boletus
11 Sep 2012
History / An American studying medicine in the PRL 1978-1985: my story [142]
Oops! I agree. Mods: please erase my last posts.
Oops! I agree. Mods: please erase my last posts.
boletus
11 Sep 2012
History / An American studying medicine in the PRL 1978-1985: my story [142]
From some Belgian source (I forgot to copy URL)
What I also remember, this prompted the mine owners to negotiate new contracts with other Mediterranean countries: Greece, Spain, N. African countries. Slowly recruitment of non-ECC natives stopped, although some exceptions still existed until 1970s for Polish experts, such as mechanics. The Belgians feared communists, so they made sure not to recruit communists from Italy. North Italy seemed safe in this respect.
It is no secret that just after the war a lot of miners in Belgium were Polish. And ironically their fellow workmen were German POW.
From some Belgian source (I forgot to copy URL)
In 1947, after about 46,000 German POW were to be released from the mines, the active sustained recruitment of Italian workers started in earnest. In the period 1946-1949, over 77,000 Italian workers would arrive through active recruitment in Belgium. In addition to the Italian workers, the management of the coal mines recruited over 23,000 new miners amongst the Eastern-European ‘displaced persons’ in occupied Western German territory in order to counter the shortages of labour resulting from the return of the German POW’s.
In 1949-1950 foreign recruitment was shortly put to a halt, as the result of a cyclical recession and pressure from the trade unions. It would be taken up again in 1951. Between 1951 and 1953 in total over 44,000 (new) Italians were attracted to the Belgian - mainly Walloon - mines. In the period 1952-1955 foreign recruitment was in principle again put to a halt - although there was some lenience for the mines in 1952 and 1953
- to be reinstalled in May 1955. In the period 1955-1957 over 20,000 Italian miners came to Belgium.
In August 1956 a mining accident at Marcinelle caused the death of 262 miners, of whom 136 were Italian. These incidents prompted Italy to demand better working conditions for the Italian guest workers in Belgium.
In 1949-1950 foreign recruitment was shortly put to a halt, as the result of a cyclical recession and pressure from the trade unions. It would be taken up again in 1951. Between 1951 and 1953 in total over 44,000 (new) Italians were attracted to the Belgian - mainly Walloon - mines. In the period 1952-1955 foreign recruitment was in principle again put to a halt - although there was some lenience for the mines in 1952 and 1953
- to be reinstalled in May 1955. In the period 1955-1957 over 20,000 Italian miners came to Belgium.
In August 1956 a mining accident at Marcinelle caused the death of 262 miners, of whom 136 were Italian. These incidents prompted Italy to demand better working conditions for the Italian guest workers in Belgium.
What I also remember, this prompted the mine owners to negotiate new contracts with other Mediterranean countries: Greece, Spain, N. African countries. Slowly recruitment of non-ECC natives stopped, although some exceptions still existed until 1970s for Polish experts, such as mechanics. The Belgians feared communists, so they made sure not to recruit communists from Italy. North Italy seemed safe in this respect.
boletus
11 Sep 2012
Life / Do Poles drink before noon? [95]
I somehow distinctly remember early morning habit of (some) Mediterranean farmers: pastis drinking on the way to work. A shot of Ricard (merged with Pernod in 1970s). A magic of water (5:1), turning your amber coloured Ricard into milky-greenish liquid.
I somehow distinctly remember early morning habit of (some) Mediterranean farmers: pastis drinking on the way to work. A shot of Ricard (merged with Pernod in 1970s). A magic of water (5:1), turning your amber coloured Ricard into milky-greenish liquid.
boletus
11 Sep 2012
History / An American studying medicine in the PRL 1978-1985: my story [142]
This is what you may want to listen to one day, on a visit to "Archiwum Historii Mówionej".
[The main objective of Archiwum Historii Mówionej, Oral History Archive is commemorating the outgoing generation. To this end we engage various communities and collaborators from all over Poland to record and develop oral histories. ]
Projekt [Project]: Zapomniani świadkowie XX wieku [Forgotten witnesses of XX c.]
Wywiad przeprowadził/a [Interviewer]: Piotr Retecki
Sygnatura nagrania [Record signature]: AHM_1140
Miejsce nagrania [Recording place]: Mieroszów
Data nagrania [Recording date]: 13.01.2009
Czas nagrania [Recording time]: 02:06
Język nagrania [Language]: polski [Polish]
Nagranie do odsłuchania w Czytelni Multimedialnej Domu Spotkań z Historią
[Recording available at Multimedia Ewading Room, History Meeting House, dsh.waw.pl]
audiohistoria.pl/web/index.php/swiadkowie/nagrania/id/2327/from/ahm/idwyk/148
Opis nagrania [Description]:
Relations - Poles in France duing interbellum: customs, occupational structure.
Working class social structure, dominated by Poles employed in mining industry of North-East France, a region with the greatest density of Poles.
Living conditions: life in the mining settlements.
German occupation in France during 1940-1944: the activities of guerrilla organizations, lack of repressions typical of the German occupation of Poland - the round-ups, mass executions, ghettos, etc...
Agitation of the Polish authorities to return to Poland after 1945. The reasons for return: longing for the country that they left as children, agitation of authorities declaring that Poland is now a "paradise for all".
Living conditions: worm-infested (bed-bugs?) flats, although furnished by proprty left behind by the expelled Germans.
Social relations found in Lower Silesia: the presence of Poles from the Eastern Borderlands, France, central Poland, Westphalie, and Jewish, Greek and a large German community.
The attitude of the "French" to the contemporary reality: initial approval of the communist system by willingly joining the PPR and PPS, and then PZPR, MO, ORMO, UB, and Corps of Homeland Security.
Dissapointment associated with significantly poorer living conditions and lower cultural level of Wałbrzych land compared with Nord / Pas-de-Calais, repressions by the authorities for maintaining contact with relatives remaining in France, social conflicts with strongly anti-Communist groups, attempts to escape to France, service in the Polish People's Army in the years 1948-1980.
========
Adding what I remember about my father-in-law. He was taken from a street-round-up in Lublin and sent to Germany to work at the age of 17. After the war, he was recruited by Belgians - alongside other 23,000 new Eastern-European miners - 'displaced persons' from occupied Western German territory. He married another DP, came back to Poland in around 1960. When I met him his was so much anti-communist that his wife lived in constant fear of him being arrested due his uncontrollable mouth.
It didn't take long for Gierek to rise through the ranks, and in 1957 he was appointed as the regional head of the Communist party. He set about his task with ideological zeal, approving grandiose projects like the Spodek and Park of Culture and Recreation in Chorzów.
That was about time of intensive communist agitation among Polish miners in Belgium and France.
I still do not fathom why they decided to move to Poland. After all, moving from Belgium or France to the PRL in the years 1945-50 was a fairly drastic move.
For sure there were some "socialist idealists" between them. But the rest?
For sure there were some "socialist idealists" between them. But the rest?
This is what you may want to listen to one day, on a visit to "Archiwum Historii Mówionej".
[The main objective of Archiwum Historii Mówionej, Oral History Archive is commemorating the outgoing generation. To this end we engage various communities and collaborators from all over Poland to record and develop oral histories. ]
Projekt [Project]: Zapomniani świadkowie XX wieku [Forgotten witnesses of XX c.]
Wywiad przeprowadził/a [Interviewer]: Piotr Retecki
Sygnatura nagrania [Record signature]: AHM_1140
Miejsce nagrania [Recording place]: Mieroszów
Data nagrania [Recording date]: 13.01.2009
Czas nagrania [Recording time]: 02:06
Język nagrania [Language]: polski [Polish]
Nagranie do odsłuchania w Czytelni Multimedialnej Domu Spotkań z Historią
[Recording available at Multimedia Ewading Room, History Meeting House, dsh.waw.pl]
audiohistoria.pl/web/index.php/swiadkowie/nagrania/id/2327/from/ahm/idwyk/148
Opis nagrania [Description]:
Relations - Poles in France duing interbellum: customs, occupational structure.
Working class social structure, dominated by Poles employed in mining industry of North-East France, a region with the greatest density of Poles.
Living conditions: life in the mining settlements.
German occupation in France during 1940-1944: the activities of guerrilla organizations, lack of repressions typical of the German occupation of Poland - the round-ups, mass executions, ghettos, etc...
Agitation of the Polish authorities to return to Poland after 1945. The reasons for return: longing for the country that they left as children, agitation of authorities declaring that Poland is now a "paradise for all".
Living conditions: worm-infested (bed-bugs?) flats, although furnished by proprty left behind by the expelled Germans.
Social relations found in Lower Silesia: the presence of Poles from the Eastern Borderlands, France, central Poland, Westphalie, and Jewish, Greek and a large German community.
The attitude of the "French" to the contemporary reality: initial approval of the communist system by willingly joining the PPR and PPS, and then PZPR, MO, ORMO, UB, and Corps of Homeland Security.
Dissapointment associated with significantly poorer living conditions and lower cultural level of Wałbrzych land compared with Nord / Pas-de-Calais, repressions by the authorities for maintaining contact with relatives remaining in France, social conflicts with strongly anti-Communist groups, attempts to escape to France, service in the Polish People's Army in the years 1948-1980.
========
Adding what I remember about my father-in-law. He was taken from a street-round-up in Lublin and sent to Germany to work at the age of 17. After the war, he was recruited by Belgians - alongside other 23,000 new Eastern-European miners - 'displaced persons' from occupied Western German territory. He married another DP, came back to Poland in around 1960. When I met him his was so much anti-communist that his wife lived in constant fear of him being arrested due his uncontrollable mouth.
It didn't take long for Gierek to rise through the ranks, and in 1957 he was appointed as the regional head of the Communist party. He set about his task with ideological zeal, approving grandiose projects like the Spodek and Park of Culture and Recreation in Chorzów.
That was about time of intensive communist agitation among Polish miners in Belgium and France.
boletus
11 Sep 2012
History / An American studying medicine in the PRL 1978-1985: my story [142]
Nice explanation Ziemowit, but it does not change anything in my previous statements. All I was saying was this, more or less:
The word "menu" - as applied to serving food - in Polish means "karta dań", "spis potraw" or "jadłospis". The word "menu" itself came from French (not English), its pronunciation has been altered to "meni", with the accent on the last syllable. In this sense it existed in Polish for many years before WWII and it was, as I remember it , also used in some Polish restaurants during PRL.
It is not unusual that loan words change their meaning significantly. We probably have some threads about it around.
[However, the word "menu" in a sense of a computer list of items or functions came from English. I do not know how it is pronounced by Polish computer users.]
pl.wiktionary.org/wiki/menu
Isn't it that in Poland the word "menu" is used in the French sense of "carte" rather than in the French sense of "menu"?
Nice explanation Ziemowit, but it does not change anything in my previous statements. All I was saying was this, more or less:
The word "menu" - as applied to serving food - in Polish means "karta dań", "spis potraw" or "jadłospis". The word "menu" itself came from French (not English), its pronunciation has been altered to "meni", with the accent on the last syllable. In this sense it existed in Polish for many years before WWII and it was, as I remember it , also used in some Polish restaurants during PRL.
It is not unusual that loan words change their meaning significantly. We probably have some threads about it around.
[However, the word "menu" in a sense of a computer list of items or functions came from English. I do not know how it is pronounced by Polish computer users.]
pl.wiktionary.org/wiki/menu
boletus
10 Sep 2012
History / An American studying medicine in the PRL 1978-1985: my story [142]
My father-in-law was mad at himself as hell. Nevertheless it is worth pointing out that mines were a privilege class in PRL. After he contracted pneumoconiosis they would send him to a sanatorium every year for few weeks. He never recovered.
"Pneumoniocosis constitutes 50% of all diagnosed occupational deseases in Katowice, and 88% in Wałbrzych."
I know that the Polish miners who returned to Poland after the war bitterly regretted that move.
My father-in-law was mad at himself as hell. Nevertheless it is worth pointing out that mines were a privilege class in PRL. After he contracted pneumoconiosis they would send him to a sanatorium every year for few weeks. He never recovered.
"Pneumoniocosis constitutes 50% of all diagnosed occupational deseases in Katowice, and 88% in Wałbrzych."
boletus
10 Sep 2012
History / An American studying medicine in the PRL 1978-1985: my story [142]
He did. "He emigrated as a child to France and worked with miners in France and Belgium."
"He dressed well, he could behave in a drawing-room and at the conference table like any other normal man."
Gierek also worked in Belgian mines before the war - though I do not know whether he spoke French.
He did. "He emigrated as a child to France and worked with miners in France and Belgium."
"He dressed well, he could behave in a drawing-room and at the conference table like any other normal man."
boletus
10 Sep 2012
History / An American studying medicine in the PRL 1978-1985: my story [142]
That ones two. :-)
But they had to go into hiding later on.
The Bourgeoisie perhaps?
That ones two. :-)
But they had to go into hiding later on.
boletus
10 Sep 2012
History / An American studying medicine in the PRL 1978-1985: my story [142]
I already posted the link in #99. See the pictures of two menus from Bristol Hotel is printed in Russian, Polish and French. Yes, it was year 1906, Warsaw was still ruled by Russian.
I wonder if it was used pre-war in the posher places in Warsaw?
I already posted the link in #99. See the pictures of two menus from Bristol Hotel is printed in Russian, Polish and French. Yes, it was year 1906, Warsaw was still ruled by Russian.
boletus
10 Sep 2012
History / An American studying medicine in the PRL 1978-1985: my story [142]
Funny you said that since I actually married a daughter of a miner from Liege who emigrated to Wałbrzych. She speaks fluent French. But I had in mind the pre-war socialites, artists, students, restaurant owners, waiters, etc.
In the Wałbrzych region quite a few actually - miners who lived and worked in Belgium and France and who returned to Poland, lured by PRL promises.
Funny you said that since I actually married a daughter of a miner from Liege who emigrated to Wałbrzych. She speaks fluent French. But I had in mind the pre-war socialites, artists, students, restaurant owners, waiters, etc.
boletus
10 Sep 2012
Language / how to say drum in polish? [7]
But this is fun!
I taką sobie myśl wyodrębnię,
Że ja ma bęben i na nim bębnię,
Więc sobie w końcu to umożebnię,
aby pobębnić na zamku w Dębnie.
But this is fun!
I taką sobie myśl wyodrębnię,
Że ja ma bęben i na nim bębnię,
Więc sobie w końcu to umożebnię,
aby pobębnić na zamku w Dębnie.
Dêbno Castle
boletus
10 Sep 2012
History / An American studying medicine in the PRL 1978-1985: my story [142]
I somehow remember the word "menu" adorning "bill of fares" of many restaurants during PRL, supposedly pronounced in somewhat mispronounced French - but definitely not menoo, as many Poles would say it today. There were some people left still speaking French during PRL (my mom did), and this word did not come to Polish from English, but French, you know... Some better restaurants called it "Karta dań" instead.
And how this was done before WWII let be best described by the blog Sto smaków.
stosmakow.blox.pl/tagi_b/1249/kuchnia-polska.html
Search for the word menu, and you will find many good examples, in three languages, French included.
I somehow remember the word "menu" adorning "bill of fares" of many restaurants during PRL, supposedly pronounced in somewhat mispronounced French - but definitely not menoo, as many Poles would say it today. There were some people left still speaking French during PRL (my mom did), and this word did not come to Polish from English, but French, you know... Some better restaurants called it "Karta dań" instead.
And how this was done before WWII let be best described by the blog Sto smaków.
stosmakow.blox.pl/tagi_b/1249/kuchnia-polska.html
Search for the word menu, and you will find many good examples, in three languages, French included.
boletus
10 Sep 2012
Genealogy / Coats of arms of Polish cities [51]
Krynica Zdrój.
That's the manly image. :-)
Krynica Zdrój.
That's the manly image. :-)
krynica.png
boletus
10 Sep 2012
Genealogy / Coats of arms of Polish cities [51]
Yes, but only on Pawian's rendition.
Yes, they were thinking hard how to represent the motto "nie kijem go, to pałką"; meaning - "inaczej, w inny sposób, ale z tym samym skutkiem". In English: If not (hit him) with a stick, then with a bludgeon"; or "in other way, but with the same effect".
So, they they came up with the key and with the sword, and hence with saints Peter and Paul.
[There is not a single seed of truth in it, but it sounds nicely, doesn't it?]
Yes, but only on Pawian's rendition.
Its coat is as dull as Krakow`s
Yes, they were thinking hard how to represent the motto "nie kijem go, to pałką"; meaning - "inaczej, w inny sposób, ale z tym samym skutkiem". In English: If not (hit him) with a stick, then with a bludgeon"; or "in other way, but with the same effect".
So, they they came up with the key and with the sword, and hence with saints Peter and Paul.
[There is not a single seed of truth in it, but it sounds nicely, doesn't it?]
syrenek.jpg
syrenek2.jpg
syrenek3.jpg
syrenek4.jpg
boletus
9 Sep 2012
Language / How to say, "let's go!" in Polish [16]
If Piotrek is a volleyball player I might cheer him "Asa, Piotrek, asa!", where "as" stands for "ace". And the cheers are most often rhymed - as entire schools try come with new original cheers for a class, a school or a town team.
I liked this one, which appeared in one banner in London Olympic: "Wio, Myszata!" - a private cheer of family of Iwona Matkowska, a wrestler in 48 kg category. All Poles know what "wio!" means; "myszata" might mean "a girl with mousie hair colour", or something. A private joke. The effect was comical. She loved it! :-)
If Piotrek is a volleyball player I might cheer him "Asa, Piotrek, asa!", where "as" stands for "ace". And the cheers are most often rhymed - as entire schools try come with new original cheers for a class, a school or a town team.
I liked this one, which appeared in one banner in London Olympic: "Wio, Myszata!" - a private cheer of family of Iwona Matkowska, a wrestler in 48 kg category. All Poles know what "wio!" means; "myszata" might mean "a girl with mousie hair colour", or something. A private joke. The effect was comical. She loved it! :-)
boletus
9 Sep 2012
Genealogy / Coats of arms of Polish cities [51]
In Poznań there is the term "zielone śledzie" (green herrings). Originally in vinegar sauce, nowadays anything you want: salsa, tomato, etc. Basically: first fried, then marinated.
fried herring and then marinated in vinegar with onions
In Poznań there is the term "zielone śledzie" (green herrings). Originally in vinegar sauce, nowadays anything you want: salsa, tomato, etc. Basically: first fried, then marinated.
boletus
9 Sep 2012
Travel / How quickly does the sun set in Poland? [12]
She may mean civil (or nautical, or astronomical) evening twilight = the time between sunset and "civil dusk"; that is when geometrical center of the sun reaches 6 degrees below horizon.
(There are three diffrerent measures: civil, nautical and astronomical)
The evening twilight depends on the date and lattitude of the observer. In the Arctic and Antarctic regions, twilight (if there is any) can last for several hours.
September 1, 2012
Toronto, Canada: Civil twilight ends at 2022 hours, sunset 1952; difference 30 minutes
Warsaw, Poland: Civil twilight ends at 1958 hours, sunset 1923; difference 35 minutes
See this page timeanddate.com/worldclock/sunrise.html
(select all columns)
She may mean civil (or nautical, or astronomical) evening twilight = the time between sunset and "civil dusk"; that is when geometrical center of the sun reaches 6 degrees below horizon.
(There are three diffrerent measures: civil, nautical and astronomical)
The evening twilight depends on the date and lattitude of the observer. In the Arctic and Antarctic regions, twilight (if there is any) can last for several hours.
September 1, 2012
Toronto, Canada: Civil twilight ends at 2022 hours, sunset 1952; difference 30 minutes
Warsaw, Poland: Civil twilight ends at 1958 hours, sunset 1923; difference 35 minutes
See this page timeanddate.com/worldclock/sunrise.html
(select all columns)
boletus
8 Sep 2012
News / Józef Szaniawski, - Tragic death of patriot from Poland [12]
That's only some generic insinuation by Polonius3.
Under the comments to that nasty article in "wPolityce" there are two following entries:
Filip Frąckowiak (80.239.242.***) 5 września, 1:57
(Well, here everything is already known: "the ruskis". I am asking politely to show respect to us and to seriousness of the situation in which we found ourselves now. I think I have the right to expect it from Jacek Karnowski)
Filip Frąckowiak-Szaniawski (80.239.242.***) 5 września, 2:04
Filip Frąckowiak, a journalist, is a son of Halina Frąckowiak and Józef Szaniawski.
That's only some generic insinuation by Polonius3.
Under the comments to that nasty article in "wPolityce" there are two following entries:
Filip Frąckowiak (80.239.242.***) 5 września, 1:57
no u was już wiadomo: "ruscy" Uprzejmie proszę o uszanowanie nas i powagi sytuacji w jakiej się znaleźliśmy. Od Jacka Karnowskiego myślę, że mam prawo tego oczekiwać.
(Well, here everything is already known: "the ruskis". I am asking politely to show respect to us and to seriousness of the situation in which we found ourselves now. I think I have the right to expect it from Jacek Karnowski)
Filip Frąckowiak-Szaniawski (80.239.242.***) 5 września, 2:04
Filip Frąckowiak, a journalist, is a son of Halina Frąckowiak and Józef Szaniawski.
boletus
8 Sep 2012
News / Józef Szaniawski, - Tragic death of patriot from Poland [12]
- wPolityce.pl
You must be really mad, Polonius3, joining the idiots like those in "wPolityce". So find yourself the biggest possible mallet and ... you know what to do next.
Some comments to the above:
- another victim of a serial "suicider". ... peace to his soul. Let's hope that's the truth comes to light
- I could not say whether he slipped or fainted but I saw him falling down. This was shocking, so you idiots hit youseself in your heads [with heavy objects] and do not write such crap here
A RMF FM reporter has determined that there is probably no witness of the accident. The tourists who notified TOPR saw only the falling body of a man.
Some are wondering whether Szaniawski didn't share the fate of Kukliński's two sons, both of whom died in mysterious cirucmstances.
This death, the circumstances, the context are unbelievable. Again, questions abound how was it possible - likewise many other questions of recent years, especially since the Smolensk tragedy.Again, there were no witnesses ...
- wPolityce.pl
You must be really mad, Polonius3, joining the idiots like those in "wPolityce". So find yourself the biggest possible mallet and ... you know what to do next.
On Tuesday morning there was a phone call to Tatra Voluntary Rescue Service in Zakopane (TOPR) from a climber, who informed a rescuer on duty that he saw a man falling down in vicinity of Åšwinica Peak [off a cliff in the direction of the Valley of Five Ponds - other source]. Due to bad weather conditions the TOPR's helicopter had trouble starting. After paramedics arrived at the place of the accident they immediately began to resuscitate the man [which lasted almost one hour - other source]. At one point, they managed to restore the heart beat, but then it stopped again. The tourist died.
...
- This is a difficult trail, located at an altitude of 2,000 m above sea level. There are many accidents here - says Jan Krzysztof, Head of TOPR in Zakopane.
...
- This is a difficult trail, located at an altitude of 2,000 m above sea level. There are many accidents here - says Jan Krzysztof, Head of TOPR in Zakopane.
Some comments to the above:
- another victim of a serial "suicider". ... peace to his soul. Let's hope that's the truth comes to light
- I could not say whether he slipped or fainted but I saw him falling down. This was shocking, so you idiots hit youseself in your heads [with heavy objects] and do not write such crap here
- The accident took place on Tuesday around 11:00 am. According to TOPR rescuers Szaniawski probably slipped on traverse of Blue Crag, on the trail that connects Åšwinica with Zawrat and fell from height of about 40-50 meters off the cliff to the valley under the Wheel.
The TOPR helicopter reached the place only after the third trial; the task was difficult due to low ceiling of clouds and fog. Szaniawski was being resuscitated - unsuccessfully - by paramedics who were just passing the area of the accident. This is yet another fatal accident in Tatra here. Only in August two people died in the area of Blue Trail.
The TOPR helicopter reached the place only after the third trial; the task was difficult due to low ceiling of clouds and fog. Szaniawski was being resuscitated - unsuccessfully - by paramedics who were just passing the area of the accident. This is yet another fatal accident in Tatra here. Only in August two people died in the area of Blue Trail.
A RMF FM reporter has determined that there is probably no witness of the accident. The tourists who notified TOPR saw only the falling body of a man.
boletus
7 Sep 2012
USA, Canada / Who is better informed, the expat or the Polonia crowd? [144]
And this is exactly for the language like yours that I do not buy or read "piśmidła" distributed for free in GTA by a hateful of North American "pismaki/buraki" of Polish extraction. Not only they are good for nothing but advertising food and real estate, not only they are boring and below any acceptable intelligence standard to be called a newspaper, but they also use the PROPAGANDA language from the old PRL times, which you supposedly hate so much. You are now one of them Polonius3 - a master of commie-like propaganda methods. Congratulations!
Just compare:
"It will be a great day for Poland and Polonia when Donald T. is led away in handcuffs" - Polonius3.
"Each provocateur or a madman who dares to raise a hand against the people's rule, be sure that that hand will be chopped off by the people's power." - Cyrankiewicz
"Solidarity leader Piotr Duda said on TVN24 on Saturday he would recommend to the trade union’s authorities to join an anti-government march in Warsaw on September 29. He said Solidarity would cooperate with all groups who want the current government to land in the trash bin of history. Its motto will be: 'Wake up, Poland!'" - Polonius3
"Be vigilant against the enemy of the nation!" - PRL propaganda
"There is a saying that every country has the kind of government it deserves. If that is true then Poles must like or at least tolerate the empty slogans of the bland, don't-rock-the-boat Tusk clique and all its hand-washes-hand connections and old-boy networks in the business, media and, in many cases, gangster underworld. - Polonius3
"Stonka ziemniaczana - pasiasty dywersant." ("Colorado potato beetle - a striped saboteur.") - PRL propaganda
"To the foaming-at-the-mouth critics of IV RP, do you really believe corruption and non-transparnet behind-the-scenes dealings should be ignored or swept under the rug. Or should they be tackled head on? PiS tried to do that by then it was too late." - Polonius3
"Wzmożona kontrola dźwignią społecznego zaufania" ("Increased public control - a lever for social trust") - propaganda PRL
Beacuase Polonians are not bamboozled by glib, slick and slippery tricky Don, a true mafia don in white gloves.
It will be a great day for Poland and Polonia when Donald T. is led away in handcuffs.
It will be a great day for Poland and Polonia when Donald T. is led away in handcuffs.
And this is exactly for the language like yours that I do not buy or read "piśmidła" distributed for free in GTA by a hateful of North American "pismaki/buraki" of Polish extraction. Not only they are good for nothing but advertising food and real estate, not only they are boring and below any acceptable intelligence standard to be called a newspaper, but they also use the PROPAGANDA language from the old PRL times, which you supposedly hate so much. You are now one of them Polonius3 - a master of commie-like propaganda methods. Congratulations!
Just compare:
"It will be a great day for Poland and Polonia when Donald T. is led away in handcuffs" - Polonius3.
"Each provocateur or a madman who dares to raise a hand against the people's rule, be sure that that hand will be chopped off by the people's power." - Cyrankiewicz
"Solidarity leader Piotr Duda said on TVN24 on Saturday he would recommend to the trade union’s authorities to join an anti-government march in Warsaw on September 29. He said Solidarity would cooperate with all groups who want the current government to land in the trash bin of history. Its motto will be: 'Wake up, Poland!'" - Polonius3
"Be vigilant against the enemy of the nation!" - PRL propaganda
"There is a saying that every country has the kind of government it deserves. If that is true then Poles must like or at least tolerate the empty slogans of the bland, don't-rock-the-boat Tusk clique and all its hand-washes-hand connections and old-boy networks in the business, media and, in many cases, gangster underworld. - Polonius3
"Stonka ziemniaczana - pasiasty dywersant." ("Colorado potato beetle - a striped saboteur.") - PRL propaganda
"To the foaming-at-the-mouth critics of IV RP, do you really believe corruption and non-transparnet behind-the-scenes dealings should be ignored or swept under the rug. Or should they be tackled head on? PiS tried to do that by then it was too late." - Polonius3
"Wzmożona kontrola dźwignią społecznego zaufania" ("Increased public control - a lever for social trust") - propaganda PRL
boletus
7 Sep 2012
USA, Canada / Who is better informed, the expat or the Polonia crowd? [144]
- From Wikipedia
That's Chicago Metropolitan Area, a.k.a. Chicagoland. Asides Chicago proper, it includes four major cities with over 100,000 population each and more than 20 towns with over 50,000 population each - some in Illinois, some in Indiana, and some in Wisconsin. The estimates vary, depending on the method of counting - either MSA (Metropolitan Statistical Area), or CSA (Combined Statistical Area, which combines the metropolitan areas of Chicago, Michigan City (in Indiana), and Kankakee (in Illinois).
Chicago-Naperville-Joliet, IL-IN-WI MSA 9,461,105 (2010 census)
Chicago-Naperville- Joliet, IL-IN-WI CSA 9,686,021 (2010 census)
In such defined Chicago Metropolitan Area the estimate of 1.5 millions of Polish ancestry makes sense. However, my numbers (2007 census) referred to Chicago proper area, with total population of 2,851,268, and Polish population being the fifth largest group of 179,868 (6.3%) - after African American, Latinos, Irish and German. The source you quoted gives slightly different, and obviously manipulated numbers:
- from en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poles_in_Chicago
What do they mean by "German Americans and Irish Americans combined slightly surpassed"? This is nothing but spoofing the data. Even by their own numbers Germans (199,689 - 7.3%) and Irish (199,294 - 6.7%) each exceeds number of Poles (182,064 - 6.3% (not 7.3%, calculate it yourself)) in Chicago proper.
I do not understand a need for engineering the statistics: It is clear that, according to their numbers from 2000 census, we have this:
3. Germans 7.3%, 199,789
4. Irish 6.7%, 199, 264
5. Polish 6.3% 182,064
The data I posted in #89, were taken from 2007, and were different - in this order: 3. Irish, 4. German, 5. Polish
However, Polish Americans are, by far, the largest European American ethnic group in the Chicago metropolitan area, with as many as 1.5 million claiming Polish ancestry
- From Wikipedia
That's Chicago Metropolitan Area, a.k.a. Chicagoland. Asides Chicago proper, it includes four major cities with over 100,000 population each and more than 20 towns with over 50,000 population each - some in Illinois, some in Indiana, and some in Wisconsin. The estimates vary, depending on the method of counting - either MSA (Metropolitan Statistical Area), or CSA (Combined Statistical Area, which combines the metropolitan areas of Chicago, Michigan City (in Indiana), and Kankakee (in Illinois).
Chicago-Naperville-Joliet, IL-IN-WI MSA 9,461,105 (2010 census)
Chicago-Naperville- Joliet, IL-IN-WI CSA 9,686,021 (2010 census)
In such defined Chicago Metropolitan Area the estimate of 1.5 millions of Polish ancestry makes sense. However, my numbers (2007 census) referred to Chicago proper area, with total population of 2,851,268, and Polish population being the fifth largest group of 179,868 (6.3%) - after African American, Latinos, Irish and German. The source you quoted gives slightly different, and obviously manipulated numbers:
As of the 2000 U.S. census, Poles in Chicago are the largest European American ethnic group in the city, making up 7.3% of the total population. However, according to the 2006-2008 American Community Survey, German Americans and Irish Americans combined had slightly surpassed Polish Americans as the largest European American ethnic groups in Chicago. German Americans made up 7.3% of the population, and numbered at 199,789; Irish Americans also made up 7.3% of the population, and numbered at 199,294. Polish Americans now made up 6.7% of Chicago's population, and numbered at 182,064.
- from en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poles_in_Chicago
What do they mean by "German Americans and Irish Americans combined slightly surpassed"? This is nothing but spoofing the data. Even by their own numbers Germans (199,689 - 7.3%) and Irish (199,294 - 6.7%) each exceeds number of Poles (182,064 - 6.3% (not 7.3%, calculate it yourself)) in Chicago proper.
I do not understand a need for engineering the statistics: It is clear that, according to their numbers from 2000 census, we have this:
3. Germans 7.3%, 199,789
4. Irish 6.7%, 199, 264
5. Polish 6.3% 182,064
The data I posted in #89, were taken from 2007, and were different - in this order: 3. Irish, 4. German, 5. Polish
boletus
7 Sep 2012
USA, Canada / Who is better informed, the expat or the Polonia crowd? [144]
Not even close.
Chicago, ancestry (2007 survey):
African American: 37% => (1,054,469)
Spanish or Latino: 23% => (741,330)
Irish: (201,836)
German: (200,392)
Polish: (179,868)
Italian: (96,599)
English: (60,307)
...
Total: (2,851,268)
Poles just happen to be the largest
Not even close.
Chicago, ancestry (2007 survey):
African American: 37% => (1,054,469)
Spanish or Latino: 23% => (741,330)
Irish: (201,836)
German: (200,392)
Polish: (179,868)
Italian: (96,599)
English: (60,307)
...
Total: (2,851,268)
boletus
6 Sep 2012
Language / What do you say in a doctors surgery to ask "Who is next in line?" [19]
Przychodzi baba do lekarza ...
An old woman comes to a hospital, and sees a long queue of patients there. She pushes in front of everybody else and says to the doctor: "I will die in one minute". And the doctor says: "Could not you just wait another five minutes?
Przychodzi baba do lekarza ...
An old woman comes to a hospital, and sees a long queue of patients there. She pushes in front of everybody else and says to the doctor: "I will die in one minute". And the doctor says: "Could not you just wait another five minutes?
boletus
5 Sep 2012
USA, Canada / Who is better informed, the expat or the Polonia crowd? [144]
With all due respect, Ziemowit, I profoundly disagree. This is a gross oversimplification. Here you will find a very rich source on various dialects in Poland: gwarypolskie.uw.edu.pl . Malopolska dialect as a whole is described there as being linguistically very diverse. This particular page [/url]discusses common features for this region and shows various boundaries of selected major phonetic and morphological phenomena in Malopolska:
gwarypolskie.uw.edu.pl/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=502&Itemid=110
gwarypolskie.uw.edu.pl/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=442&Itemid=43 - A Podhale jargon (sub-dialect) is one of the Małopolska mountain belt dialects, which also includes: Spisz dialect on the east and Orawa plus south Żywiec, west of Podhale. Podhale dialect is internally diverse, due to the extent of the land (about 50 places).This particular page list 16 different dialectal features, specific to Podhale region. Stress on the first syllable is just one of them.
Absolutely not true. You forgot about all other influences: German, Rusyn, Hungarian and Walachian colonization.
There are records of the early German settlements, dating back to the beginning of thirteenth century. One is known as a transumpt from 1251 of the privilege from 1234 given by Prince Henryk the Bearded to Teodor Cedro from the Gryfita family, governor of Krakow, allowing him to settle German colonists "in silva circa fluvios Ostrowsko, Dunaiecz et Dunaiecz niger, Rogoźnik, Lipietnicza, Salt , Ratainicha, Nedelsc, Stradom, quantum est de sylva ipsius, Dantes eciam his forces pactis et condicionibus his uti, quibus Theutonici Sleser ses in Sylvis locati utuntur ". ie, the prince of allow for settling of the German colonists (Teutonic Silesians) in the woods near the river Ostrowsko, Dunajec, Czarny Dunajec, Rogoźnik - righ tributary of Czarny Dunajec, Lepietnica - left tributary of Czarny Dunajec and Słona, Ratajnica, Niedzielsko i Stradomka on Beskid.
pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Podhale
From the times of the Gryfita family comes village Rogoźnik, mentioned in a document from 1237. Teodor Cedro, having no children, donated all his estates to Cistercian monks and built for them a church and a monastery at Ludżmierz (5 km west of today's Nowy Targ). They continued establishing new villages on the basis of the Magdeburg Law: DÅ‚ugopole (1327), Krauszów (before 1333), Ludźmierz (1333), Szaflary (1338) and Waksmund and Nowy Targ (around 1287), and later Kolkuszowa. Such activity was made easier for them by a general privilege obtained from King WÅ‚adyslaw £okietek in 1308, which allowed them establishment of new villages without asking the King for permission first.
At the same time the settlement activity was carried by Åšreniawita family, in the Dunajec valley, east of Waksmund. Their representatives, Lasockis, established DÄ™bno (1335), Ostrowsko (before 1338), Harklowa and £opuszna (second half of XIV c.). Consequently the Dunajec valley has been settled in XIII and XIV c. on the W-E line DÅ‚ugopole-Waksmund-Maniowy (Czorsztyn) (about 40 km) and Szaflary, south of Nowy Targ.
The villages were settled on the basis of the German law. It was based on a contract between an organizer of the settlement action (zasadźca) and the owner of the land. The agreement, called the location privilege, stipulated the rights and obligations of the colonists. The land within a certain area, which they had to exploit by cutting down forests and draining swamps, became the hereditary property of its users. The settlers received personal freedom and the right to self-governance, headed by the mayor - usually "zasadźca". Duties for the owner In the land were clearly identified and could not be arbitrarily increased by the owner of the land. They were usually in form of rent payments and other small tributes. During the time needed to clear the land and settle down the settlers were exempt from all fees and charges. It was a period of so-called "wolnizna" ("wolny" - free), and it only applied to the areas where were no previous settlements. The "wolnizna" period was usually 20 years.
Typically, the settlers received one "łan" (łac. laneus, cs. lán, German. Lahn lub Hube - 25 ha in Lesser Poland) and "zasadźca", the hereditary mayor - several to dozens of "łanów" best located. In addition, the mayor had the right to a run tavern, mill, fish ponds, set beehives in the woods, and had hunting and fishing right. He also had the right to settle his own serfs and craftsmen on his own land. In addition, he was entitled to 1/6 of rent collected. "Zasadźcas" were people from various foreign states: Germany, Silesia, the Netherlands, as well as the native nobility and wealthier peasants. For the settlement the German settlers were used. Many names of Podhale villages witness to German colonization of Podhale: Harklowa, Szaflary, Krauszów, Waksmund.
spzaruski.republika.pl/region/Podhale.html#poczÄ…tki_osadnictwa
Regarding Wallachian influence, check, for example, this source: genealogia.okiem.pl/wolosi_slowa.htm
Derivatives of "Wallachian" word in mountain belt dialects:
Wałach, Wołoch, Wałaszyn - (primary meaning) high mountain shepherd, a man tending to sheep. Helpers of the head shepherd - baca, were also called "wałachs". Polish Górale (highlanders) used to call "wałachs" those among themselves who lived in mountain meadows and tended to sheep.
Secondary meaning: Wałach is an inhabitant of mountain region around Cieszyn.
Wałach in the sense of a junior shepherd, has been replaced by Hungarian "juhas" in XII century. Still the term "wałaszek" survives in Podwik village, Podhale.
There are many other words and expressions in Podhale region, involving "wałach":
wałaska, wałaska gromada, wałasznik, wałaśnik, zwyczaje wałaskie, wałaska kasza, taniec wałaski, trąba wałaska, strój wałaski, koszula wałaska, portki wałaskie or wałaszczaki (wałoszczoki), koszula wałaska, burka wałaska, burnus wałaski, wojewoda wałaski (wajda), osadnictwo na prawie wołoskim (settlements based on Wallachian Law (rule)) , etc.
Geographical names of Walachian origin, cover entire Carpathian belt and Balkans. See here: pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazwy_geograficzne_pochodzenia_wo%C5%82oskiego
Here are few familiar examples:
from bjêska - a mountain meadow, come various mountain ranges: Beskid, Beskidy, Beskidek, Beskidnik (Wetlina, Bieszczad, Bieszczady, Byskid, Byskyd
from chica - hair, beard and chicera - bearded mountain, come names of mountain peaks: Kiczera, Kiczora, Kyczera, Kiczerka, Kiczura, Kiczurka, Keczar, Kieczera, Kikula
from coliba - a hut comes koleba or koliba - a shepherd hut
from grui - a hill, a peak comes Podhalian "groń", an elevated shore of a river or stream. Also "grań" means ridge of a mountain top or a crag: Groń, Gronik, Hruń, Hron
from istep - a settlement, istÅba - a tent, old Ruthenian istobka - bathroom: Istebna (Poland), Istebné (Slovakia - Orava)
from izvor - a spring: Zwor (Stuposiany), Zwur, Zworzec (Dwernik), Zwir, Wirski (Wołosate), Zwory (Lutowiska), Na Zworcach (Sianki), Zverovka (Slovakia - Orava)
from măgura - a stand alone massif, also from Old Slavic maguła "mogiła" - a grave: Magura, Magurka, Magurki, Maguryczne, Magurzec, Maguryczny
from repede - rapid (here: about the current of a river): Rzepedź
from sălaş - a shelter: Szałas, Sałasz, Sałasziszcze, Sałaszisna/Sałaszczisna (Dwerniczek), Sałasyszcze (Krywe), Sałaszyce/Szałaszyszcze (Stuposiany, Szalasziszcze (Wołosate), Szałasisko
Native vocabulary of Podhale dialects
A major characteristics of Podhale dialects is presence of native words, which do not exist in any other Polish dialect.
They are: ciupaga (hatchet), wyzdajać (invent, prepare), złóbcoki (a musical instrument similar to fiddle), nomowiać (to advice to marriage), kumoterki (a decorative sled), pytac (an older man whose role is to invite guests for a wedding) and more. There many words specific to Zakopane - both native and borrowed. In Podhale dialect there are many words that do not exist beyond the mountains: piarg (a rock mound), perć ( mountain path), siklawa (mountain waterfalli), as well as activities related to shepherding and mountain lifestyle: bacówka (shepherd's shelter), bryndza (specific sheep cheeses), koliba (shelter), watra (shepherd's campfire), zawaterniok (a log to to maintain fire), dutki (money), dziedzina (village), moskol (cake made with boiled potatoes and flour), serdok (sleevless sheepskin jacket), styrmać sie (climb, climb up) and many other words.
In some cases, the Podhale vocabulary is more accurate than the corresponding nationwide language. Examples: siano (= hey from the first cut) vs. potrow (= hey from the second cut); watra (= campfire inside a shelter) vs. ogiyń (= fire, campfire in the field).
There are many borrowings from other languages: German: hamry (= forges); Hungarian: baca (= head shepherd), juhas (junior shepherd); Slovakian: frajier (= a lover), hore (= up, upside), héboj (= come), pościel (= a bed); Wallachian: watra, bryndza.
With all due respect, Ziemowit, I profoundly disagree. This is a gross oversimplification. Here you will find a very rich source on various dialects in Poland: gwarypolskie.uw.edu.pl . Malopolska dialect as a whole is described there as being linguistically very diverse. This particular page [/url]discusses common features for this region and shows various boundaries of selected major phonetic and morphological phenomena in Malopolska:
Malopolska - as already emphasized above - is a linguistically very diverse. Complementing discuss the characteristics of the dialect of Malopolska presented below are maps showing the boundaries of the major selected phonetic and morphological phenomena in Malopolska.
gwarypolskie.uw.edu.pl/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=502&Itemid=110
gwarypolskie.uw.edu.pl/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=442&Itemid=43 - A Podhale jargon (sub-dialect) is one of the Małopolska mountain belt dialects, which also includes: Spisz dialect on the east and Orawa plus south Żywiec, west of Podhale. Podhale dialect is internally diverse, due to the extent of the land (about 50 places).This particular page list 16 different dialectal features, specific to Podhale region. Stress on the first syllable is just one of them.
Górale are no other ethnicity than Polish.
Absolutely not true. You forgot about all other influences: German, Rusyn, Hungarian and Walachian colonization.
There are records of the early German settlements, dating back to the beginning of thirteenth century. One is known as a transumpt from 1251 of the privilege from 1234 given by Prince Henryk the Bearded to Teodor Cedro from the Gryfita family, governor of Krakow, allowing him to settle German colonists "in silva circa fluvios Ostrowsko, Dunaiecz et Dunaiecz niger, Rogoźnik, Lipietnicza, Salt , Ratainicha, Nedelsc, Stradom, quantum est de sylva ipsius, Dantes eciam his forces pactis et condicionibus his uti, quibus Theutonici Sleser ses in Sylvis locati utuntur ". ie, the prince of allow for settling of the German colonists (Teutonic Silesians) in the woods near the river Ostrowsko, Dunajec, Czarny Dunajec, Rogoźnik - righ tributary of Czarny Dunajec, Lepietnica - left tributary of Czarny Dunajec and Słona, Ratajnica, Niedzielsko i Stradomka on Beskid.
pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Podhale
From the times of the Gryfita family comes village Rogoźnik, mentioned in a document from 1237. Teodor Cedro, having no children, donated all his estates to Cistercian monks and built for them a church and a monastery at Ludżmierz (5 km west of today's Nowy Targ). They continued establishing new villages on the basis of the Magdeburg Law: DÅ‚ugopole (1327), Krauszów (before 1333), Ludźmierz (1333), Szaflary (1338) and Waksmund and Nowy Targ (around 1287), and later Kolkuszowa. Such activity was made easier for them by a general privilege obtained from King WÅ‚adyslaw £okietek in 1308, which allowed them establishment of new villages without asking the King for permission first.
At the same time the settlement activity was carried by Åšreniawita family, in the Dunajec valley, east of Waksmund. Their representatives, Lasockis, established DÄ™bno (1335), Ostrowsko (before 1338), Harklowa and £opuszna (second half of XIV c.). Consequently the Dunajec valley has been settled in XIII and XIV c. on the W-E line DÅ‚ugopole-Waksmund-Maniowy (Czorsztyn) (about 40 km) and Szaflary, south of Nowy Targ.
The villages were settled on the basis of the German law. It was based on a contract between an organizer of the settlement action (zasadźca) and the owner of the land. The agreement, called the location privilege, stipulated the rights and obligations of the colonists. The land within a certain area, which they had to exploit by cutting down forests and draining swamps, became the hereditary property of its users. The settlers received personal freedom and the right to self-governance, headed by the mayor - usually "zasadźca". Duties for the owner In the land were clearly identified and could not be arbitrarily increased by the owner of the land. They were usually in form of rent payments and other small tributes. During the time needed to clear the land and settle down the settlers were exempt from all fees and charges. It was a period of so-called "wolnizna" ("wolny" - free), and it only applied to the areas where were no previous settlements. The "wolnizna" period was usually 20 years.
Typically, the settlers received one "łan" (łac. laneus, cs. lán, German. Lahn lub Hube - 25 ha in Lesser Poland) and "zasadźca", the hereditary mayor - several to dozens of "łanów" best located. In addition, the mayor had the right to a run tavern, mill, fish ponds, set beehives in the woods, and had hunting and fishing right. He also had the right to settle his own serfs and craftsmen on his own land. In addition, he was entitled to 1/6 of rent collected. "Zasadźcas" were people from various foreign states: Germany, Silesia, the Netherlands, as well as the native nobility and wealthier peasants. For the settlement the German settlers were used. Many names of Podhale villages witness to German colonization of Podhale: Harklowa, Szaflary, Krauszów, Waksmund.
spzaruski.republika.pl/region/Podhale.html#poczÄ…tki_osadnictwa
Regarding Wallachian influence, check, for example, this source: genealogia.okiem.pl/wolosi_slowa.htm
Derivatives of "Wallachian" word in mountain belt dialects:
Wałach, Wołoch, Wałaszyn - (primary meaning) high mountain shepherd, a man tending to sheep. Helpers of the head shepherd - baca, were also called "wałachs". Polish Górale (highlanders) used to call "wałachs" those among themselves who lived in mountain meadows and tended to sheep.
Secondary meaning: Wałach is an inhabitant of mountain region around Cieszyn.
Wałach in the sense of a junior shepherd, has been replaced by Hungarian "juhas" in XII century. Still the term "wałaszek" survives in Podwik village, Podhale.
There are many other words and expressions in Podhale region, involving "wałach":
wałaska, wałaska gromada, wałasznik, wałaśnik, zwyczaje wałaskie, wałaska kasza, taniec wałaski, trąba wałaska, strój wałaski, koszula wałaska, portki wałaskie or wałaszczaki (wałoszczoki), koszula wałaska, burka wałaska, burnus wałaski, wojewoda wałaski (wajda), osadnictwo na prawie wołoskim (settlements based on Wallachian Law (rule)) , etc.
Geographical names of Walachian origin, cover entire Carpathian belt and Balkans. See here: pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazwy_geograficzne_pochodzenia_wo%C5%82oskiego
Here are few familiar examples:
from bjêska - a mountain meadow, come various mountain ranges: Beskid, Beskidy, Beskidek, Beskidnik (Wetlina, Bieszczad, Bieszczady, Byskid, Byskyd
from chica - hair, beard and chicera - bearded mountain, come names of mountain peaks: Kiczera, Kiczora, Kyczera, Kiczerka, Kiczura, Kiczurka, Keczar, Kieczera, Kikula
from coliba - a hut comes koleba or koliba - a shepherd hut
from grui - a hill, a peak comes Podhalian "groń", an elevated shore of a river or stream. Also "grań" means ridge of a mountain top or a crag: Groń, Gronik, Hruń, Hron
from istep - a settlement, istÅba - a tent, old Ruthenian istobka - bathroom: Istebna (Poland), Istebné (Slovakia - Orava)
from izvor - a spring: Zwor (Stuposiany), Zwur, Zworzec (Dwernik), Zwir, Wirski (Wołosate), Zwory (Lutowiska), Na Zworcach (Sianki), Zverovka (Slovakia - Orava)
from măgura - a stand alone massif, also from Old Slavic maguła "mogiła" - a grave: Magura, Magurka, Magurki, Maguryczne, Magurzec, Maguryczny
from repede - rapid (here: about the current of a river): Rzepedź
from sălaş - a shelter: Szałas, Sałasz, Sałasziszcze, Sałaszisna/Sałaszczisna (Dwerniczek), Sałasyszcze (Krywe), Sałaszyce/Szałaszyszcze (Stuposiany, Szalasziszcze (Wołosate), Szałasisko
Native vocabulary of Podhale dialects
A major characteristics of Podhale dialects is presence of native words, which do not exist in any other Polish dialect.
They are: ciupaga (hatchet), wyzdajać (invent, prepare), złóbcoki (a musical instrument similar to fiddle), nomowiać (to advice to marriage), kumoterki (a decorative sled), pytac (an older man whose role is to invite guests for a wedding) and more. There many words specific to Zakopane - both native and borrowed. In Podhale dialect there are many words that do not exist beyond the mountains: piarg (a rock mound), perć ( mountain path), siklawa (mountain waterfalli), as well as activities related to shepherding and mountain lifestyle: bacówka (shepherd's shelter), bryndza (specific sheep cheeses), koliba (shelter), watra (shepherd's campfire), zawaterniok (a log to to maintain fire), dutki (money), dziedzina (village), moskol (cake made with boiled potatoes and flour), serdok (sleevless sheepskin jacket), styrmać sie (climb, climb up) and many other words.
In some cases, the Podhale vocabulary is more accurate than the corresponding nationwide language. Examples: siano (= hey from the first cut) vs. potrow (= hey from the second cut); watra (= campfire inside a shelter) vs. ogiyń (= fire, campfire in the field).
There are many borrowings from other languages: German: hamry (= forges); Hungarian: baca (= head shepherd), juhas (junior shepherd); Slovakian: frajier (= a lover), hore (= up, upside), héboj (= come), pościel (= a bed); Wallachian: watra, bryndza.
boletus
4 Sep 2012
News / Who controls Gazeta Wyborcza?? [216]
Who controls Gazeta Wyborcza??
You are so naive. Antoni Macierewicz, of course.
Any time he comes up with any new Smoleńsk revelation, GW responds. So who pushes the buttons?
Who controls Gazeta Wyborcza??
Pawian: The Vatican, The Kremlin, CIA, Mosad?
Polonius3: Obama's CIA
Polonius3: Obama's CIA
You are so naive. Antoni Macierewicz, of course.
Any time he comes up with any new Smoleńsk revelation, GW responds. So who pushes the buttons?
boletus
3 Sep 2012
News / Kaczyński presents alternative to PO thievery [26]
That's right. The term is TEFLON. :-)
Now, here are some fragments of the Tomasz Lis blog: Między mielonym a mielonką, which I translated for you:
Listening to the voices of the opposition and the anti-Tusk journalism, it's easy to conclude that there exists a panacea on our "non-existing state". If the state does not exist under the rules of Tusk, then the state will reappear after Tusk disappears. If such diagnosis is correct, then Tusk indeed needs to chased out. However there is no indication that chasing Tusk out is a means to a goal for the opposition and its allies, including Rydzyk and Duda. No, it is the goal in itself. The only one; self-subsisting.
Contrary to what many write, Donald Tusk is not made of teflon. Aleksander Kwasniewski is right when he says that "Tusk's charm has faded". The premier is not in the control of the state apparatus, he is not able to determine the priorities and to convince the public to them, and the number of failures and omissions of the current team is growing. However, a single parliamentary debate is enough for Tusk's shares to raise, rather than to drop to the bottom. Why? Because the viewers, the voters, are finding with their own eyes and ears that there is something much worse than our state - it's the opposition.
...
Our opposition wants to condemn Tusk to exile. However it is not able to decide on what charges. Is it for the incompetence, clumsiness, carelessness, irresponsibility, or for the suppression of civil liberties, freedom of expression, the rights of the opposition and a dangerous alliance with Putin and Merkel at the same time. It is about time to decide on the charges: because either we have Tusk the tyran, or the state does not work. Either there is no pilot flying our airplane, or we have the kidnapper and usurper flying with us. Either, or.
Sorry, no. Such a term isn`t used in media or private conversations.
That's right. The term is TEFLON. :-)
Now, here are some fragments of the Tomasz Lis blog: Między mielonym a mielonką, which I translated for you:
Listening to the voices of the opposition and the anti-Tusk journalism, it's easy to conclude that there exists a panacea on our "non-existing state". If the state does not exist under the rules of Tusk, then the state will reappear after Tusk disappears. If such diagnosis is correct, then Tusk indeed needs to chased out. However there is no indication that chasing Tusk out is a means to a goal for the opposition and its allies, including Rydzyk and Duda. No, it is the goal in itself. The only one; self-subsisting.
Contrary to what many write, Donald Tusk is not made of teflon. Aleksander Kwasniewski is right when he says that "Tusk's charm has faded". The premier is not in the control of the state apparatus, he is not able to determine the priorities and to convince the public to them, and the number of failures and omissions of the current team is growing. However, a single parliamentary debate is enough for Tusk's shares to raise, rather than to drop to the bottom. Why? Because the viewers, the voters, are finding with their own eyes and ears that there is something much worse than our state - it's the opposition.
...
Our opposition wants to condemn Tusk to exile. However it is not able to decide on what charges. Is it for the incompetence, clumsiness, carelessness, irresponsibility, or for the suppression of civil liberties, freedom of expression, the rights of the opposition and a dangerous alliance with Putin and Merkel at the same time. It is about time to decide on the charges: because either we have Tusk the tyran, or the state does not work. Either there is no pilot flying our airplane, or we have the kidnapper and usurper flying with us. Either, or.
boletus
3 Sep 2012
Language / Nominative (Mianownik) vs Accusative (Biernik)? [17]
Good advice. When in doubt, statistics wins.
"Nasi chłopcy szczelą gola." Szczelą: 8780 google entries. Strzelą: 185,000.
By searching google and reading a little of where you found the words or phrase will help with your Polish also. Sometimes you can find interesting stuff.
Good advice. When in doubt, statistics wins.
"Nasi chłopcy szczelą gola." Szczelą: 8780 google entries. Strzelą: 185,000.
boletus
3 Sep 2012
News / Kaczyński presents alternative to PO thievery [26]
"We need to draw lessons from the experiences of 2005-2007. This is why whatever we are going to propose to Poles I would call the IV Republic minus Ziobro" - Adam Hofman
"We need to draw lessons from the experiences of 2005-2007. This is why whatever we are going to propose to Poles I would call the IV Republic minus Ziobro" - Adam Hofman
boletus
3 Sep 2012
Life / Polish vs British vs American - Clash of cultures [390]
And just to put it into some perspective - compare it to Toronto subway system. Twenty years ago there were only two lines here: Bloor (green) and Spadina-University (yellow).
The continuation will look like this and it is for serious:
And just to put it into some perspective - compare it to Toronto subway system. Twenty years ago there were only two lines here: Bloor (green) and Spadina-University (yellow).
Toronto subway system
boletus
2 Sep 2012
News / Kaczyński presents alternative to PO thievery [26]
"I'd rather see Mr. Kaczynski playing with a calculator than with matches" - Tusk
Shortly speaking, nothing special. Waste of time. We call it bicie piany - beating the foam.
"I'd rather see Mr. Kaczynski playing with a calculator than with matches" - Tusk