Travel / Things to see along eastern Poland by bicycle [42]


Are you telling us that our frankness and honesty (greatly appreciated in Sweden) are wrong?
Is it not right that we are giving you safety tips (and Swedes are obsessed with safety)?

Bernie, if you know better, don't ask questions.

I personally wish you all the best and safe voyage!

Travel / Train from Poland to Serbia and car from Lithuania to Budapest [15]

Four and half hours. There is nothing complicated on the route.

Travel / Train from Poland to Serbia and car from Lithuania to Budapest [15]

Allani, both routes are poor and I will tell you why. I will finally recommend a third route to you.

In Eastern Poland close to Lithuania, you have not many options. If you take the eastern way, the roads are in poor conditions, no dual carriageways. However I believe the traffic on the route might not be that heavy... Finally, you are getting into mountain driving in Subcarpathia after Rzeszów, continue through Slovakia and enter Hungary near to Miskolc. If I were in your position and had plenty of time, I would took my chances and drove


hoping for gain from lighter traffic.

The route


is wrong in general for two reasons: Major construction works between Warszawa and Katowice; and tremendous traffic jams in Warsaw. Besides it is very long route even if after Katowice you are driving on expressways and motorways. The distance will be so long that no speed will help you recover wasted time.

My recommended route will be, pay attention now:
Segment 1: Drive from Vilnius to Ostrów Mazowiecika via Augustów, Grajewo, £omża (Routes 16 and 61 in Poland)
Segment 2: Białystok - Ostrów Mazowiecka (Route E67, National Route 8)
Segment 3: Ostrów Mazowiecka -> Mińsk Mazowiecki via £ochów (switch to Route 50 southwards)
Segment 4: Continue on Route 50 to (near to) Grójec and switch to E77, National Route 7 towards Radom
Segment 5: Drive on Route 7 via Radom, Kielce, to Kraków
Segment 6: Pass Kraków and stay on E77/7 until you reach Polish/Slovak border in Chyżne/Trstena
Segment 7: Go on Slovak roads via Dolny Kubin, Ruzomberok, Banska Bystrica, Krupina, Šahy border crossing to Hungary, continue via Vac to Budapest.

I would choose this route myself if I were you.

Note: You need to buy the sticker for your car for Slovakia and "electronic sticker" for Hungary, for paying toll-roads in advance.

Sorry! I was developing the route and made mistakes.

Here's the recommended route, correctly:
Segment 1: Drive from Vilnius to Ostrów Mazowiecka via Augustów, Grajewo, £omża (Routes 16 and 61 in Poland)
Segment 2: Ostrów Mazowiecka -> Mińsk Mazowiecki via £ochów (switch to Route 50 southwards)
Segment 3: Continue on Route 50 to (near to) Grójec and switch to E77, National Route 7 towards Radom
Segment 4: Drive on Route 7 via Radom, Kielce, to Kraków
Segment 5: Pass Kraków and stay on E77/7 until you reach Polish/Slovak border in Chyżne/Trstena
Segment 6: Go on Slovak roads via Dolny Kubin, Ruzomberok, Banska Bystrica, Krupina, Šahy border crossing to Hungary, continue via Vac to Budapest.

I have to add I live some 10 km to the Warsaw -> Katowice road and some 15 km to the E77/7, at the south side of Warsaw and was taking all possible routes to Budapest already in the past; I've been also from my place farther than Augustów towards Lithuania several times; so I know what I'm talking about. ;-)

Travel / Things to see along eastern Poland by bicycle [42]


The view of the Route 16 from Augustów towards Ogrodniki, crammed with large trucks both ways and trying to overtake a cyclist swaying on the edge of the road is just priceless.

History / What was it like in 1989+ in Poland when the Soviet house of cards fell? [237]

Ironside, we are in the history thread. I'm describing my own experiences from 1989- and 1989+. The lessons of history are to be learned; unluckily most of people never learn from history.

You (and not only you) seem a person dissatisfied with the Poland's progress since 1989. I hear different conspiracy theories. I read giving the damn to the present Government. I read about magical recipes for the welfare of Poland. And what I want to tell you and some other people here:

Poland has gone a long way with great success since 1989. As pretty normal and decent country, Poland has own problems no doubt. Still it does not mean we are not living in a decent and successful country, thanks to so despised Leszek Balcerowicz and others. There was time when Adam Michnik, Antoni Macierewicz, Lech Wałęsa and Janusz Korwin-Mikke could work together for the common good; and some of them like Michnik were doing their time in prison or (later) internment for their activities.

You Ironside appear to me as a rather young and unhappy person. Perhaps because you hadn't survived the history lesson by your own experience. You simply miss a perspective, a reference point.

Travel / Things to see along eastern Poland by bicycle [42]

Magdalena, I am perfectly aware you are afraid to lose face but it is nothing wrong to admit you were wrong when two seasoned drivers/cyclist/kayakers living in Poland tell you the same story... You see, I was 10-yo when my Dad took me for a day long bicycle trip near to Ruciane-Nida on the dirt trails and I was crying from being so tired... And then I have been an active cyclist for next 23 years.

My best kayaking trip was by the river Obra in West Poland, by the way.

Travel / Things to see along eastern Poland by bicycle [42]


Subject closed, Magdalena?


It would be quite natural to ask Beanyboo how long time he plans using for Poland.
He could of course send his bicycle as postal shipment by train and then enjoy trains, buses, hiking...

Travel / Things to see along eastern Poland by bicycle [42]

Magdalena, you sound a non-cyclist to me, especially with no feeling about the reality of the Eastern Wall.
The Swede needs to cover the distance of 380 km, meaning over 50 km daily, and he has to take rest sometimes, make a bivouac too.
You simply do not realize what 50 km daily means in off-road cycling. Going through the forest paths, sandy village roads, mud when it's raining, crossing streams and bypassing swamps... He would be crawling if he does not take somewhat normal roads.

If you are so excited with encouraging our Swedish friend, why don't you try yourself? I can only tell you: 60 km on normal roads in full Summer sun is already a challenge. Now, you suggest the Swede crawls over the Poland B paths? This is a survival task.

Taking water paths in the whole Augustów area is quite reasonable. Have you ever heard of Kanał Augustowski? Look at the map and see the waterways.

Language / The differences between these words: Oni plywaja / plyna / biegaja /biegna /chodza /ida [18]


True. However, if they only use to be running for exercise, my version is better.

Travel / Things to see along eastern Poland by bicycle [42]


Nothing more wrong. Rivers, lakes, swamps, forests. We call it "Poland B" or The Eastern Wall due to underdevelopment.

I go yearly to the Rock-Szanty/RockWater Festival in Serwy near Augustów, so I think I know. It is easier to travel with a kayak.

Travel / Things to see along eastern Poland by bicycle [42]

No, Magdalena, it's not that simple. An exercise I might give to you were you my guest would be to tell you to cross the Las Młochowski from Podkowa Leśna to Nadarzyn Refugee Camp, very short route. You would almost die trying to cycle over the paths of the Las. Then, there would be no way to get to the Refugee Camp than cycle along the 720, no cycle lane. While you could do it easy by going via 719/720 risking your life in the traffic. I know, I tried both routes... Flat terrain, picturesque, only 25 km SW of Warsaw...

Use maps.google.pl to show you this route:

Podkowa Leśna, Słowicza
Nadarzyn, Cyprysowa, Strzeniówka

Then look at the map and note there is a forest (with hiking routes!) and even Google Maps cannot help you with a hiking route via the Las Młochowski ;)

Language / The differences between these words: Oni plywaja / plyna / biegaja /biegna /chodza /ida [18]


Funny thing, I would say as well:
"Dwa razy w tygodniu biegają wokół stadionu" and it would be valid too. "They use to be running around the stadium twice a week".

Because running takes time, a lot of time. 'Biegają" (running) means something takes considerable amount of time, while "biegną" (run) is somewhat awkward in this context although formally correct. (Both sentences would be valid, my sentence sounding and feeling better).

The problem of foreigners learning Polish is they have no other way than obeying to the grammar rules, while fluent Polish is far more complex.

Travel / Things to see along eastern Poland by bicycle [42]

He has to cross quite wild areas, with a lot of rivers and streams. Have you been doing cycling on a long route, for example in Masuria, Magdalena? Something not shorter than 60 km per day?

History / What was it like in 1989+ in Poland when the Soviet house of cards fell? [237]


May I ask you how old are you and for how many years have you been living in the PRL?

Polish Punk. You believe, I am an eye-witness.

Let me, Rybnik, go back 10-11 years earlier, pre-1989. This is related to the picture shown above.
Sometimes in Summer 1977, Wojciech Mann broadcast some punk-rock music on the Channel Three of Polskie Radio ("Trójka"). This was a single broadcast to which I and my pals listened with unbelievable interest (I was told Lech Janerka, the Wrocław-based musician, listened to the very same broadcast and after having heard Jean-Jacques Burnel of The Stranglers, Janerka picked up the bass guitar himself). Due to censorship, no more broadcasts of that type were allowed. In Autumn 1978, someone placed small had-made posters in Warsaw, announcing a "meeting of punks" at the Warsaw REMONT students' club. This was the beginning of the Warsaw punk-rock movement, "One Hundred Punks". A band called The Boors (later Kryzys, Brygada Kryzys) consisting of my mates started practicing. Early May 1979 saw the first Warsaw punk concert, The Boors et al., in Anin. People like Kazik Staszewski, Irek Wereński, and others to become leading musicians were there; in addition to other people who made career in photography or movie-making, all centered around alternative music and thinking. People such as Tomek Lipiński joined very soon after. bands such as Deadlock, Poland, Deuter, TILT and many other emerged in Warsaw soon, with bands such as KSU or Bikini in other places in Poland.

Here are three retrospectives, all based on original music recording by me and other people at that time:





Now, let us come to the Commie oppression of those times. Not only me and my mates started attending the school in (quite modest!) punk outfit but I also asked my Dad to photocopy two issues of my fanzin SZMATA at his workplace, which was absolutely forbidden. The director of our school was a Red Commie with links to the secret police. First, she was using girls of our school to spy on us, to steal "evidence" from us (such as copies of the fanzin). Next, she was anonymously informing the police we were a terrorist gang which resulted in visits of policemen at our homes and interrogations. I need to point out the regular policemen were OK people! They were real policemen, so after finding out the denunciation had no ground, they left us alone. Then, parents were called in by the director and the parents were threatened with losing their jobs, and we were threatened to be thrown out from the educational system...

Luckily, we were allowed to make Matura (it was already 1980) and then, just after the First New Wave Festival, the Solidarity emerged in Gdańsk and the life has changed very much, at least for next 1.5 years. And then we had the martial law. I actively participated in the NZS at that time, being a university student.

Now you may understand Rybnik: I know what oppression means and how hopeless life we all were living in pre-1989 Poland. Now, when I read the whining of the Believers, I can only laugh. They either don't know or they have already forgotten...

The last thing, before I forget.

In December 1981, just before the martial law, there were student strikes in Warsaw in which I participated. Adam Michnik and Antoni Macierewicz were with us at Politechnika Warszawska, Jacek Kuroń too (and Janusz Korwin-Mikke was teaching students the principles of free economy soon after, already during the martial law).

Me and my friends were placing NZS posters on walls and lamp-posts on one very cold early December morning. Suddenly we reached a closed butcher-shop. There was a long line of almost frozen to death, zombie-like individuals waiting and hoping perhaps some meat would be delivered by chance. When they saw us, they loudly -- very aggressively -- demanded that we go away or "police comes and no chance for meat". Civilization and caves are two meals away... At that moment, I thought to myself: "I don't know what the future holds but I promise never forget this sight".

I dedicate it to Ironside, Sokrates and other Believers.

Language / The verb "to stay" [6]


All the sentences are very good and don't ask me why. Bzibzioh is right: "Zatrzymałem się" is the best choice.

Zostać means "to become". (Po)zostać means "stay" as if in "stay where you are!" although "Nie ruszaj się (z miejsca)!" would be far better.

Similar confusion is related to English "become" and German "bekommen", where "bekommen" means "to receive, get". German equivalent of "stay" is "bleiben". All these things make Poles learning English or German confused, because there is no direct and clear Polish translation of the verb "stay/bleiben".

Life / bicycle feasibility in Warsaw [11]

See also: Things to see along eastern Poland by bicycle.

I would say Wrocław is a bike-friendly city. Warsaw is not.

Travel / Things to see along eastern Poland by bicycle [42]


Isn't it mandatory to wear the cycle helmet in Poland?


Really, not nowadays. I used to be an active cyclist until 1994, always having very strong lights on my bicycle in the dark. One evening I drove through completely empty Warsaw street (now Jana Pawła II). Some worker had left a black cable hanging from a street lamp/tree. My bike got entangled with the cable and I fell full speed... Luckily, the pedal straps on my sports cycle acted as if they were safety belts. So I banged the surface with my head lightly and my neck was never the same after. The elbow required surgical intervention. Mind you, it was a central avenue of Warsaw, technically lit by street lamps, no traffic at all, and still I had the accident. Now imagine 2011 with heavy traffic...

Warszawski has seen the corpse, I've seen many dead bodies of cyclists, and what is the most infuriating is two or three cyclists easily pedaling side by side, unlit, no protective jackets...

Travel / Car Museum in Warsaw. [13]

No, I've checked it out. Kubuś was reconstructed by Juliusz Siudziński in his workshop in Warszawa-Anin.
In Polish: naukowy.pl/encyklopedia/Juliusz_Siudzi%C5%84ski

Interesting pages here - movies involving the Museum exhibits:

muzeum-motoryzacji.com.pl/podstrony/filmy.php

---
Yes, their home page reads they have opened a subsidiary at Ząbkowska 38, Warszawa-Praga, in Fabryka Konesera.

Feedback / Suggestion: Skill test to eliminate moronic posters [7]

What are your political views?
1. The Duck for President and Prime Minister! (at the same time)
2. His brother to be beatified
3. The Cross at each street crossing!
4. Tusk to get all blames.
5. All the above.

Travel / Car Museum in Warsaw. [13]

The very border of Brwinów/Podkowa Leśna, warszawski, location called Borki, the name only known to old locals. This is the part of Brwinów beyond the route 719, neighbouring Podkowa.

Regarding the old London bus, you must be right. A Warsaw band called Strefa Mocnych Wiatrów once rented it out for their jubilee concert, I have seen some photos.

Sobieski, I can't be certain about the papamobile, yet those people were telling me stories and showing how they reconstructed the genuine cars. Impressive piece of work. I could see a wreck of an ancient car; two years later exhibited in mint conditions. Fanatics, but I fully support their passion!

Travel / Things to see along eastern Poland by bicycle [42]

I hope you'll be wearing the yellow fluorescent jacket and have strong lights on your bicycle? Only last Sunday I almost drove over two cyclist, one relying on a reflective red button at the rear of his bicycle, the other with no light or protective jacket, both at night. I was just thinking what the guy was doing 00:30 at a distant place, third rate road.

Travel / Things to see along eastern Poland by bicycle [42]

In the northern part, there will be mostly forests, lakes and fields, like in Sweden. In Białystok you'll see hundreds of churches, as Catholic and Orthodox compete with each other in the number of temples. Then my experience ends, I was not doing tourism south of Białystok at the Eastern Wall.

Travel / Train from Poland to Serbia and car from Lithuania to Budapest [15]

That's right, and there are plenty of buses from Budapest to Belgrade.

Travel / Car Museum in Warsaw. [13]


Same with wartime trucks or the Pope John Paul II vehicle (Papamobile).

How much did they charge you for renting those two cars, sobieski?

Travel / Hotel / Hostel in Wroclaw in the city centre - any recomendations? [13]

I'm terribly sorry -- I have updated the post above and can recommend Campanile Hotel to anybody. Same price, far more convenient from any angle.

Travel / Car Museum in Warsaw. [13]

That's "Otrębusy". I live some 1.5 km from the place and the museum is a "must-see" for all new friends visiting me.

Off-Topic / im a true polish patriot [30]

Is Off-Topic invisible to unregistered users, Marysia? I didn't know.
Funny thing: An unregistered users creates havoc then the thread is moved to off-topic, the troll cannot read it anymore but we, registered users still can see the garbage. Totally strange to me.

Travel / Hotel / Hostel in Wroclaw in the city centre - any recomendations? [13]

wodnik-hotel.pl

Sorry for my laconic answer above, Noduff. I prefer the Wodnik because the price is GBP60 for nice double room, breakfast included. The hotel is located close to the Odra River, has internal parking, Internet available in rooms (wireless and/or cable). Small, cozy hotel. I'm not sure whether the restaurant operates, though.

The only drawback is that -- although the hotel is seemingly located not so far from the Grunwaldzki Bridge and just opposite to the Technical University campus (that's on the other bank of the river), a pedestrian needs to walk around a kilometre to get to the next tram. I don't mind as I drive a car but you might consider taxis -- those are not that costly though.

-----------------------
But now I'm thinking and I could recommend just another hotel for you, the Campanile Wrocław:

campanile.com/Hotel/en/poland/wroc-aw.htm

Campanile is located only 1 kilometre from the very city centre, similar price for double room and as I can remember the standard is far higher there. Yes, decidedly, choose Campanile!

Remember book the room early, otherwise the hotel might be already full.

Off-Topic / im a true polish patriot [30]

I can share the peanut butter with you, wanna some?

Off-Topic / im a true polish patriot [30]

With peanut butter? ;-)