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Polish priest caught in hand-of-God action on train in Tri-City area. [39]
About facts being distorted by propaganda
What propaganda do you speak of? Earlier in response to my post you wrote - If the Catholic Church never killed anyone, never tortured anyone, never sent children to fight their wars, never molested a child[..]. You can listen to whomever you like. However the CC church done nothing of the sort. I dare say you don't know what you are talking about.
Sorry I skipped most of what you wrote there about popes as all that have no bearing on the argument were are having here.
Yes it does because we were debating that the church ought to admit it's own misdeeds before directing what a woman that they've never met should do or not do with their body. How is the Catholic church going to call 'gay marraige' the devil's work when their own priests are having butt sex and fondling altar boys? How is the church going to tell people not to have sex outside marriage when their own clergy is having both male and female lovers as well as illegitimate children? How come they are so against gay people, many of whom want to be included in the Catholic church, yet they won't admit they had a few queer popes. I'm sure you've heard of Senior Vatican priest - Krzysztof Charamsa? There's lots of gay priests - estimates go from 23% to 58% of priests are gay with the highest percentage being young priests. I recommend you read some works by James Martin, SJ (means Society of Jesus by the way - aka Jesuits) or Rev. Donald B. Cozzens on this topic.
Once the Catholic Church comes clean - as they have in the past with other events like their role in killing Protestants, admit their sins, and pray for forgiveness perhaps then they will show to be a better example.
Pope John Paul II was great in this regard because he at least came forth and admitted the sins of the Catholic Church and apologized for them - some of these include the 4th crusade attack on Constantinople, not giving a crap during the holocaust, burning Protestants at the stake, executing Jan Hus, violations of women's rights, AND APOLOGIZING FOR THE WAY GALILEO WAS TREATED - does that fall into your category of 'The Church never did any of those things?' Well, if they didn't then why would Pope John Paul II apologize for them?
John Paul II was also one of the first to apologize for the Church's sex abuse in 2001 - this was I believe actually the first email the pope had sent. He apologized for the way missionaries behaved in Colonial times in China in that same email.
How can you say the Catholic church never did any of those things - murder, rape, molestation, children fighting wars? That's paramount to saying the Holocaust never happened. The Inquisition, the Children's Crusade, the forced baptism of Jews (something that Poland was the first to make illegal) are all historical fact. Perhaps some 'propaganda' overestimated the numbers, but that doesn't mean that these events never took place. If they didn't why would our Polish pope apologize for them? Even the Inquisition's own people later admitted what they did. Perhaps when Galileo stated the Church was constantly harassing him and forcing him into trial it was propaganda too? Perhaps Martin Luther broke away from the Church because the whole story of selling indulgences was that propaganda as well? I recommend you do some reading on these subjects and not just believe what you want to believe and simply ignore things that are contrary to your view.
It's pretty much fact that Bishops in the US knew that priests were engaging in sexual abuse but would just cover up the evidence, not report it to police, or simply move the priest to another area - instead of removing them from the Catholic church altogether.
percentage of pedophiles in priesthood is lower than in any other profession of public trust that is dealing with children.
According to the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops' Office of Child and Youth Protection and independent studies commissioned by the BISHOPS in 2012: There were more than 6,905 accused priests since 1950, there were more than 16,463 victims identified to date, although there is no national database and a total of $2.5 billion in settlements and therapy bills for victims, attorneys fees and costs to care for priests pulled out of ministry from 2004 to 2011.
I haven't heard of the Chicago Teacher's Union or the Department of Education having to pay out tens of millions to abused students - rather we here of one two, usually pretty hot female teachers, who slept with some 8th grader or freshman who couldn't keep his mouth shut. I don't know about you, but there's a couple High school teachers I would've loved to hook up with.
I've never heard of 6,900 teachers or coaches being accused of sexual abuse since the 1950's - and there are far more teachers and coaches than priests in the US. There are currently about 38,000 priests in the US and about 3.7 million grade school and high school full time teachers. Remember, that earlier statement by the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops stated there were 6,905 priests accused since 1950.
The statistics are actually extremely high - and even some Catholic sources admit this - boz.religionnews.com/2014/01/09/startling-statistics/
cbsnews.com/news/vatican-reveals-how-many-priests-defrocked-for-sex-abuse-since-2004/ -
The Vatican revealed Tuesday that over the past decade, it has defrocked 848 priests who raped or molested children and sanctioned another 2,572 with lesser penalties, providing the first ever breakdown of how it handled the more than 3,400 cases of abuse reported to the Holy See since 2004.americancatholic.org/news/clergysexabuse/johnjaycns.asp
Catholic News Service - About 4 percent of U.S. priests ministering from 1950 to 2002 were accused of sex abuse with a minor, according to the first comprehensive national study of the issue. The study said that 4,392 clergymen-almost all priests-were accused of abusing 10,667 people, with 75 percent of the incidents taking place between 1960 and 1984. This goes up to 2002 - a decade less than the study listed above. Nonetheless, still a shocking amount.
Let's compare that with grade school teachers - according to some source, 'sexual abuse committed by teachers' is estimated as 3.5% to 5% - however they are considering 'flirting' as sexual abuse.
nytimes.com/1995/05/21/nyregion/teacher-student-sex-said-to-be-not-unusual.html
t Ms. Shakeshaft's study quoted findings that up to 5 percent of teachers engage in some form of sexual abuse of students, from inappropriate verbal flirtation to intercourse.
Here's a joke for you: What's the difference between acne and a priest? Acne waits till your 13 to come on your face.You obviously don't know history - or chose to disregard it. I'm assuming you've never cared to read about the Inquistion or the various married, pedophile and homosexual popes. Perhaps you didn't know the Catholic church paid $2 billion dollars to settle with victims of sexual abuse? Of course the children's crusade and the burning of protestants never happened right, despite the Pope's apology for it? There's even a great account of Polish soldiers fighting under Napoleon breaking into a Dominican monastery with the monks and priests saying they did not torture people there. Nonetheless, the soldiers found underground torture chambers.
I am Roman Catholic and I'd argue that I probably know the Bible and church history better than you do. I went to a Catholic grade school, Jesuit high school for 2 years (public the other 2 years), and a Jesuit college - there was no escaping Catholicism and I chose to go to these schools it wasn't forced upon me. Also, I studied theology, the Bible, and the role of the Catholic church throughout European history on my own because these are topics that interest me. Just because I am a Catholic doesn't mean I can't say that we did some pretty messed up things. It's time to admit it and move on. Covering up priests' sexual abuses isn't the way to go. At least our last pope admitted it and finally the church is gradually moving in the right direction - slowly but at least it's better than it was a decade or two ago.
The point is, the Catholic church really needs to think of how they're going to increase the number of parishioners and priests and stop alienating people. Many people want to even attend Church but they don't because of the Church's views on gays, abortion, women, etc. which I find very hypocritical because they won't admit some of the same mistakes that their own people have made. There's even a lot of women or married people who want to become priests but they can't with the Catholic church so they join another organization.
Don't forget, the whole abortion issue is the reason why so many women walked out of Mass in Poland.
money don't make a happy all around child. A great couple does.
You're right. Money does however purchase diapers, books, school supplies, transportation to get to school, a college education, clothes for school, etc. Love of a child and a great couple won't make those things magically appear.
little head rather then your brain at least be a man enough to face the consequences.
Well, that's why I wrap it up - but condoms aren't 100% effective. I've had one tear on more than one occasion. Good luck telling a young male to be totally chaste and wait till marriage. Would you marry someone without finding out if they're good in bed or not and if they're sexually compatible with you? I sure wouldn't.