033 euros.

The richest people in the Polish capital Warsaw therefore have less money at their disposal than the poorest rural district in Germany. Overall, the per capita purchasing power in all districts in Poland has increased, with the biggest rises enjoyed by people in the big cities like Warsaw (1,315 euros) and Danzig (1,238 euros).

toyfair.de/index.php?id=2100
Stop talking sh1te, Poland is a poor country as far as the majority are concerned.

Antek declare your hand and tell me who you are? Do you live in Poland, where do you work, or are you just some retard living in a one room rented building who spends all his time on a computer annoying people?

It would be only honest if you introduced yourself first.

But I have no secrets. I am a Pole living in Poland. I am a consultant in technical software industry, I own a house and 2800 sq.m. of a forest lot. And you?

is Poland poor - I don't know

but

The report prepared by the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development says that the Poles spend on children least of all the 32 countries belonging to the organization.

The material situation of children in Poland was rated as the worst among 21 European countries and by UNICEF .

Norwegians seem to keep the child almost ten times more than the Statistical Poles . As a result, 1.8 million children in Poland suffer from poverty .
the article is about OECD and UNICEF raports on children - the title of the article is Our poor children

Are you doing anything to help them, Gumishu?

raportysponsorowane.onet.pl/biznes/1416152,index.html

This means that USA is not a significant investor on polish market . USA is on the 17-th place as an investor and american investors mostly speculate on WSE and playing with polish currency. Where did you find such informations that USA is number one investor ?

It's utter rubbish. For a start - not being able to send your child on holiday is hardly poverty - I know several British families that can't afford that as well, yet you'd never say they were living in poverty.

Poverty is going hungry, not having adequate shelter, not having utilities, being cold and not having adequate clothing.

Not much of that in Poland.

let those help who can - if you ask if I have ever given any money to charity the answer is yes

btw - I am not saying this report clearly shows reality - I don't know really poor children personally

That might be a point.
I'm not joking here. There is tremendous information chaos around and written information does not need necessarily be true. This is why I value eye-witnessing so much and laugh at "could you show me an article?"

BTW, it looks that wielki pan was not able to show his cards ;-)

An anecdote to relieve the atmosphere:
On my first vacation trip to UK, we were telling different people we wanted to go see Liverpool. Virtually any English people around London were telling us: "DO NOT GO TO BIRKENHEAD! Only slums, thieves and bandits there!" Therefore, I had to go see Birkenhead. (By the way, the Mersey Tunnels are a masterpiece of engineering). While driving through Birkenhead, my wife could not help making the following comments:

-- See that bandit with attache case and wearing suit?
-- Oh, how sweet those bandit children playing football!
-- Have you seen those slums? I'd like to live in such slums!
;-)))

From all the research I've done in Poland into the issue, as well as talking to many professionals - the one recurring theme is that children are mostly living in poverty due to parental neglect, not due to the income of the parents.

All this talk of children going to school hungry - even if you're desperately poor, what does it cost to buy a few vegetables and prepare them to be eaten?

What's undeniable is that in Poland, there's a very serious problem with parental neglect resulting in children living in poverty. There's also a serious problem with children and school books - the current system of requiring children to buy textbooks is an utter disgrace.

Eh ? It seems that you don't even understand basic indicators.

children need to eat properly or else they won't grow up properly - no amount of vegetables will make them grow this way (or maybe only beans)

Meaning 200% is the desired target for next 2 years?
---
P.S. I have included a story of eye-witnessing vs. myths in my post above.

Is this possible ? If they live "totally on debt" now ?

in some 10 years whoever is gonna run this country will have stickers all around him saying - education, you fool

I ask you: Is the US debt going in trillions something not to be worried about?

The 200% means twice as money is borrowed by the Government that the country can produce. Soon, America will have to yield to China.

I'm more worried about the Polish one.


When ?

100 per cent debt means that a year GDP of the country would be spent in its whole if the country wanted to repay the debt in a year - if I understand that correctly

I will find the source.

paiz.gov.pl/20110520/polands_fdi_in_1_quarter_2011

The U.S. Government will never be able to repay its debt if it continues borrowing and the debt is rising constantly to unbelievable levels.

Tell me Grzegorz_ what could the U.S. Govt. do to handle the debt.

If the US economy get back on the right track, they will repay it without much problems.

Tell me Antek_ why didn't you answer to my previous post ?

"If" is crucial. IF. And IF NOT? What do you mean by the right track? Resigning from offshore production and giving employment back to U.S. Americans maybe?

I know your point, Grzegorz: The debt is to be paid off over certain number of years. However, constant borrowing, more and more, means starting a spiral with no exit.

If, if.

Recently, Standard and Poors gave the US economy a negative outlook (only happened once before) and made all sorts of threatening noises about downgrading the credit rating on its sovereign debt. All that's stopping that happening is mutually assured destruction across the global debt markets. The problem is deeply ingrained.

A colleague of mine put it rather eloquently in his blog, stating that global economies are in the same unfortunate position as Schroedinger's cat. Were someone to actually observe them (meaning, were a credit ratings agency or the IMF to get to the fundamentals and really audit the situation properly) it'd be coffin time for Kitty. As it is, no-one does and we carry on oscillating between quantum states (or whatever it is one does when the lights are off and no-one's looking)

IF NOT then we all will be in deep s*it.


American economy is still very competetive, the crisis is due to demand gap, which is a result of banks' moving to more restrictive credit policy. Once the economy adjust to the new situation and they stop wasting so much on stupid wars, I see no other problems for America.


Indeed. This is what happens in many countries including Poland. We spend tens of billions annually just on interests from existing debt.