Life / Foreigners in Poland and what they think of us [54]

No wonder, both Arabs and Israelis originate from the same region more or less... : en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semitic

Food / What's your favorite Polish beer? [870]

Winter is coming so this is what can warm you up in case of cold:
Ingredients:
- one Ciechan or Lwówek Śląski (or some other strong beer)
- spoon of honey
- flake of lemon
- about half of pack of "beer spice" (Przyprawa do Grzańca)
- a little bit of ginger
- a little bit of cinnamon
- a little bit of dried cloves (Goździki)

Preparation:
Throw everything except beer and cinnamon in some nice big mug. Warm beer up to about 60 - 70 Celsius (NOT boil it!). Pour beer into mug, and mix everything. Then add cinnamon on the top on mousse.

That's it :-) Maybe it will not cure you but for sure you will feel better.

Work / Average monthly salary in Poland is around 1000 PLN (few hundred bucks). [387]


As I wrote "theoretically". Practically speaking you are a pessimists to some degree:
- there is no better universities in Poland than state universities (which are for free if you are smart enough), but on the other hand there is no tech uni even close to MIT

- retirement pays you as much as you were able to save...
- as for a health-care it varies greatly. There can be two hospitals in a town, both state owned and both entirely different at the same time. It depends mostly of hospital management and quality of staff.

Anyway, above median salaries are net salaries, and most people don't pay additionally for above mentioned services but takes what state deliver wheter it is good or not.

Language / Some Ideas for a band name using the Polish language? [94]

Teffle, considering your nickname, obviously you should go for:

Tafla which means something like floe, surface, plate

considering your nickname and incoming winter maybe this:

Tafla Lodu which means Ice Floe :-)

If want to express multilayer of your art then you can pick up just: Tafle Lodu = Ice Floes.

Something senseless but with rhyme would be Tafla Wafla = more or less Wafer Floe

Work / Average monthly salary in Poland is around 1000 PLN (few hundred bucks). [387]

Not arguing that it is not peanuts, but just to clarify, it is net, so after taxes (which, at least theoretically means that health, education, retirement, etc. is already paid for).

Work / Average monthly salary in Poland is around 1000 PLN (few hundred bucks). [387]

Net median salaries in Poland:

PS. median means that half of people is getting less, and second half is getting more.

Life / What is Poland B as opposed to Poland A and the otherway-round. [45]


Yes. Basically £ódź is very young city (not in demographic terms) which grew on one industry.
During communism this monoculture of textile industry was even depened. After 89' all that collapsed and due to growing competition from Asia it never has been rebuilded. On the other hand city seemed to have bad luck regarding local gov. and for a long time it couldn't attract investors to develop new economic model. What is more next to £ódź is the biggest Polish attractor = Warsaw what depened £ódź troubles by getting people out of the city (to what zetigrek was reffering).

So during last two decades £ódź fell from Polish second city to the third position (in terms of population) and still keeps falling.
To be not entirely dire about the place, there is a hope, because due central position on the map all main infrastructural projects has £ódź as a centre. Taking into account that it is close to already expensive Warsaw and also much cheaper than other big cities, maybe £ódź will rebound in coming years.

Life / What is Poland B as opposed to Poland A and the otherway-round. [45]


Well, unfortunately £ódź is a sick man among big cities.

Life / Poznan or Wroclaw - which city is more foreigner-friendly? [18]

I don't know what Olaf is talking about regarding architecture, because both cities are more or less in the same category.
Regarding infrastructure he is right, untill next year when some important works will be finished including highway bypass of Wroclaw. But I suppose public transport still will be a little better in Poznan.

Well it all depends on your goals... From leisure perspective it goes like this:
- if you prefer to be closer to lakes, Baltic Sea, Warsaw, Gdansk and Berlin then Poznan is for you
- if you prefer to be closer to mountains, Polish and Czechs(preferably...) ski resorts, Cracow, Praque and well Berlin, then Wroclaw is for you


Not really, most of Poles have never been to Lwow and Wilno...

Life / What is Poland B as opposed to Poland A and the otherway-round. [45]

Over the years this division become popular expression for better vs worse but it is not main meaning of it. I will post one more map made by user "voy" from skyscrapercity.com forum which shows population changes in Poland between 1995-2000. I think this more truly shows where the Poland A and B is forming right now. Peoples are voting with their feet, red population gain, blue population loss (I think it takes emigration into account):

PS. some main cities like Poznan or Wroclaw are blue, but I think it is more reasonable to assume that this is due to urban sprawl because overall aglomerations are gaining.

Life / What is Poland B as opposed to Poland A and the otherway-round. [45]


Well, it's not and SeanBM is right. Poland A / Poland B classification originates in partitions. Actually the problem of merging again economically and culturally different piececes together exists in Polish politics since independence. Someone on this forum posted interesting propaganda piece from pre-war Poland which explains a lot about origins:

After so many years differences are vanishing but nevertheless they still persists. For example it can be observed on railroad maps of Poland:

koleje w Polsce

The problem is that this initial inequality is hard to change, because better infrastructure in so called Poland A makes it more suitable economically for further investitions. So even if there is a special program for poorer regions it cann't of course make a private business to invest more there. Private money are of course greater and more focused than state moneys so difference is getting dipper.

But it is not like the west is richer than east everywhere. For example some parts of west voivodeships are poorer than many eastern regions. Also, for example Podkarpackie and Rzeszow region in recent years had very good economic stats in terms of progress.

Well it is long and deep subject with many factors. We didn't even touched neighbours factor. For example Podlaskie region due to neighbouring with low populated and closed economy of Belarus is not very well suited for investition so even state investition in highways have the lowest priority there... And on and on :-) Buy some book, I'm sure there is some :-)

Travel / Insights about winter in Poland. Polish winter during holidays as charming as spring? [21]


If there is snow, then yes. Without snow it can be gray and depressing... It is unpredictible, but in Podhale you should have more snow than in most of Poland.


Again, considering that your target area are hills of Podhale then winter tires is a must.

As for skiing Polish ski resorts are usually quite poor. But still can be a lot of fun, just try to avoid holidays and weekends. Otherways you will lose a lot of time in queues. You should check out what are options in Slovakia because it is nearby. Personally I've never been skiing there, but there is much more big mountains there, so maybe they have better resorts.

Language / déjà vu in Polish [23]

Not exactly on topic, but there is nice Polish comedy from 1988 called Deja Vu:
..

Life / All Saints' Day in Poland - Commemoration or Carnival? [44]


Well, that is not my experience. For example in one of my family tombs there are grandparents, father, sister and an uncle... It is quite usuall in the place I come from regarding the number of dead ones...

Anyway, I think you guys need some info regarding "economy of funerals" in Poland.
Everytime someone dies in Poland family gets state support in order to bury that someone properly (probably in order to not have some unknown boddies in the forests...). Till recently this support was around 7000 zł. Thing is that it supposed to be spend on funerals related staff (bills should be given back to ZUS). Those money can have something to do with maybe to elaborate gravestones in PL.

PS. Just for the record this support will be cut by half in next year...

Life / All Saints' Day in Poland - Commemoration or Carnival? [44]


Actually today's candles are made for reuse. Many people just don't care because candles are cheap.


There is some true in it, but on the other hand most gravestones are made for generations. There are grandparents there, sometimes grandgrand... There are parents there, there are sometimes brothers and sisters there. That's why, as a long standing structures gravestones are designed to be solid, maybe sometime to elaborate.

PS. To see elaborate gravestones you should check cementaries in Lisboa.

Love / Fell in love; I need to go back to Poland for 2 months - what to say at work (UK) [50]

I used to not engage in social threads, but lets give a try to that one :-)

From romantic perspective I think that in the long run only those wild decisions and events matters. I mean in ten, twenty, thirty years you will not rememember even what was the main project you are involved right now, but quite possibly you will remember this love affair. The thing is it will be the best time of your life or the worst one... No one knows how it will go...

From practical perspective, well if you have couple of months behind you I think you can try this:
- choose a place: his or yours
- get a two-three week leave, both of you but not entire at the same time, maybe one week which covers.
that way you should have about one month together without risk of job loss.

A month should be enough to make some judgments. And maybe something nice or horrific to remember ;)

Life / All Saints' Day in Poland - Commemoration or Carnival? [44]

For the most part it is commemoration, at least in my family and many others that I know.
It is also very powerful tradition to spend this day the way most of people usually spend it (ie. grave visits and family visits). We can tell how strong it is by the weakness of anglosaxon Halloween tradition which regardless it's charm and constant pressure cann't input itself in Poland. Compare it to Saint-Valentin Day which conquered Poland swiftly.

As for hot-dog near cementaries I didn't saw that near cementary I visited this year. On the other hand if it is not to close I cann't condemn it. First, people really travel hundreds of km that day so basic needs has to be satisfied one way or another. Anyway most people prefer family dinner than hot-dog. I cann't condemn it even more because of certain Slavic and Balts traditions, which is almost extinct now: it use to be that families gathered and feast at graves living some food for the dead ones... :

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dziady
pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dziady_%28zwyczaj%29
Well, eating hot-dogs nearby has probably nothing to do with that as long as someone will not leave a piece on the grave ;)

History / EU or Russian Empire, who taking/took more from Poland and Poles? [40]

About EU I would like only to post some graphics (tells more than thousands words ;-))
It's about small part of general picture but imporant part. It's about circulatory system of economy. It's about highways & motorways :-) In much of you can see some EU funds are involved, of course only some percent of an overall cost. Of course many of those roads below are builded by western companies, but many are builded by Polish ones, and some small part even by Chinese...

Current state of highways and motorways in Poland (only this, without smaller class roads), state on 17.10.2010, map created by Moloch, esce, latajacy dywan from skyscrapper forum:

Legend:
Green - existing
Red - in bulding
Purple - design
Yellow & Brown - tender
Blue - environment decision (quite important papers)

Highways and motorways in building (only this, without smaller class roads), state on 10.2010, created by toonczyk from skyscrapper forum:

Legend: black is sum of all classes

Highways and motorways existing and in building (only this, without smaller class roads), state on 10.2010, created by sliwers from skyscrapper forum:



Legend: green existing, red in building

Law / Threatened to serve papers if I don't remove a review about a renting company in Poland [62]

@stu, well I'm not a lawyer but if I understand correctly the worst you can be accused of is internet stalking (which of course is not even remotely close to your doings), but there is no law in Poland for that yet (it is in making now...).

I think you can show them your three fingers and tell to "read between the lines"... But of course, maybe some professional lawyer opinion wouldn't hurt before you do that ;)

I do know some lawyers in Wroclaw but they do not work for free...

News / Why is Poland developing so slowly or in the wrong direction? Who is responsible ? [317]


Ok, so how this statement comply with thesis about prosperity of average citizen then? I see a contradiction here (though I know that it is not you who made such a thesis). Besides, mind you that before the war there were many Poles living there as a simple peasants too. I happen to know some and the picture they made though sentimental was not full of flowers and roses.

Besides, how 60% of GDP made by agriculture is good in the end of industralization period ?

News / Why is Poland developing so slowly or in the wrong direction? Who is responsible ? [317]


I would really like to see some hard numbers. You know, everybody knows more or less main achivements like Gdynia, currency reform, investitions in heavy industry. But looking at level of literacy, unemployment, massive reliance on agriculture, GPD per capita it doesn't look impressive. What is more corruption is not an modern invention too. For example first head of PKO was accused of malversation (he didn't live to the sentence because someone shot him...).

PS. by numbers I don't mean realtive numbers like: "GDP pre capita equal to Spanish" because Spain wasn't in good shape then either. It would be a pleasure to see some site with comparative graphs and statistics data regarding pre-war and modern Poland.

USA, Canada / Moved back from Canada to Poland:). Here are the reasons why. [868]


If you familiar with "Northern Exposure" series then there was an episod where they were using in the winter small hats with a light bulb shining directly onto user heads, I think many Poles should use that ;)

As for Scandinavians they supposedly drink even more than Poles in winter times... ;)
On more serious note Spanish friend of my friend had to give up in autumn an went to Spain exactly because of autumn/winter depression...


Oh come on, that was a joke... though I encountered many times people complaing about complaing for at least an hour...

News / Can someone give a neutral overview of Polish politics? [27]


There were even more of them. Yes, some are defectors. Without going into details:
Parties like SLD, SdPL and UP, PPS for some extent are postcommunist and have a source in THE ONE party ;)
Other than PSL are mostly rooted to Solidarność movement but not to current Solidarność union. It splitted into countless little parties in 90'. Late 90' and 2000' was a time of joints, but with many separations.

I didn't mention one thing, it is quite usual that on the local level nation-wide parties are suprisingly weak. For example in Wroclaw, so quite a big city, president has his own party/movement. He is post-solidarity guy and you can place him somewhere between PIS and PO but he is independent from them. I mention this because local governments has quite a lot powers and local coalition can be totally different from nation-wide coalitions.


I've read that you have a law wich practically excludes possibility of a third party (isn't the biggest issue of current third party in UK to change this law?). Polish law also prefers bigger parties but not to that extent as British one.

Besides, Polish saying goes: "Where two Poles there are three opinions" so binary political system wouldn't probably go well in Poland ;)

News / Can someone give a neutral overview of Polish politics? [27]

Well, there is no neutral view but just for a sport, my view:

Classification by economy:
Parties and influential forces other than media:
Socialists: PPS, UP, SLD, SdPL, PR, Catholic Church, Solidarność
In the middle but to the left: PIS, PSL
In the middle but to the right: PO
Liberal: UPR

(Liberal in economy equals level of freedom in economic activity)

Classification by moral values:
Parties and influential forces other than media:
Conservative: UPR, PR, PIS, PSL, Catholic Church, Solidarność
In the middle but to the conservative side more and more: PO
Liberal: PPS, UP, SLD, SdPL

(Liberal in moral values equals level of freedom in sexual activity ;) )

With media it is more complicated and there is many of them but I would say that for the most important:
Socialist in economy and liberal with moral values: Polityka
A little less socialist in economy and liberal with moral values: Gazeta Wyborcza, Talk FM
Not liberal but not socialist in economy and liberal with moral values: TVN, Polsat
Not liberal but not socialist in economy but conservative with moral values: Rzeczpospolita
Liberal in economy and conservative with moral values: Wprost

TVP and other state owned media - entirely depends on which party elected their latest management. Zero independence.

One more thing especially with newspapers, regarding economy it seems that what they write often depends on who paid them for advertisment on page next to an article...

News / Why is Poland developing so slowly or in the wrong direction? Who is responsible ? [317]


I see that this thread moved beyond opening post but I'm really curious on what data this statement is based? I would really enjoyed to see some statistics that proves pre WWII Poland superiority because otherwise it looks like someone imagined things...

Travel / Fr Rydzyk's Toruń wins hands down (best city to spend a weekend in Poland)! [5]

Toruń is a city you can fall in love with for two days... Great planetarium which makes you feel so small, great pierogis which makes you feel so big, great gothic buildings, quite nice modern art gallery... some other nice small museums. What is not to like?

On the other hand 38% vs 16% for Cracow tells me that some people in Toruń really wanted to win this pool ;-)

News / Is Poland headed for a civil war? [30]

The thing with hungry people in Poland is often like that (recent live example, small town in central Poland, old lady I know very well and local "hungry" man) :

hungry man: Mrs could you give me some money for bread ?
old lady: Hm.. no, but I can give you bread
hungry man: Errr... no, no, I would rather take some coins, I would like to buy something to make sandwiches.
old lady: but I can also make you some sandwiches
hungry man: no,no,no I would rather take some coins...

Everyone knows what he would like to buy... It is quite typical... She of course didn't give him any money...

Saying that, of course there are hungry people in Poland but it is usually connected with some social problems.

As for open question, no Poland is not headed for civil war. Eventually Poles will vote off entire political spectrum and will choose some new faces as usual but maybe just not yet. On local level nation wide parties are often weak (surprisingly for those who do not live in Poland and take info only from media).

USA, Canada / Moved back from Canada to Poland:). Here are the reasons why. [868]


True, Poles complain a lot, but take into account that we are entering the most depressing time of a year.... Anyway, everyone who complain that Poles complain is not any better ;)

Life / Foreigners in Poland and what they think of us [54]


I suppose if I will end up in Vietnam for some reason it would be hard for me to learn Vietnamese too... It seems though that the second generation is accomodating well which is positive.