Language / Too many English words in the Polish language! [709]

Not only English words in Polish, but German ones as well. In today's RZECZPOSPOLITA:

Bartosz Arłukowicz, polityk uważany do niedawna za potencjalną wunderwaffe lewicy, znalazł się w martwym punkcie – ocenia publicysta "Rzeczpospolitej".

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And my favorite borrowed English word, "coach", here again in the French collection of mine [found in LE FIGARO today]:

Comme le souligne Rafaël Vivier, coach chez WIT Associés, la lettre de motivation a perdu au fil des années toute utilité.

Interestingly, I've never come across the word 'coach' in the Polish press.

Language / Too many English words in the Polish language! [709]


So here comes a time to decline Monica Lewinsky and Bill Clinton:

To jest Monika Lewinsky ['Monika Lewińska' - for family and friends] / To jest Bill Clinton.
Nie ma Moniki Lewinsky [Nie ma Moniki Lewińskiej] / Nie ma Billa Clintona.
Robię kawę Monice Lewinsky [... kawę Monice Lewińskiej] / Monika Lewińska robi loda Billowi Clintonowi.
Mówię o Monice Lewinsky [... o Monice Lewińskiej] / Mówię o Billu Clintonie
Rozmawiam z Moniką Lewinsky [... z Moniką Lewińską] / Rozmawiam z Billem Clintonem.
Moniko Lewinsky, come here! Billu Clintonie, już idę do Ciebie!

[Odchodzą, trzymając się czule za ręce, wprost na przesłuchanie przed Komisją Kongresu Stanów Zjednoczonych.]

Oklaski, kurtyna ...

Language / Too many English words in the Polish language! [709]

And all of the sentences below are correct, too!
To jest Marylin Monroe.
Nie ma Merylin Monroe.
Robię kawę Merylin Monroe.
Widzę Merylin Monroe.
Mówię o Merylin Monroe.
Rozmawiam z Merylin Monroe.
Merylin Monroe, przyjdź tu!

Language / Too many English words in the Polish language! [709]


Even if I do understand the English term "focus/focusing", I do not understand the Polish term "fokusować". Some foreign words, however, will pass away naturally from the languauge over time. An example of this could be the word intrata which had been widely popular in Polish in the 18th century, but was nonetheless replaced with the Slavic word dochód later on. The trace of its popularity has remained however in today's adjective intratny, being a particular synonym to dochodowy with the meaning of "extremly profitable/more profitable than usual".

Some people using some foreign words do not realize they are the modern incarnation of Monsieur Jourdain of Molière's masterpiece "Le Bourgeois gentilhomme". They will never be able to see how ridiculous they are in their attemps to appear 'better' and wiser. If you remember the British incarnation of Monsieur Jourdain in the excellent BBC sitcom "Keeping Up Appearances", you shall keep in mind that those using the term 'fokusować' in Polish are certainly the people who will answer a phone call to their home by replying "The Bouquet's residence" rather than "Hyacinth Bucket speaking" in English.

History / Poles in the Napoleonic era [224]


If it were as you say, Frederic the Great who was once complimented by Adolf Hitler as "the first Nazi on a king's throne", would not resort to such drastic measures in his decree as 'throwing out teachers of their posts if they don't manage to master German within one year' (!). If the said areas were only minor "Polish linguistic enclaves", as you call it, the monarch nicknamed "the great" by his countrymen would have surely let these Polish linguistic enclaves inside the ocean of the German language die out without bothering about issuing a special decree against them.

Also, contrary to what you say, many of the Kreises enlisted in Frederic's decree were quite far off Upper Silesa or the then Polish border. What's more, the king doesn't list Kreises south-east of the Oppeln Kreis which are precisely the areas bordering the Polish frontier.

History / Poles in the Napoleonic era [224]


It is quite interesting to read in more detail what Frederic said in his decree: He names the following Kreises:
Breslau / Wrocław [---nieder---]
Brieg / Brzeg [---nieder---]
Falkenberg / Niemodlin [++ober++]
Ohlau / Oława [---nieder---]
Grottkau / Grodków [---nieder---]
Neisse / Nysa [---nieder---]
Neumarkt / Środa Śląska [---nieder---]
Trebnitz / Trzebnica [---nieder---]
Oels / Oleśnica [---nieder---]
Namslau / Namysłów [++ober++]
Kreuzburg / Kluczbork [++ober++]
Gross Wartenberg / Sycow [---nieder---]
[---nieder---] for Lower Silesia; [++ober++] for Upper Silesia

as those in which heads of the Kreises should eradicate Polish teachers if they do not command the German language within one year from the publishing of his decree in those towns, villages or areas where the king's subjects can speak only Polish. As the king's list names predominantely the Lower Silesian Kreises, this would inevitably mean that large parts of Lower Silesia were inhabited by people who were not able to speak any German at all.

It is worth noting that the king's decree doesn't name Oppeln/Opole or other Kreises west of this town as if he did not intend any "germanization" of the areas nearer to the western border of Upper Silesia and thus the eastern border of Poland which surely existed in 1764. Can anyone comment on that particular "silence" of Frederic the Great on these areas?

History / Poles in the Napoleonic era [224]


I am, of course, fully aware that the actions of Frederic the Great were being achieved in the context of the 18th century. In France, for example, the policies towards other languages were exactly the same as in Prussia: French was put forward as the language of the state at the expense of all other minority languages around the country.


In many parts of Lower Silesia the Polish were a majority rather than a minority before Frederic the Great. Your explanation does not give any clue as to why germanization succeeded there, whereas it did not succed in Upper Silesia; the Polish-speaking area in Upper Silesia started even to expand westwards in the beginning of the 20th century to the great concern of the German authorities.

History / Poles in the Napoleonic era [224]


This is clear evidence that the germanization of the Polish-speaking people of Lower Silesia has swiftly started off almost from the very moment the Prussians had conquered Silesia from the Austrian Empire in 1741. The germanization process which had hitherto been natural and very slow on the right bank of the river Oder and even in large areas south of Breslau/Wrocław [around the town of Oława], had been given a new, and a very strong, administrative dimension. The intention of Frederic the Great and the Prussians is more than clear for everyone who will read the above decree.

Curiously enough, the Prussians did not manage to make such a progress in the germanization of Upper Silesia which until 1918 largely remained a Polish-speaking region.

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Not a mention of the above decree of Frederic the Great in the German Wikipedia, however.

Language / 'Ciężko powiedzieć' (anglicism?) - is it a copy of the English 'hard to say'? [51]

Just a remark to the discussion. Personally, I find the expression "ciężko powiedzieć" clumsy, but not an anglicism at all. As the word "ciężko" has been rooted for long in other expressions of Polish like "ciężko mi się żyje" or "ciężkostrawny", it is natural that some people tend to transfer it into other expressions.

As for "mam z tym problem", applied in the context of some minor issues, it sounds rather pretentious, and it has certainly come into such usage under the influence of English. Some 20 yeras ago people would only use it when speaking about complex 'issues' like in "Mamy problem z naszym starszym synem' meaning some serious trouble they had with him. Then people started to use the word "problem" to describe minor, if not trivial, issues. This sounds really awful to speakers accustomed to the older meaning of the word 'problem' denouncing some 'more or less complex issue'.

Language / Meaning of the words: na północy/południu? [10]


Indeed, that must have been an Old Slavic word for 'north'. In Russians you say " s'ever' " as well. What is 'south' in Czech [in Russian it is 'youg']?

Language / Too many English words in the Polish language! [709]


On a side note: I like the expression 'a litlle flick on someone's nose' which obviosly corresponds to the Polish "dać komuś pstryczka w nos", but I wonder if putting 'the' before someone's name in it should be part of the idiom?

Language / Too many English words in the Polish language! [709]

Here is what I've found today on the site of the French quality paper "Le Figaro". The headline of one of their articles is: Breakfast à l'Élysée. And even if further down in the text they replace it with the proper French term 'petit déjeuner', the fact is that the bold letters of the headline cry this English word out in a purely French context. Quel scandale, mesdames et messieurs! But isn't it exactly the same thing as observed in the very specific use of the English term 'come-back' in the Polish language? Rien ne va plus dans ce monde de brutes!

Breakfast à l'Élysée
Tous les mardis, le chef de l'État reçoit les dirigeants de la majorité pour un petit déjeuner. Un théâtre d'échanges, d'affrontements et d'enjeux de pouvoir, qui s'est transformé au fil du temps en véritable séance de «coaching» de la majorité par le président. Un reflet du quinquennat depuis 2007.

C'est «the place to be». Là où il faut être. La grande réunion politique de la semaine. Celle où le président donne le la. Celle qui, dès l'automne 2007, consacra «l'hyperprésidence», quand ce petit déjeuner des dirigeants de la majorité,...

lefigaro.fr/mon-figaro/2011/04/20/10001-20110420ARTFIG00667-breakfast-a-l-elysee.php
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Voilà une veritable séance of "coaching" for some of the PF members ...

Language / Too many English words in the Polish language! [709]


'Wielopak' sounds quite nice, it even sounds nicer than 'zgrzewka' to me, 'multipak' sounds awful. Wielopak has the truly Polish 'wielo-' in it, as well as its other part 'pak' is rooted firmly in the language [see the verb: pakować or the nouns: pakunek, paczka]. What comes to mind is that some words become replaced by others in the language over time. A classic example might be the word 'browar' which replaced its older equivalent in Polish in the course of the 17th century. That former word was 'mielcuch' and in the texts of that century we can still see phrases using both such as this one in the sub-title of a book: "Browar albo mielcuch", which might suggest that not all readers were familiar with this new word of German [not English!] origin. In spite of the fact that the old Polish language purists might have well objected to the change, the new word has won over the old one with the result that today no one in Poland - except perhaps for some specialists - has no idea what the hell the word 'mielcuch' might have meant.

Language / Too many English words in the Polish language! [709]



It must be noted that quite a number of foreign words is used in the way which may be called in Polish as "użycie manierystyczne". The fact the they used a phrase like 'to będzie jej największy comeback' on Polish TV does not disturb in the slightest way an ordinary Polish speaker who, like me, has been living in Poland all his life, and all over this time has been very much against foreign words recklessly thrown into the language. A 'comeback' of someone is a very specific term for describing nothing more than a 'powrót na scenę znanego artysty lub wielkiej gwiazdy po dłuższej nieobecności w życiu kulturalnym'. There's nothing wrong with it, it just 'serves' as a particular dress in which dancers of cancan appear on the stage in the Moulin Rouge. No one uses it in everyday Polish, however, if they did, then they would not only sound pretentious, but extremely silly, indeed.


Contrary to using 'comeback' in a strictly specific context, I find the above just as moronic as you have found it.
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'Iwestor budowlany or 'firma budująca' [not 'budowlana'] would be a perfect Polish eqivalent of 'developer' as it is used of today. It sounds a bit clumsy, in my view, I would not expect a replacement to this very handy 'Polish' word.

Po polsku / Czy znacie jakieś "kultowe" Polskie filmy na Youtube? [21]

"Pan Tadeusz" jako film to rzeczywiście niezwykłe dzieło. Oddać w ten sposób poetycki geniusz Adama Mickiewicza na ekranie było wielkim osiągnięciem Andrzeja Wajdy. Oglądałem ten film kilka lat temu w kinie, a teraz całkiem niedawno ponownie w telewizji, i za każdym razem byłem pod wrażeniem. Jest w tym filmie jakaś niezwykła magia i lekkość, aczkolwiek całkiem inna niż magia i lekkość zawarta w literackim pierwowzorze.

News / Poland and UK linked by failure to report the news [4]


Isn't this one the only bunga-bunga party of Silvio that should really matter in France?

Language / Too many English words in the Polish language! [709]



I just wonder what it is exactly which "means something different than either of the two Polish words: zarządca [I would use 'zarzadzający' here, however, for example: zarządzający projektem] or 'kierownik'.

In some professional environments in Poland people would use the word 'coach', in some other people would not. I happen to be in one of those latter environments [psychology/therapy], and I constantly hear 'trener' for people doing 'szkolenia' to others, while I never hear 'coach'. As a true fact, I only have a vague idea why people should say 'coach', and I basically think they do it in posh business environments just in order to get more money for things which are in reality worth much less than they charge.

As for the term 'developer', it jumps out everywhere you turn your head. In the times when the influence of capitalism and the English language and was not so great as now, people would just say 'firma budowlana' which is basically what a developer is. Every one had not even been thinking of another term to replace it with as everyone was happy with the term they were using.

Po polsku / Młodzi polscy prozaicy - kogo polecacie? [66]


Ciekawe co też oznaczają owe "implementacyjne" :) ?. Naturalnie, 'implementacyjne' to określenie zrozumiałe, ale można też powiedzieć: 'plany wdrożeniowe/wdrożeń'. Co do odpoczynku, to czy nie lepiej zastosować "płodozmian", tj. po to by dać odpocząć przeciążonemu umysłowi, zająć się jakąś aktywnością fizyczną np. sportem albo pracą w ogrodzie albo też udać się na długi spacer?

Language / It's just semantics! - in Polish or otherwise [15]


I think its Polish meaning arises from the foreign meaning "exciting and unusual experience". In Polish the word describes an event at its utmost possible unpleasant sense: awantura is usually extremely exciting [it excites people engaged in it to their extremes] and very unusual [it's not what they expect every day or every week or every month]. The outcome of it is risky, emotionally or even physically, just as if in the result of an unpleasant adventure.

Language / Too many English words in the Polish language! [709]


You are right, we don't have any Slavic counterpart for "(za)meldować się". I think the Russians will say "registrirovat'sja" for that, so it would be a "western" word either.

What has come to my mind now is the word 'umbrella' in both languages. In Polish, it is 'parasol' [masculine] / 'parasolka' [feminine], obviosly of French origin. In Russian it is 'zont'ik' - sounds quite strange to me as a word of Slavic origin. In English, the word obviosly follows the French word "ombrelle" which is 'sunshade'.

Language / Too many English words in the Polish language! [709]


With this I wouldn't fully agree. Despite the fact that Leo Tolstoy's 'War and Peace' is half-written in French, the Russian language has Slavic words where we have "western" borrowings, whereas they have "foreign" words where we have Slavic ones. I can think of the names of the months at the moment since we have them truly Slavic, while the Russians have "western" ones. The same with the Bohemians: a friend of my was once appauled in Prague when they could not understand at the reception desk of a hotel that he was born in 'październik'; I happened to witness his "Anmeldung", so I told them "october" and everything became clear.

Language / It's just semantics! - in Polish or otherwise [15]


Indeed, in Polish it is a somewhat 'posh' word, only bloody intellectuals or real linguists use it when talking about something on TV; the rest of the audience is probably dismayed. Another of the kind is 'leksyka/leksykalny', and it is even worse than 'semantyka/semantyczny'. On the other hand 'logistyka/logistyczny' has made quite a career; but doesn't it mean anything more than the "simplistic" planowanie?

Language / Too many English words in the Polish language! [709]


Personally, I would associate it with a person's need to "reveal" to the world that you "know" the language rather than to an inferiority complex. Of course, it would apply to a language which is "fashionable" and when there is a chance that there are people around you who will appreciate how witty you are. It never happens to me with English since I always try to avoid to use a foreign-sounding words in Polish, trying to replace them with Slavic-origin synonyms [though I can never replace words like 'weekend', for that matter]. But it did happen to me with French when - after having passed a certain level in the language - I started to throw French expressions in my letters in English to my British friends. When I reached an even higher level in my knowledge of French, I stopped the practice naturally, thinking even that it was silly and a little childish. But that was not because of an ineriority complex since my French was all the time better than theirs!

Language / It's just semantics! - in Polish or otherwise [15]

I believe the word 'semantyczny', an assimilated word of foreign origin, is not that often used in Polish as are its Slavic synonyms such as 'znaczenie' or 'znaczeniowy'. "It's just semantics!" - I would translate as "... cokolwiek by to miało znaczyć" for the needs of everyday language or - in its more intellectual or sophisticated form that would be rendering precisely the sense of the English original: "To czysta semantyka!" or "To kwestia semantyki/semantyczna" as Mafketis said. 'Semantyka' is perceived as a rather specialized term in Polish. On the contrary, the term profilaktycznie has somehow slipped into general language. Unlike to its use in English, however, the word is never used in Polish in the context of birth control. People may say: profilaktycznie zażyłem dwie tabletki aspiryny [po to, aby się nie zaziębić], but they are unlikely to say: profilaktycznie biorę tabletki antykoncepcyjne.

UK, Ireland / John Drennan: "Poles in fear of starved Irish influx" [15]

Excellent, Magdalena! I have so recklessly thrown in the name "Polish" rather than "supposedly Polish" or for sure "non-British". But you know, this is how stereotypes are created. You read the Daily Mail one day, then you don't read it in a week's time when the good-natured crew of this highly reputable paper is so kind to clarify who the gentelman catching swans really was.

Anyway, I think I watched something on "horses starving by the sides of motorways in Ireland" on Polish TV quite some time before this article appeared in The Independent, so there is some chance that the journalist of the Newsweek Polska may have been inspired by the programme put on air by the guys who compose the contents of the news on Polish TV.

UK, Ireland / John Drennan: "Poles in fear of starved Irish influx" [15]


It seems very unlikely that the lack of an electronic chip required of Brussels could ever stop a starving Irish person from consuming the meat of a particular horse not having this chip. Let's not kid ourselves: the power of Brussels - and we all know it is great - would never be so overhelming as to make a hungry person supress their basic biological instincts!

I shall remind you that Polish immigrants in the UK who were in the habit of consuming British swans for supper did that in spite of the lack of suitable electronic chips on them. When one is hungry, one is simply reluctunt to think of the regulations imposed by Brussels.

News / Santander buys the third largest bank in Poland (Bank Zachodni) [11]

Indeed, they did. Today it is most interesting to read what Gerry Byrne, the director of AIB for the region of Central and Eastern Europe, had told the daily RZECZPOSPOLITA on the matter on the 17 December 2009. - We don't want to sell BZ WBK. We own assets in the US, Britain and Poland, but our intention is clear: we will keep our assets in Poland. First of all, we will keep BZ WBK since it is our most valuable foreign investment and at the same time a highly profitable one. The bank has effective capital, good liquitidy and builds up the strength of AIB. The bank is a very important part of our whole group and crucial from the perspective of the future profitability of the group.

- It would have been much more dificult for us to regain our financial strength without BZ WBK - said the manager in his interview of more than a year ago. - But you have to remember about this principle: never say never - he underlined, adding that it is impossible to predict market conditions in a few years' time.

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Were these market conditions so unfavorable for AIB or was the Irish bank so weak that it had no choice but to sell its Polish assets to survive?

Travel / Pics of Warsaw by the Guardian's David Levene [107]


It may look interesting for a Brit who has never been to Poland, for those who live in Poland or in Warsaw it is an ordinary picture, a 'random snapshot' as you were kind to say.

Travel / Pics of Warsaw by the Guardian's David Levene [107]


What a most derisive comment towards people who often have nothing to put into their dining pot, Monia! Incidentally, I also live in Warsaw and in my professional work I often come across people who happen to starve in this strangely beatiful city. But it is very likely that attorneys in law, such as you, would never have a chance to see any one of them in their whole life. You are obviously on the "posh" side of Warsaw life, but please show some respect of an 'adwokat' towards those who are not. Since you are noisily demanding more pictures of the bright side of the Polish capital in The Guardian, one might expect you will be toning your judgment of the people who do not use any newspapers exept for covering themselves with it during a chilly night. Simply disgusting!

Language / Perfective vs Imperfective - grammar [150]

Very often, to be honest, there is no difference between the perfective and the imperfective aspect: 'koncert spodobał mi się' and 'koncert podobał mi się' are virtually the same. But often there is such a difference, for example when we are describing repetitive actions: "codziennie znajdowałem jakieś pieniądze na ulicy ..." means that I performed a perfective action every day to pick it up, but I can add that: "... i dzisiaj także je znalazłem" using the perfective aspect, since 'dzisiaj' introduces a one-time event.