Work / Possible lifestyle in Poland? Job offer - 12K to 13K PLN. [40]


All depends. A small kawalerka (bachelor flat) in the citry centre (20-25 m2) may run 1500 to 2000 zł. There are upscale suburbs like Wilanów and low-scale semi-rural ones like Babice so rental may range from 1000 to 3000 a month. Food costs dpeend on whether it is home-cooked or catering/take-away fare. Perhaps from 500 to 1500 zł. Utilties perhaps 500-1000 zł. This is just a very rough estimation because so many different variables enter the picture. Other money-gobblers depend on one's lifestyle. Entertainment, travel, shopping, etc. can be quite pricey.

Life / Polish people and racism. [943]

I don't follow Jewish affairs that closely, but I presume Jewry regard him as a renegade and rebel if not a downright traitor to the "holy cause".

Life / Polish people and racism. [943]


I should have said they often act as if they were above criticism and readily bring out the anti-Semitic card to intimidate their critics. Someone who criticises Israel's policy towards Palestinians can also be called an anti-Semite by Jews.

Life / Polish people and racism. [943]


Because Jews are out of bounds for any criticism or negative remarks. If you do, they'll daub you with the anti-Semitic brush.

Life / Polish people and racism. [943]


Poland accepted some 80,000 Chechen refugees fleeing Russian atrocities in their homeland. Over a million Ukrainians have fled to Poland in search of a better life or fleeing Russian aggression which claims Ukrainian lives every single day. All the the Merkels, Schultzes and others banging on about forcing other countries to accept the refugee invasion they were resposnible for launching should bear that in mind. Poland has done her part.

News / Talks on re-polonising Pekao bank under way [58]


Do you mean balcerised? You gut them (Poles call it the wydmuszka technique) -- the machinery and other internal assets are removed and sold on the sly, and what's left is sold to foreign owners for a song. Does the EU allow privatisation only within a given country whilst excluding foreign bidders? Probably not!

What will improve Poland's entrepreneurial spirit? Certainly not what has been done so far, Yes, reforms are needed, but again not the kind that allow foreign interests to reap the fruits and reduce Poles to the status of low-wage mercenaries and docile consumers of foreign goods.

News / Talks on re-polonising Pekao bank under way [58]


I never said private Polish-owned banks are not welcome. Just shows how much effort is sitll needed to create a viable indigenous enterpreneurial class in Poland whose banks and other companies are competitive enough to sueeze out foreign rivals.

Don't tell me it's a feather in any country's cap if it doesn't produce a single make of car, if most banks and breweries have their HQs abroad and nealry all of the products on its market are produced and sold by foreign-owned firms.

News / Talks on re-polonising Pekao bank under way [58]


So why attack the Polish govt for doing it, even though to the best of my knowledge they still haven't done so. It is apparently one of the accepted financial options.

quote=peterweg]Have you ever lived and worked in Poland?[/quote]
In fact I have. Quite a long time.

News / Talks on re-polonising Pekao bank under way [58]


Seriously damaged yes, but nearly doubling many people's monthly pay with the stroke of a pen (to seek to accommodate Solidarność and avoid further unrest) was the final nail in the consumer coffin. Such a move would even empty the US market of consumer goods.

News / Talks on re-polonising Pekao bank under way [58]


I always thought that only the commies did stuff like that. They did in 1980 when they succumbed to Wałęsa's demand of an additional 2,000 zł a month for each worker and destroyed the Polish consumer market. People had stachesl full of paper money but there was almost nothing to buy as Wałęsa's extra 2,000 zł had depelted the market of goods..

How then was it that Obama ordered the printing of more paper money to pump-prime the recession-bound economy, and it actually worked?


Dunno about China; maybe their mega-population of downtroddden coolies once willling to work for a bowl of rice and even today committeed to starvation-wage, ant-like teamwork, painstaking patience and obedience had something to do with it.

But neither Germany nor Holland were primarily peasant societies devoid of an ubran burgher class of bankers, merchants, clerks and artisans. Poland's cities (historically) were essentially run by Germans and Jews, but 90% of the indigencous Poles were peasants. 10% were usually idle, often high-living and fortune-squandering gentry whose claim o fame was occasionally joining some insurrection. The proportions may have changed but todday's post-peasant urban dwellers are by and large still not creators and innovators but mercenaries in the pay of foriegners and consumers of foreign-owned products. The market is still controleld by foreign banks, assembly plants, retailers and products. The other countries you mentioned were able to create an indigenous culture-creating and manufacturing middle class. It was the middle class that created inventions, composed symphonies, painted pictures, made and sold yard goods, furniture, spirits and other products, built castles and cathedrals, sculpted statues and designed assorted household goods and farm implements.

News / Talks on re-polonising Pekao bank under way [58]


This is not limited to Poland. Banks in general are powerful institutions and who owns them is at a tremendous advantage. A foreign bank may turn down a government's request for a loan if said government is at war with the bank's home country.

People from countries who have not experienced such problems should be careful about projecting their views onto Poland, a country that has always been plagued and largely controlled by foreign interests and thereby prevented from developing much indigenous commerce and industry. Largely a nation of peasant farmers, it was wedged in betweeen Germany, a major industrial power, and populous, powerful and resrouce-rich Imperial Russia. Must such ecomomic vassadlom endure indefintiely? Perhaps the time has come to strike out on a more independent course and finally devleop a viable indigenous entrepreneurial class. All hope is with the Morawiecki Plan!

News / Talks on re-polonising Pekao bank under way [58]


Harry the Liar has been banging on about this for years, but the joke is on Harry. It is his flagship Harryesque lie: 1% fact, 99% hasty conclusions, distortions, insinruations and most of all vivd fabrications, in other words UTTER BOLLOCKS!

The 1% fact in this case was that some lives in a flat. The remainder is all lies. The real estate in quesition was never state owned. It was built in the '60s as a housing coop for the daily "Express Wieczorny". The original owners were free to sell the units on the free market and they did. A previous owner was Polish TV presenter Andrzej Nowaliński, a homo, hence a man after Harry's own heart. He was sent as a correspondnent to London where he died in mysterious cicrucmstances (reportedly murdered by this jealous male "lover"). We never met Nowaliński personally but knew his father. My wife's family purchased the unit from the subsequent owner at an estate agent's for the going market price. End of story!

Stalinism ended in 1956. If Harry knew his Polish history better and spent less time quaffing ale, stout and lager and badmouthing posters on PF, he'd know that by the mid-'70s Poland had a thriving private sector, the largest and most dynamic in the Soviet bloc. It included not only estate agents and matrimonial agencies but all manner of services and even small-scale manufacturing.

News / Talks on re-polonising Pekao bank under way [58]


State or private is not important. What's important that these are Polish-owned banks. Who owns the banks, calls the shots. You know what ethnic group own many of the world's banks and how wealthy, powerful and influential and they are, Amongst themselves they openly admit: "We run the world!" Why shouldn't Poles get a slice of the pie?! At least in their own country!

News / Talks on re-polonising Pekao bank under way [58]


Who cares?! Kogo to obchodzi?! You certainly have an inflated sense of self-importance if you think the whole PF are awaiting your alleged passport scan with bated breath. Probably only Dreamergirl is.

News / Talks on re-polonising Pekao bank under way [58]


Don't pay any attention to Harry. He's constatnly raising this concocted allegation to draw attention away from his suspicious dealings with operatives in Belarus on behalf of the underground CPGB. Ask Dreamergirl, she should know.

News / Talks on re-polonising Pekao bank under way [58]


Your'e obviously taking your cues from the oppostion losers. Remember how they badmouthed 500+? There wouldn't be enough money, it would break the budget, parents would use the money for booze and ciggies, it discrimianted against the first child (PO claimed they wanted all kids to benefit!?). It turns out that 500+ has raised Poland's living standards, increased consumption and spurred the economy. By plugging the holes in widespread tax evasion, the necessary financing was found. Many kids went on a family summer holiday for the first time in their lives. To avert possible abuses the govt printed special coupons for distribution to suspect households to use only for the purchase of food and clothuing not addictives. It turns out that was hardly necessary. Morawiecki, the treasury and finance ministries are making sure expenditures get offset by the necessary revenues. Unlike the oppositon, who even hoped NATO would call of their Warsaw summit to embarrass the govt, let's wish PiS well and hope they succeed!


Ever heard of US Democrats rewarding Republicans rather than their party cronies. Or British Tories rewarding Labour operatives? Why expect PiS to act unlike all other poltical parties everyhwere?


The World Bank disagrees, Who are we to believe: you or them?
In a document titled "The Distributional Impact of Taxes and Transfers in Poland", the WB has analysed Poland's fiscal and social policy and found that since the launch of 500+, Poland's extreme poverty index has dropped 3% from, 8.9% to 5.9% proc. The World Bank estimates the programme will cost 1.5% GDP but the increased consumption will increase VAT revenues.

News / Talks on re-polonising Pekao bank under way [58]


Know of any government that pursues such a policy? Bureaucracy has been with us since the dawn of organised government. Nowadays it rewards political supporters (in the USA generous campaign contributors can count on cushy posts including ambassadorships!) and keeps unemployment rates down.

News / Talks on re-polonising Pekao bank under way [58]


So you condemn Catholic social conservatives and deny them the right to exist. That is your definition of pluralism, I presume.


Not labels but merits! PRL was a carbon copy of post-commie/KOR neo-PRL.
Only the slogans were egalitarian but the main benefits and perks were reserved for a small elite, the red bourgeoisie who served as Moscow's stooges. So that's not much different from the 25-year post-PRL clique which mainly enjoyed the fruits of transformation by serving as stooges for foreign intererst groups and the Brussels dictatorship.

In both cases. PRL and post-PRL RPIII, it was the backers of one or another form of Targowica that got rewarded.

News / Talks on re-polonising Pekao bank under way [58]


One does not rule out the other. No-one need choose between heartless, hard-nosed, cut-throat captialist and a obsessive nationalsitic patriotism. Neither extreme is good, so it's best to strike a reasonable balance. The Morawiecki Plan is not about building histortical memorials or museums as you well know. The Morawiecki Plan or some equivalent thereof is what the post-commie/ex-KORite clique deliberately failed to create in order to follow Soros' game-plan, vassalise their country and reap the personal benefits -- to hell with the rest of the nation!


PRL propaganda never emphasised full independence, sovereignty or Poland being the master of her own destiny without external interference in her domestic affairs. Poland's role was to be a "reliable link" in the "victorious" Socialist community, their Warsaw Pact and Comecon. That was the propaganda, the reality was Soviet vassaldom. In effect, that is much closer to post-commie Poland being a vassal of foreign interest groups. Many Poles say: yesterday its was Moscow, today Brussels. When will it finally be Warsaw?

News / Talks on re-polonising Pekao bank under way [58]


Kind of reminds one of the drunk selling off his family's keepsakes and household effects for booze. The Soros, Sachs, Michnik, Balcerowicz gang achieved exactly what they wanted -- for 25 years the dominance and prosperity of the ex-commie cum ex-KOR clique and the entrepreneurs, bankers, academics, entertainers, media types, profesesional dynasties and other elites that agreed to a vassalised Poland serving foreign-interest groups as a cheap-manpower and ideal assembly-plant venue. The present govt are trying to finally make Poles the masters of their own destiny and more justly distribute the fruits of transformation. There was money in 1989-90 but it was from Soros who was not interested in a fully independent and sovereign Poland so he bankrolled the above-mentioned who have enjoyed the perks and prestige of wealth and power ever since...until October 2015 that is.

Life / Family, Community --> Society "The Polish Way" [29]


I think I saw it in one of the newspapers or some Internet news site, but I go through so much copy that I'm at a loss to pin-point it.

Off-Topic / Alternative households breed misery and are hell for the kids [11]


No-one made a comparison between an alcoholic and non-alcoholic family.
The only valid comaprison when disucssing dysfunctionality would be between an alcoholic parent in a two-parent family v an alcoholic parent in a single-parent household.

As you will have noted, I pointed out that in extreme cases involving violence the equation could balance out, ie no significant difference between compelte and incomplete family. But other negative factors include poverty, disability of a family member, bad neighbourhood and more.

Off-Topic / Alternative households breed misery and are hell for the kids [11]


That's exactly Harry's approach. When he's lost for an anwer, he accuses his interlocutor of lying. Convenient but silly!

Off-Topic / Alternative households breed misery and are hell for the kids [11]


Got out on the wrong side of the bad, have we? I get the impression that some nerve is struck whenever families are mentioned. Do you feel personally attacked? You shouldn't because I know nothing of your personal situation nor do I want to know. Accusing me of "lying again"? Different version of things are found on the net. I did not alter what I found. Besides, this is not a scholarly symposium or dissertaion where every full stop, comma and footnote has to be in place, but a laid-back, friendly discussion.


It's a known fact that labour, social democratic, socialist or other leftist governments tend to promote permissive anything-goes attitudes, whilst conservative ones defend proven, time-honoured traditions and non-dysfuinctional families.

Off-Topic / Alternative households breed misery and are hell for the kids [11]


Not to annoy but educate. Yes, but all things considered, a complete famly even if poor, with health or drinking problems or otherwise disadvanatged is still less toxic to kids than a incomplete or dysfucntional one. I recall one Englishwoman saying in an interview that her dad was a man of few words and rarely provided any family input. He came home from work, ate supper and mainly sat in front of the telly with a beer, BUT HE WAS THERE and that made all the difference.

Since I have always been interested in family, over the years I have read many studies but I'm at a loss to relocate them. Many were pre-digital articles and reviews in various publications. But if anyone had the need and patience, I'm sure a category by category chart could be compiled comparing the impact on children of different family/household arrangements:

complete and poor v incomplete and poor
complete with serious disability v incomplete with serious disability
complete and unemployed v incomplete and unemployed
complete with drinking problem v incomplete with drinking problem*
and many other categories. Do you have any doubts as to which side would prove more determinetal to raising kids, although individual exceptions always can occur.

*If the drinking problem involved repeated vilolence towards the spouse and children as well as impoverishing the family by selling household assets for booze, then the equation might even out.

Life / Family, Community --> Society "The Polish Way" [29]


Have you ever been on one? There's all kinds of stuff on the net especially in the sensationalist, titillating and outrageous departments.
I agree that Smopensk does not grab the young, but the consequences of Magdalenka certainly affect their opportunities. Magdalenka fossilised the KOR/Commie monopoly which with a few short breaks (1992; 2005-2007)

have undeservedly reaped excessive benefits from transformation at the expense of the majority of Poles.
The young may not know much about Magdalenka, because the post-commie powers that be tried to sweep it under the carpet. But as PiS develop one good change after another, the full truth about what actually happened in Poland will come out.

I had hoped you had been cured of name-calling. I will not reciprtocate with something like "creeps like you...", because I truly cherish open but civil discussion about issues. I can sling mud with the best of 'em, but why bother?!

Life / Family, Community --> Society "The Polish Way" [29]


Not in the West, but in Poland it definitely is. 75% youth participation in national pilgrimages is the norm in Poland. Haven't got comparative stats but I'd wager that other than Poland not many other countries would place the family at the top of one's priorities. The "sex sells" pansexualism that began infecting the West in the 1960s has made inroads into Poland, but considerably smaller ones than elsewhere. Dunno where you're based, but any perceptive person living in Poland can see that whether or not they personally support it.

A few years ago few kids would think of wearing a PW (Polska Walcząca) T-shirt or other patrioic gadget. Now they're growing in popularity. The PO scamster & greed climate ideally correpsonded to the MTV mentality of instant of gratification and glamourisng the outrageous. That is no longer the

prevailing Zeitgeist.