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Posts by PlasticPole  

Joined: 28 May 2009 / Female ♀
Last Post: 18 Dec 2021
Threads: Total: 7 / In This Archive: 7
Posts: Total: 2641 / In This Archive: 1630

Displayed posts: 1637 / page 35 of 55
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PlasticPole   
4 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

It was a great idea.

I think trying to keep Russia under control would have been far more difficult than defeating them militarily..

We have never tried to set up a puppet for a country that large.
PlasticPole   
3 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

He just thought the red army was a bigger threat than the Nazis and he was right about that. The Red Army was the bigger and badder of the two. What right does he have to march on Moscow, though? The only thing we could have done to better the situation was push the red army back into USSR but that would have meant a lot more fighting and death.

Then the west would be the ones sitting in Eastern Europe. Once we left, who knows, the Red Army could come right back in.
PlasticPole   
3 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

Nobody else was keen to take on the Red army..everyone was tired of war....

That would have been extremely hard considering what the Red Army was...who knows how long it would have stayed "weakened", anyway. People thought it was weak when Germany invaded Moscow...then look what happened. The outcome would have been poor no matter what the west did.

The only possible thing we could have done to end it quickly and push the Russians back was drop a nuke, but there was so much destruction in Eastern Europe already...people didn't want any more bombings.
PlasticPole   
3 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

It was a terrible situation and that's an understatement :(
If we knew then what we know now, perhaps negotiations could have meant avoiding the cold war...
PlasticPole   
3 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

The cutting off of an entire german army at Stalingrad

They were fighting the reich and knew what would happen if they lost. They were desperate to not end up a nation of POWs.
PlasticPole   
3 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

1943

We see the transition from German forces being more concentrated to diluted. Germany begins to lose. This supports the theory that multiple theatres on Germany's behalf made the Reich weaker thus changing the outcome.
PlasticPole   
3 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

Same mistake to underestimate the "Russian bear" like many "great leaders" made also A.H.. Tja, Austrians...

NEVER underestimate Russia! It is to be respected and feared.
PlasticPole   
2 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

Why do we need links to back up what most people recognize as historical fact. Do I need a link to convince you guys the iron curtain fell? Is that a figment of my imagination. What about the Soviet Bloc. Did I make that up as well?
PlasticPole   
2 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

But we split up later after germanic law into more then 500 little statelets..

It's better to be united ;)
PlasticPole   
2 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

Of course....because it was.
But I think there was a point where Germans stopped caring. Where was all these "agression" screamers as Germans got raped by their neighbours for centuries just because they had NOT been big, NOT been powerfull, NOT been agressive!

Germany had always been a strong people, even during the Roman empire when the barbaric germanic tribes refused to be invaded like most of Europe. They just sucked at diplomacy. They tried to get their way by using force and connivance when they should have used tact and diplomacy instead. Germany tends to be impatient.

What should Germany had done prior to wwii? Seeing that it wasn't going to get it's way with the treaty, they should have sweet talked and tried diplomatic solutions. That would have won them more friends and proponents. Instead, they made a lot of enemies. This is the real reason they lost.

They thought the world would be awed by the power of the wehrmacht and that would be enough. History has proven it wasn't. You need more than just weapons and strategy to win a war.
PlasticPole   
2 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

It's because of our history....

After being the amboss and the marching ground by bigger neighbours Germans had enough of it and after the disaster of the 30 years war Prussia started to build it's empire out of the brandenburgian sand

Some people viewed this as militaristic aggression. What it comes down to is numbers. Who is pro Prussian and who isn't. If the overall majority are pro Prussian, Germany gets to do what it wants. If not, it doesn't. It really is that simple.
PlasticPole   
2 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

and after the WW1 they weren't even allowed to have a regular army. I guess that was the time when they gathered the most of their military experience.

It was because Prussia was causing so many problems in central Europe :/

People were sick of it.
PlasticPole   
2 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

yes the Germans were very well trained

Germans fought so many wars for so long. Ask Nietzsche. They were very militaristic and full of themselves. Thats why philosophers like Nietzsche wanted to be good Europeans above Prussians. They criticized Prussian arrogance by establishing themselves as not having a nationality.

Even if you despise Nietzsche, you can learn a lot about Prussian arrogance before wwi and ii from reading books like All Too Human.
PlasticPole   
2 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

another pro Soviet here?

What do you mean "pro soviet". It's not a matter of being pro or against. It's a matter of historical fact. We have one army pushing back another. German army did well in spots but ultimately it was the USSR's army who advanced the furthest west.
PlasticPole   
2 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

The Germans were winning because of their brilliant military tactics and because of their (mostly) better military equipment. As far as the numbers, the Soviets had way more airplanes and tanks from the beginning on and were still losing (very fast) until the very cold winter came and the negative results on the other fronts started affecting the German military power in the war against the SU too.

The Germans were better armed, no argument there. As for their blitzkrieg tactic, that originated in Poland :)
PlasticPole   
2 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

Newsflash, the only way Hitler could achieve victory was drawing Poland in and no german commander would dream of that and no thats not chauvinism or anything, Poland had over 1.5 milion additional soldiers, even with outdated equipment thats enough to, for example storm Leningrad.

Germany wanted to invade the country they perceived as having the greatest numbers in their military and could quickly become better armed and quite lethal. That could have very well been their motivation for invading Poland. Same goes for the USSR which led to the signing of the Rippetoe pact. This way it was one less thing for Stalin and Hitler to worry about.

The allies could have been taken by surprise, not expecting anything so quick and also not thinking Hitler would go back on his word. Perhaps the long term plan was to arm Poland as a westernized country in eastern Europe...Germany felt threatened and feared an inability to compete with it's larger neighbor.

USSR clearly saw the westernizing of Poland as a threat to the culture of eastern Europe. Capitalism was an evil, they thought. So both Germany and USSR had an interest in invading Poland.
PlasticPole   
2 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

Since there was a Hitler, no one can know for sure. Maybe someone else would have been the Nazi leader, someone more intelligent than he and better at convincing people to ally themselves with Germany and fight with it. Then you would have had a European continent with a strong German influence throughout. Perhaps America would have been friendlier as well.
PlasticPole   
2 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

That may or may not be true since there were underlings who shared his vehemence and his philosophy. A few might have actually been worse than he.
PlasticPole   
2 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

True. But you should ask yourself if the Nazis would have been just as bad without him...only more adept at winning wars...
PlasticPole   
2 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

You seem to totally ignore what I'm saying.

I do get your point. Everyone agrees Hitler was the Nazi flaw.
PlasticPole   
2 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

We've learned a lot since then. Number one is, do not act like a big shot just because you have a few tanks, subs and planes. It's more important to have people on your side than all sorts of glittering machinery. Shear numbers win wars unless you are talking nuclear.
PlasticPole   
2 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

Of course we have and I told you earlier why, Hitler attacked to many countries at the same time. In a case of the SU, additionally came the really cold winter that helped the Soviets to beat the Germans.

He would have ran into just as much trouble focusing all his attention on Russia. Russian resolve would have eventually exhausted the wehrmacht, leaving Britain, France and America opportunity to sweep in and get him from the west. He just didn't have enough people in his army to be that powerful and others were not fighting for him. He was isolated. He would have burned himself out, eventually, no matter what.
PlasticPole   
2 Jan 2011
History / Former American President Adams in Poland. [54]

They had to tax something, an income tax would have been very unpopular.

The tea tax had nothing to do with paying for a colonist's army. As for Native Americans, they haven't faired worse than Australian aborigines yet there was never any Australian revolution. Apparently Britain didn't care about the plight of the indigenous any more than the American colonists did...
PlasticPole   
2 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

Well yes...and then we have reality. Fall of Nazi Germany. Division of Europe. Rise of the iron curtain. Why did all that happen if the Red Army was smoke. We have historical documentation and we have outcome. I choose to let outcome preside.

You think all these people would let that outcome happen if the Red Army was this weak, ineffective thing?
PlasticPole   
2 Jan 2011
History / Former American President Adams in Poland. [54]

It was because Britain was taxing tea that entered Boston Harbor. It was still cheaper in the colonies than it was in Europe, but the colonists did not want to pay the tea tax. Britain was trying to monopolize the tea market.
PlasticPole   
2 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

To any military observer, the Russian Army was on the verge of a total collapse and Moscow seemed destined to fall.

If that's true, why didn't it? Perhaps it was stronger than we know...

The Blitzkrieg can only go so far, gw, before it fizzles out. Remember, slow and steady wins the race and that's what the Soviet Union did. It was slow but with so many soldiers and resolve Stalin could send several divisions west. In case one was defeated, there was another fighting after it.

Soviet union had a gigantic army that Hitler couldn't defeat and that's a fact. That is how Europe became divided. No one wanted to fight Stalin and push back the Red Army.
PlasticPole   
2 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

Just read the link I provided above.

Read the link Ironside provided. It's about Viktor Suvorov, a spy who wrote about the Red Army and Stalin. I believe what he writes about Stalin using Hitler to further communism. He seems to have done that.
PlasticPole   
2 Jan 2011
History / Polish flag over the Reichstag first? [399]

YES PP (lol). The point is that they wouldn't have the Germans outnumbered if Hitler wouldn't attack so many countries at the same time.

Maybe. Maybe not. He was so worried about Bolshevikism, yet he didn't focus on the source of Bolshevikism, the Soviet Union. He was spread thin, but I doubt he would have beat the Russians anyway. Besides, he would have concentrated his military on Russia only to find France, Britain and others attacking his exposed Western border.

Either way he was completely outnumbered! Even with the wehrmacht, he would have had trouble fighting the Russians first, everyone else after.