Work / Salary Expectation for HCL Senior JAVA Developer with 4 years experience in Poland [66]


You did accuse me of trolling, though. In any case, I think you mean well, too.

Work / Salary Expectation for HCL Senior JAVA Developer with 4 years experience in Poland [66]

They're more than welcome to give what they believe is the best advice to the OP, as are you and I. Sorry, but it doesn't look like you and I are going to agree on this. We'll just have to assume that the other is giving the best advice they can, and leave it at that. No point in bickering.

Work / Salary Expectation for HCL Senior JAVA Developer with 4 years experience in Poland [66]

Whatever. When you grow up and have to worry about feeding a family or you have retirement staring you in the face, you will undoubtedly think a lot different.

Work / Salary Expectation for HCL Senior JAVA Developer with 4 years experience in Poland [66]


No, they haven't. That's abundantly clear from how they answer questions here on this forum. Most of the Indians, at least, seem to be passively responding to recruiting emails and haven't done any active research or applying at all.

Work / Salary Expectation for HCL Senior JAVA Developer with 4 years experience in Poland [66]


Exactly your biggest mistake. If you have the qualifications to find a (by Polish standards) well-paid job in Poland where unemployment is high and wages are low, you almost certainly have what it takes to find a much better paying job in a richer country, where jobs are more abundant and wages are much higher. For qualified people, Poland $ucks as an opportunity, except for the cream of the crop that get paid Western wages while working in Poland. For unqualified people, Poland $ucks even worse.

And if someone like the OP doesn't have a job offer from Germany, the UK or Sweden, it's because they didn't apply or do their research correctly.

Bottom line: if someone thinks that Poland is their best or only option as far as work or study is concerned, they they almost certainly fcuked up with their research, analysis or planning, and they will be very dissatisfied with the results.

Oh, and agree with Gosc and Wulkan that foreigners of dark complexion would probably feel more comfortable in the richer countries of the West. Even without taking race into account, the quality of life is much higher there.

Work / Salary Expectation for HCL Senior JAVA Developer with 4 years experience in Poland [66]


... and because they failed to do their research into the abundant, better opportunities that exist in richer countries, or failed to learn enough about Poland to know that is substantially poorer than Germany or Sweden. In any case, the primary reason for most of these people coming to Poland is ignorance.


As am I. But then, I didn't have to earn money in Poland, I already have more than enough for retirement, and I don't have hungry mouths to feed. I wouldn't be too happy at all if I were from a poor country, came to Poland to work, and was able to save only a small fraction of what my buddy who went to Germany, the UK, Norway or the States could. I'd feel fcuking stupid for not having done my research better. And I would die of embarrassment when I had to explain to my kid that he can't go to Harvey Mudd or Rose Hullman because Daddy just can't afford it.

Work / Salary Expectation for HCL Senior JAVA Developer with 4 years experience in Poland [66]


Get real. The people that come here asking about jobs opportunities and wages are most certainly interested in their career path above all else. They certainly didn't come here to hear any silly romantic "stop and smell the roses" or "the best things in life are free" bull$hit.


I'll do no such thing. I'll continue to give the best advice I can, and, in the case of those who want to come to Poland to study and work, that usually means pointing out that there are plenty of much better opportunities elsewhere, so it is generally pointless to come to Poland. And that if they think that Poland is their best or only chance, than certainly they have failed to do adequate research.

For people who want to come on vacation or retire, my answer might be different.

Work / Salary Expectation for HCL Senior JAVA Developer with 4 years experience in Poland [66]


Undeniably. However, like I said before, people seeking work abroad are willing to sacrifice short-term comfort for long-term gain. For example, many of my colleagues went to work in hospitals in Saudi Arabia. They described it as going to jail for five years, but coming out with enough to retire on.

That's not the case with Poland, though. If anything, those from India and Nigeria they see it as a foot in the door to the richer countries of EU, and the very last thing on their minds is frittering away the rest of their days in Poland.

Work / Salary Expectation for HCL Senior JAVA Developer with 4 years experience in Poland [66]


Of course it does. The primary reason people seek employment halfway around the world in the first place is to earn money, and they're even willing to sacrifice comfort on the short term to ensure themselves a better life for their present or future families and for themselves in their golden years. It's called prudent planning.


Tell that to someone who is struggling or dissatisfied financially and I guarantee you they will punch you in your smug little face, or at least be sorely tempted to. When you have no cash, you'd be surprised how much little there is to life. There ain't nothin' romantic about poverty, and it's a cloud that don't got no silver lining. Unless you're the Buddha or Saint Francis.

Work / Salary Expectation for HCL Senior JAVA Developer with 4 years experience in Poland [66]

And people sometimes win the lottery. By far most don't though.

Advising people to make their plans on the basis of "sometimes" is absurd, and even cruel.

And thought the money may be great for a Pole who plans to stay the rest of their life in Poland, it $ucks even by local standards. As long as there are countries nearby, even with walking distance, that pay two, three, four or even five times as much, very, very few people who come to work in Poland will stay long. The temptation is far too great, especially once it sets in that you have to work four, five or more years to save up what you can save up in one in the West. And the opportunities in the West are too numerous.

Work / How to find work in Warsaw "if u don't speak Polish" ! [176]


That degree is just about worthless on the Polish job market without abundant experience to back it up. It seems like everyone, their mother and their dog have a degree in that field. It's a problem of massive oversupply.


Perhaps a few, but for EU residents from Spain, not for non-EU residents. As Gosc said, nobody is going to go through the hassle of getting a work permit to hire you.


You'll fall out of love very quick when you realize that wages are low and the cost of living is relatively high, That is why so many Poles leave Poland to find work in richer countries, and not the other way around.

Work / Salary Expectation for HCL Senior JAVA Developer with 4 years experience in Poland [66]


It's a pretty darn safe assumption. Poland is not an immigration magnet, for good reason.


Yes, you missed something. It's staring you right in the eye.

News / Does democratic Poland guarantee it's LGBT citizens respect for human and civil rights? [1169]


Sounds like so much fun. Makes me wish I were gay. Where do I sign up?

Work / Salary Expectation for HCL Senior JAVA Developer with 4 years experience in Poland [66]


OP is not from India, but from Spain.

Work / Salary Expectation for HCL Senior JAVA Developer with 4 years experience in Poland [66]


That's $36,000 US a year. As Gosc said, in the richer countries of West and in the English speaking countries, you would make two or three times that, or more. The number that counts is not your salary, but your absolute savings potential, which will be much lower in Poland than in richer countries. You might live comfortably enough, but at the end of the month, there will be a lot less left over to put in your savings account than if you worked in a richer country. In a richer country, it is quite possible that you will be able to SAVE more than you EARN in Poland.

Ignore anyone who says this is good money for Poland. While true, that doesn't apply to you because you are not going to spend the rest of your life there, so you are not part of the economy where that has any relevance.

Explore opportunities in richer countries, and, until then, do everything you can too beef up your qualifications and experience so that you can land a better job. That is going to be hard to do in Poland.

Study / Student from Nepal travelling to Poland with dependent for further studies. Any job? [87]


None of that changes the advice I give, which is to explore better opportunities in richer countries or their own, or to take off a year or so, stay home, and beef up their academics so that they can get into a better university, possibly with a scholarship. Sorry, but I just don't see any point in boostering for studies in Poland except in rare cases. Perhaps you see it opening up doors to the disadvantaged, but in my experience, the time and money can be much better spent elsewhere. Perhaps you think that there are no opportunities elsewhere, but again, I strongly disagree.

Study / Student from Nepal travelling to Poland with dependent for further studies. Any job? [87]


They aren't.


Perhaps not as cheap as they think once you factor in that there is practically zero chance of getting financial aid in the form of scholarships or fellowships, or of getting part-time work, especially something like TA or RA work.


Judging by the sheer number of posts on this board, there seems to be considerable interest in these courses. I'm guessing that most programs in state-owned universities are turning people away. The private schools may be different, as their standards are so low they take anything that breaths or, at least twitches when you poke it with a stick, as long it it has the cash to pay.

News / Poland's fight against paedophilia [277]


You do realize that Ford Motor company can most certainly be sued for the "offences" of one of it's employees, and that that does indeed happen on a regular basis when they are determined to share or bear responsibility for that employee's behavior.

Study / Student from Nepal travelling to Poland with dependent for further studies. Any job? [87]


Which is exactly what I said, that they have failed to explore better opportunities, and are thus working on incomplete knowledge of all that is available to them.

I also get the feeling that you think that it is somehow easier to get into Poland than into the richer countries of the West. I don't think that's the case. If anything, I would think it is harder.

Study / Student from Nepal travelling to Poland with dependent for further studies. Any job? [87]

I do disagree on that. There are plenty of much better opportunities. Or maybe I do agree that it's "not bad". Just far from the best, for a whole bunch of reasons: academic, practical and financial. Again, if a prospective student is convinced that Poland is the best or only place to study, they certainly have failed miserably at exploring the much better opportunities that exist elsewhere, including in their own home countries.

Study / Student from Nepal travelling to Poland with dependent for further studies. Any job? [87]

As I've said before, if someone thinks Poland is the best or only choice they have, then they have failed miserably at exploring the opportunities available to them. Yes, Poland may be better than a $hithole third world country, but there are practically always plenty of much better opportunities elsewhere.

Study / Student from Nepal travelling to Poland with dependent for further studies. Any job? [87]

A lot of them think that because Poland is in the EU, it's rich like Germany, Denmark or Sweden.

Life / Migration To Poland - cost of living, work, safe for a girl? [20]

There certainly are people who win the lottery, too. I wouldn't advise anyone to bet the farm on it, though. As Gosc said, it is far, far safer to assume that the OP will absolutely not find work at all in Poland than to cruelly hold out false hope.

Study / Student from Nepal travelling to Poland with dependent for further studies. Any job? [87]


If you need a part-time job to finance your studies, forget about Poland. There are no jobs for foreign students in Poland. Study somewhere else.


Is there a full-time position open? I'd like to apply myself.

Life / Migration To Poland - cost of living, work, safe for a girl? [20]


Ummm... that's what I said. "Impossible", which means zero.


That was about getting a visa, not getting a job. "Exceedingly low" means next to zero.


First time I've ever been accused of that on this website. And yes, it's unspeakably cruel when the other posters here hold out false hope to desperate foreigners and young people. I don't sugarcoat $hit.

Life / Migration To Poland - cost of living, work, safe for a girl? [20]


Not hard. Impossible. No one will go through the trouble of getting a work permit for a non+skilled, non-EU worker. Base your plans on the very sage assumption that you will not be able to earn a penny during your visit to Poland. If you require a job to earn money to finance your studies, then Poland is simply not the right place for you.

Since you are asking about unskilled labor, the chances are exceedingly low that you will be able to fulfill the requirements for a visa. Don't waste your money or time trying.

News / Chazan ruling a step towards normality in Poland [16]


If you are reading Nasz Nocnik for factual information rather than comic relief, you need to tighten up your criteria for credible sourcing. The most amazing thing about that "newspaper" is how they manage to cram so many czyste pierdoły into so few pages. That is an accomplishment.

I used the paper with my students to illustrate logical fallacies. It's so chock-full of them, and of some many different ones, that it is a veritable goldmine of bull$hit.

News / Poland's fight against paedophilia [277]


Bingo. Apparently, Faith, Hope and Charity have been replaced by Homophobia, Misogyny and Pedophilia as the core dogmatic principles of the RCC.

Also, Poland is heading the same way as Spain and Ireland as far as the RCC is concerned. It is only a matter of time before demographic changes result in widespread repudiation of the Church, and of religion in general. When it happens, it will be a very rapid change.

Love / How to Make (Polish?) Women happy? [96]


One of the most frustrating things about dealing with Polish women, whether in terms of romance or not, is that they are incredibly suspicious. Even if you are good to them, they will wonder what ulterior motives you have in the back of your mind. So even if they get everything they want, they are still unhappy.

Law / Poland student visa refusal - 'intention to leave' [51]


Exactly. There is considerable, almost absolute, discretion afforded to the consul in such cases, and it is very rare indeed that another consul or superior is going to second-guess his judgement. The burden is 100% on the applicant to prove that they fulfill the requirements of the visa in question, and to eliminate all doubts from the mind of the consul, who not only has the right, but the duty, as well, to be vigilant, cautious and skeptical. The applicant not only has to prove that there are no plausible reasons against granting the visa (or "red flags"), but also that there are abundant and sound reasons for granting the visa.

In this case, the applicant clearly failed to provide sufficient reasons for, and probably provided sufficient reasons against granting the visa, which automatically substantially increases the burden were an appeal to be filed. To the point where there is little hope that a mere prospective student would be able to meet that burden. If he were an established businessman with strong ties to his home country and had the documentation to back it up, an appeal would make sense. But not in this particular case, in which the consul is starting on the firm and well-justified assumption that the applicant is most likely not going to honor the terms of the visa. An appeal would be simply a waste of time and money for all involved. Nor would the nature and status of his application and acceptance into a Polish university be likely to alter anything, as the reason the consul rejected the visa in the first place almost certainly had little, if anything, to do with the decision, which is almost certainly because of the fact that he did not answer the consul's questions in a manner consistent with that of a serious prospective student.

Gosc is also correct that the OP is almost certainly overstating his case and leaving out important details. However, even if more honest details were provided, it would not change the fact that the OP is just not going to be granted a visa to Poland.

One thing you are both missing is that the consul is under no obligation to provide a full or "honest" reason for rejecting the application. They are under no obligation to provide any reason at all. The OP's mistake was to assume that, just because box on the form next to "your intention to leave the territory of the republic of Poland before the expiry of the visa could not be ascertained" was checked, and no others, that this was the only reason that the application was declined. That is hardly likely.