News / Becoming non-EUnuch -> giving up your share of handouts. [36]


You do realise that countless people in Poland are dependent upon EU cash for their livelihoods? The EU has allowed the insane small peasant farmholdings to be viable, for a start.


Currency is meaningless, the painful measures (and the point blank refusal to pay for some of what they did) is what helped them. Greece could have perfectly well told the banks to get lost too, but there's a world of difference between owning a few billion and the massive amount that the Greeks owe.


Hardly. Greece is in that situation because they've cheated themselves for years, not because of Germany or anyone else. The Netherlands are a comparable size - are they in trouble? No.

Work / Minimum basic salary in Poland [96]


Normal in Poland to pretend that things are much worse than they really are.

Work / Minimum basic salary in Poland [96]


A cashier doesn't earn that kind of money in the cities or even big towns because quite honestly, no-one will get out of bed for that.

The only people who will get out of bed for that are the ones who are already claiming "renta" and who want to be paid on the side.

Anyway, the article is also hopeless because the salaries listed are just wildly inaccurate. The average incomes are right, but apart from that...?

Work / Minimum basic salary in Poland [96]


That article is hopeless - cashiers don't earn 6PLN/hour. Heck, I struggled to find a finance assistant with responsibility for preparing accounts for less than (the cost to me) 6000zl!

Real Estate / TRANSFORMING AGRICULTURALLY USED AREA TO FREE TIME AREA IN POLAND? [8]


I missed this before - but thank you!

Maybe we should make a thread containing useful information about Poland that isn't written in English anywhere online? This is certainly one of the most useful things to know!

Work / Minimum basic salary in Poland [96]


Over-educated. I threw a CV in the bin the other day from such a person - she had two degrees (both bardzo dobry), had the CAE certificate - all in all, great in education. But - she was 27, had no work experience (except some work experience for a month in a "fashionable" place to get experience) and had absolutely nothing on the CV that said "talk to me".

Two degrees mean nothing - it's about what you can do.


Underpaid? Why are they underpaid? Is it perhaps because they're lazy, can't be bothered to work extra hours to get ahead and want to run off at 3pm to cook for some stupid kids rather than work the extra hours needed? If you want to work in a shop from 7am-3pm and not a minute more, you have to accept that you'll always earn nothing. It's just the way it is.


Not bullshit at all, but rather the sad reality that families would rather send their kids at 17 to work for 500-600zl a month than staying in school.


You think social services in a village (where everyone knows each other anyway) are going to intervene in such a case?


If the child can earn more by working than by staying in school, they'll try and put the kid into work.


All to do with the fact that many Polish students like to party and go for nice holidays rather than putting the effort in. I could tell you numerous stories about students who have blown golden chances because they wanted to go for crap holidays in the mountains instead.

At the end of the day, people have to help themselves rather than waiting for someone to help them.

Work / Minimum basic salary in Poland [96]


Unfortunately, it's the case in Eastern Poland. Children are frequently "encouraged" by the family to leave school and start working instead - because earning an extra 600zl now makes more sense than getting an education. At least in their view.


In a country with free universal education, it certainly is. I know one guy who came from a ******** family who couldn't afford to put him to university. He knuckled down, worked his ass off in a succession of horrible jobs and somehow managed to study full time too - he left with a so-so degree, but his work ethic has blown away every single employer - and he's now building a huge house for himself and his family. He came from a PGR village - but his parents crucially pushed him in the right direction, even if they couldn't help him get there.


Exactly the sort of mentality that I'm talking about. People try and improve their lot, but they often don't want it - such places are extremely dysfunctional. They would rather spend the day wasted than working.

Work / Minimum basic salary in Poland [96]


Indeed. I'm almost certain that if you opened up a factory in many of these villages, they wouldn't take the jobs anyway - they wouldn't want to work to someone else's standards and ways. How often do you read and hear about hungry children in villages - it's all too often the result of neglect rather than actual poverty.

It's interesting to note that despite unemployment being higher in the East (and so - wages should be lower) - new factories are opening in the West, not the East. Could it be something to do with mentality?

Work / Minimum basic salary in Poland [96]


Lucky? What's lucky about working hard and achieving something for yourself? Instead of taking your kids out of school to work on some crappy "business" like what frequently happens in villages, getting them educated is by far the more sensible approach.

I don't think it's a coincidence that the hardest working people I know (usually the ones who went for work experience during university rather than nice holidays) are also the richest.

Incidentally, I know plenty of people earning more than average. All of them have one thing in common - they worked hard for it and didn't sit around blaming everyone else.


Why should someone who turns up at exactly 7am, leaves at exactly 3pm and who does nothing to improve themselves get any more?


No, that small parcel is what keeps them peasants. If these farms were bigger and more productive, they would have meaningful employment and everyone would be better for it.

News / Should countries be boycotted for offending Poles? [60]


This is often the important part - not the salary, but rather the workplace itself.

Work / Minimum basic salary in Poland [96]


Even higher than I thought then - nearly 50k a year.


It's also dragged down by many peasants in villages who live off small parcels of land - I'm pretty certain this is why Poland appears (on paper) to be far poorer than the Czech Republic despite living standards being clearly higher in Warsaw than Prague, etc.


Not bad. A couple both earning average wage can easily afford decent accommodation in a Polish city by those figures.

Work / Minimum basic salary in Poland [96]


Poor show, milky.

The average wage is now nearing 45000 a year.

Don't mistake lazy peasants in villages with normal people.

History / Polish Officer in NATO, Col. Ryszard Kukliński. [145]


But was it for the greater good, or was it for other reasons?

If he was simply upset with the invasion of Czechoslovakia and so on, he could easily have defected to the West and left it at that.

News / Should countries be boycotted for offending Poles? [60]

The only people who would boycott such things are the ones who wouldn't be buying anyway, if you ask me...

Love / Getting married in Poland (papers stating we are eligible to get married?) Certificate of no impediment. [24]


What is known as a 'certificate of no impediment' - as you reference here -


- isn't available for US citizens. It has a very precise meaning in Polish law, and it is simply unobtainable for them.

Trying to cover up your error by claiming that it is "obtainable in a different form" is - frankly - rubbish.


A wedding planner? Why bother, when the process is laid out in law and is very clear as to what you need to do?


Not at all, though if she's not Polish, it probably doesn't matter.


Not really - Poland is very keen on paper trails, which is why identity theft doesn't exist here. If you don't like it, there are plenty of other countries to get married in.


Steer clear. It doesn't appear to be a registered business (any credible business will have their NIP listed on the website) - which is highly suspicious.

The advice given on the website is also wrong, and shouldn't be relied on. Also -


Suspicious.

The costings that she gives are also on the high side - 1,000zl for a bus is an utter scam, for instance - you can easily get this for 500zl.


What Harry says is the definitive answer. Unfortunately, you will have to attend court here.

Law / Poland has too much redtape [14]


It's going!

Apparently the whole zameldowanie system will be scrapped at the start of next year - though I can't figure out why they don't just move to the Finnish system where you're obliged to have an official address, but it's just a mere declaration (made online if you want) without any nonsense about rights to stay there and so on.

Real Estate / GET A MORTGAGE FROM A POLISH BANK OF A REAL ESTATE IN POLAND IF YOU ARE A GERMAN CITIZEN [7]


Depends how good a client you will be. However, if your family is in extreme financial difficulty, the bank is unlikely to regard you as being worth the effort.


Why don't you approach a German bank? Some of them are also present in Poland, such as Deutsche Bank and DnB Nord.

Life / Is Poland a poor country? [578]


Isn't there a shitload of foreign investment there at the minute?

I was reading something a few days ago about the place, but I might have got mixed up...

Life / Is Poland a poor country? [578]


Not really - a person who does a physical job in the UK is often better off being unemployed. It's not an easy life, especially if they live somewhere expensive.

As for white collar jobs in Poland - the issue with this is often that they perceive themselves to be of a certain status and demand the status symbols to fit. They then drown under a mountain of debt. I've seen it happen to someone who was earning around 4k netto - not horrible money, but she bought a very nice flat and car, then struggled to live. If she'd bought within her means, she would be fine.


Katowice is definitely better off, but I've never been to the others so can't comment fairly.


Recent comparison I can make is with the Czech Republic. Prague is behind Warsaw, and there doesn't appear to be much construction going on (unlike in Poland). It certainly seems like the statistics are heavily skewed in Poland because of the existence of many poor small farmers - which didn't exist in Czechoslovakia. I'd actually say that Poland is developing faster these days - I really saw little sign of construction in Prague, and places like Nachod are absolutely horrible.

Life / Is Poland a poor country? [578]


Not exactly. Compare Warsaw to a grim ex-mining town/village in the UK and it's far better off, for instance. Jonny will tell you more than me, but in general - there are parts of Poland that are far better off than parts of the UK.


In Poland, it's not so much of an issue now - the rules that surround the granting of mortgages have tightened up, and pretty much ensures that no-one will get a mortgage that they can't afford to pay back.

Real Estate / TRANSFORMING AGRICULTURALLY USED AREA TO FREE TIME AREA IN POLAND? [8]

Gumishu - do they make plans like this without the consent of the property owner?

Say for instance, I own a big farm of 20ha on the edge of a village. Can they decide that in the future, it will become a landfill site, some houses and a new high school without my knowledge/permission?

Life / Is Poland a poor country? [578]


The same ones complaining about council tax despite being asset rich. As much as I'm liberal minded, I have no patience for such people - if I can't afford taxes, I have to sell my assets - why shouldn't they?

Love / Getting married in Poland (papers stating we are eligible to get married?) Certificate of no impediment. [24]

Part of the problem is that people don't negotiate when it comes to a wedding - if she told them to get real, they'd soon cut the price. But the problem in Poland is that there's a lot of "look at me, I paid 4.5k for a band". Same nonsense is seen with a lot of other stuff.


Did you read the previous posts properly?

He can't obtain such a thing - the US Embassy won't issue one.

Seems to me that getting married as a US citizen when you don't reside in Poland is going to be an exceptionally tricky process.

Life / Is Poland a poor country? [578]


Agreed. There's a lot of people out there who either inherited decent properties (that they can barely afford to live in - but they won't sell because they know they'll get more if they hang onto it - madness) or they took huge mortgages on properties that they can barely afford now, but will be able to afford in the future.

One interesting figure - at least until the end of last year, banks were lending on the basis of one year's accounts from self employment. I've heard mumblings that some people were submitting nonsense invoices to made up people to artificially increase their income, paying tax on the "income" and then presenting the figures to banks. The banks, obviously impressed with their high income, were happy to grant mortgages to them - and that's how some people managed to buy much more than they could outwardly afford.

When I was buying a flat, I kept running into a lot of people no older than 30 who had inherited granny's flat - and they wanted ridiculous amounts for them.

Real Estate / GET A MORTGAGE FROM A POLISH BANK OF A REAL ESTATE IN POLAND IF YOU ARE A GERMAN CITIZEN [7]


Why? You can do everything in a day if funds are available.


Yes, although it's going to take several weeks - and you might find that the banks will do very thorough checking of you.


No idea. Banks tend to make this stuff up as they go along, especially for esoteric cases.

If you really need cash quickly, it shouldn't be a problem to sell the place for 50% of the market value quickly..

Travel / Driving in Poland, are there any rules at all? [149]


Pretty much. It's never dull to drive in, unlike the tedious nightmare that is driving through Slovakia.

It's worth pointing out that such behaviour like crossing solid lines between lanes, overtaking in no-overtaking zones and so on is rarely, if ever punished.

I was driving home one night about 2am, sitting at about 90km/h (bang on the limit) when some guy overtook me. Fine and well - but this was on a bloody crossroads at the time!

History / Polish Officer in NATO, Col. Ryszard Kukliński. [145]

But that's in Poland - isn't it quite the sport for the well-to-do in the US and Britain?

Study / Secondary education in Poland [20]


No doubt - it's a reference to how private schools in Poland are notorious for being bought off by parents with cash and loud voices. He wouldn't be able to do a thing about it - interference from "above" is still normal in Polish academia, unfortunately.


It's all handled at a regional level, so while the Ministry dictates standards, there isn't a central examining body as such.


Isn't it just? I do freelance marketing stuff as a hobby, and while I have "papers" for it - I learnt more in 2 weeks doing it for real than I learnt in the entire time studying it.

Study / Secondary education in Poland [20]


I wonder - I need to check if the absurdity of not having to sit a written exam if you get a high grade in the oral exam still exists.

Study / Secondary education in Poland [20]


In school ;) Private schools that are accredited by the MEN (ie, pretty much all of them except the ones going towards foreign qualifications) are allowed to act as matura centres.


Apprenticeships seem to be unheard of in Poland - the usual pattern now is that people get forced into high schools, they fail their Matura, then they go to some post-school place where they have to "study' for 2-3-4 years to get a paper of "something" which qualifies them to work as "something.

Insane system - and the employers are to blame for demanding papers for everything. There is a scary attitude in Poland that you can't do something unless you have papers for it, despite apprenticeships being far more sensible.