News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]


I couldn't word it better.

Yet when you let them talk, and stick to the facts, they will start making fools of themselves sooner rather than later. The goal is not to convince the troll but the others who may read it.

Let him talk and reap the benefits :-)

News / An EU army. Impact on Poland [155]


Sure it would: "refugee" crisis which has started the fall of Angela Merkel, a wave of terrorist attacks in Western Europe, Brexit, the rise of a Conservative government in Poland (which will btw. block such a project as an EU army), political changes in Austria and Italy, Trump presidency, and the rise of V4 and inception of Three Seas Initiative project...all of this has happened in just a last 3 years.


Yes, I cannot wait to see what happens next myself :-)

=========================================

Everything that could go wrong has gone wrong

~George Soros

News / An EU army. Impact on Poland [155]

Here's a very interesting material about it :

youtu.be/qKtaE2sezE4

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]

OK, so left-leaning Western media have started their usual narrative about Independence March. Nothing new here.
Instead of arguing with them I took a look at French festivities to compare them with the march in Warsaw.

Bastille Day in Paris [July 2018]:

Cars torched: 850 (900 in 2017 so there's a progress...)

Police have arrested 237 individuals, including 92 minors, for wreaking havoc in the Paris area

Polish Independence Day [Nov 2018]:

Cars torched: 0

No one got arrested and there was no havok

france.timesofnews.com/french-burn-850-cars-on-bastille-day-but-why-do-they-do-it

thelocal.fr/20180716/850-cars-torched-across-france-on-bastille-day-weekend

I guess there's a long way for Poland to learn Western 'culture'...


It is, Atch, but the devil is in the detail. I would support the new, improved "EU" which would only consist of a single [free] European market for goods and services. And nothing more, just the exchange of good, services and labour.

No political structure whatsoever. A union of a free, independent countries with their own monetary and political systems and laws.

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]

Kuwait



Croatia



Estonia



Lithuania




I'm not attacking you personally, I'm attacking German mentality as a whole which you represent. It's a self-defense from Polish perspective really. Germany has always, and it still does, tried to control Poland in every possible way.

That didn't change in a recent years since the Bundesrepublik is still using it's soft power: political influence, mass media, economical power to enforce certain decisions on Poland which are against Polish interests.

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]

@Bratwurst Boy, all jokes no substance, yes? :-)

No "national identity based on culture, language, religion" doesn't directly translates into "belief in national superiority"

One can value and protect his own cultural identity and integrity without feeling superior to the others, especially in an aggressive way.

Life / Why do Polish people love to say "No" to anything you ask? [12]


Maybe you should start asking different questions, my friend :-)

Here are few examples:

"may I offer you a place to sit [on a train]?"

"would you like me to invite you to a fancy restaurant, I'm paying?"

"Doesn't this politician look like a halfwit?"

"Nobody cooks better that grandma, am I right?"

I guarantee you'll hear "yes" more often

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]


Can't you see a clear difference between Nationalism and Chauvinism?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nationalism

So yes, Poland wants to be free from outside interference and wants to keep its national identity based on culture, language, religion (...)

and

Chauvinism is a form of extreme patriotism and a belief in national superiority and glory. Whereas patriotism and nationalism may represent temperate pride, chauvinism is intemperate. It can be also defined as "an irrational belief in the superiority or dominance of one's own group or people".[1] Moreover, the chauvinist's own people are seen as unique and special while the rest of the people are considered weak or inferior.

Just because in Germany nationalism lead to chauvinism doesn't mean that other countries can't have a healthy nationalism. You'll have to accept that Germans may be not the smartest nation on this planet and others can handle things better than you do.

O maybe I'm overestimating you Bratwurst Boy. You aren't on the same intellectual level as, let's say, delphiandomine, are you?

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]


That's a misinterpretation. Their grounding was in national chauvinism not a nationalism

"Whereas patriotism and nationalism may represent temperate pride, chauvinism is intemperate. It can be also defined as "an irrational belief in the superiority or dominance of one's own group or people.

Moreover, the chauvinist's own people are seen as unique and special while the rest of the people are considered weak or inferior"

Don't speak to me in neo marxist newspeak, Bratwurst Boy. Don't insult the intelligence of PolishForums members :-)

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chauvinism

And here's the link to Eiffel Tower illumination for Polish Independence Day...

twitter.com/notesfrompoland/status/1061675186313924609

Niagara Falls, Canada



Los Angeles, US



Helsinki, Finland



And New Zealand

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]

This is how the World celebrated Polish Independence Day

New York



Dubai ,Burj Khalifa



Egypt



Hungary



Paris

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]

Quarter million Polish patriots have marched on the streets of Warsaw in celebration of the Independence Day. Unity makes strength.

All the criticism of such an event sounds like a silent fart next to a Thunder :-]

youtu.be/k98_6793bkk




Wrong, Bratwurst Boy:

Patriots = Love their country and want what's best for it.

Nationalists: = Love their nation and want what's best for it.

Nazis and Fascists = Hate other countries and wish them the worst

Nationalism is a political, social, and economic system characterized by the promotion of the interests of a particular nation, (...) The political ideology of nationalism holds that a nation should govern itself, free from outside interference and is linked to the concept of self-determination. Nationalism is further oriented towards developing and maintaining a national identity based on shared, social characteristics, such as culture and language, religion and politics, and a belief in a common ancestry.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nationalism

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]

Great news.

The Independence March organisers and the President [with a Government] have negotiated a deal. There will be one large march yet both of the groups will be autonomous within it.

Very sensible deal.

wpolityce.pl/polityka/420500-porozumienie-rzadu-i-organizatorow-marszu-niepodleglosci

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]


This is not a matter of winning or losing. And also I hardly see any valid or even sensible arguments here on this thread.


You have to understand that this just a margin of a margin. Those people don't represent the views of expats - which as a whole are just a small group of people living in Poland - but only a handful of expats active on this forum.

Few are smart, others are confused, some are clueless or too much attached to their own woldview to understand Poland.

And few are very frustrated and immune to any possible logical arguments :-)

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]

I will answer your question but first I'll make a few corrections. Instead of:


Should be:


I not only defend them but I also support them.


I don't get involved with British politics.
Since I'm only a guest here in the UK I don't want to interfere with local politics. I don't feel that I have right to do so and I also don't want to look like an complete fool who doesn't understand a complicated socio-political situation in the country.

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]


Atch, let's say that I don't believe that you're about to drink a coffee. Does that change the fact that a warm liquid may be filling up your belly right now? :-)

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]


You should rather focus on real problems like those German neo-nazis celebrating a birthday of German nazi Rudolf Hess (a deputy of Adolf Hitler) just last summer [Aug 2017] in Berlin:

independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/neo-nazis-berlin-ruidolf-hess-a7901771.html



instead of being so "concerned" with Polish Independence March.

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]


So let's focus on facts and not on a subjective outlook of "acts that never happened", Atch. Cause if we follow this line of thinking then we can justify or criticize virtually anything and anyone regardless of their past deeds, crimes or affiliations.

Jozef Mackiewicz has once famously said: "Only the truth is interesting"

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]


Well, HGW with her ban on march has enraged not only right-wingers and conservatives but she is also being criticized by centrists and even left-wingers like Barbara Nowacka.

Many moderate and centrist public figures and political commentators like Cezary Gmyz and Krzysztof Stanowski have publicly declared that they will attend Independence March to make a statement that are against limiting civil rights of Poles.

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]

It amuses me how those who aren't even ethnic Poles are the ones who knows best how Poles should, or even must, think and do.

Regular Poles would not take seriously such a nonsense spoken in broken Polish so the only real recipients of such a content are other expats on the internet forum :-).

Btw,The court has annulled the mayor's ban:

medianarodowe.com/marsz-niepodleglosci-wygral-w-sadzie/

The Independence March will take place as scheduled.

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]


Some people on this forum have totalitarian minds and only very limited knowledge about what personal freedom means.

It's not even their own fault, they're just tools which were formed that way by a modern Western societies. People who don't remember their own past and have no power over creating their own future.

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]


Since when celebrating patriotism and national pride is called "race hatred"? Remember that Poland is not barbaric Germany, where race hatred does indeed walk right behind nationalism.

It is very unfortunate that the UK unfortunately is poisoned with the same cultural marxist bacteria called "PC" as the most of the Western Europe. Which is a pity cause the UK with Poland could be a political counter-balance to Franco-Teutonic EU. I hope that Brexit will cure the situation a little bit.


Miroslaw, he is just clueless and a little bit dim-witted. He doesn't understand the situation nor takes any responsibility for his own words.

One way or another the march will take place and we will unite singing National Anthem under Polish flag to celebrate the Independence Day, cultural integrity and patriotic values.

OK, time to sleep. The whole situation will be clearer tomorrow :-)

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]


I did, and I'm going.

I a meantime I checked how strong, from a legal point of view, is that decision of Mayor of Warsaw .

The results are interesting: according to Polish law only the Masovian Voivode has legal power to allow or disallow such a regular public events as an Independence March in Warsaw.

It looks like the Mayor of Warsaw has abused her power so a court appellation submitted by march organizers right after her unlawful decision was a smart move.

So, it looks like those are just usual political games from Civic Platform (or a "deep state" if you prefer) but something which looks good in mass media won't fly in the court.

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]


Sure it is. Her decision is not definitive, though. The organizers are about to submit an appellation.

This way or another the Independence March will take place cause no one can stop free Polish citizens from marching on the streets of Warsaw with a Polish flag in hands.

And since Poles in general hates when someone tries to take those liberties from them, I presume that the march will be even bigger now, than it would be if not banned.

In Europe AD 2018 the choice is simple.

Either this:



Or that:

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]


You are some sort of "special person" aren't you?

Would you produce a link to a video material with such an event taking place on Independence March?

Even the most fanatical anti-nationalist, anti-march media establishments don't produce such a stupid statements. Do you even know what you're talking about? Do you realise the gravity of your disgusting statement?


Same here. This sounds like a slander to me. He could be easily taken to court for such a false claim if anyone would even bother with him. Until now I thought that he's just a clown, but now he reached the new low.

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]


I see. So it's a love-hate relationship in your case?

And Remember that Polish nationalism is based on Christian Personalism which is much different than ruthless German nationalism.

If you really hate nationalism you should rather take a look at German AfD, cause that's where the real nationalistic danger in Europe lies.

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]


If it was meaningless you wouldn't attack it with such an aggression


What "vast majority"? You and your imaginary friend?

I understand that you personally, as a foreigner, may be baselessly afraid of grassroot national conservative movement but your personal feelings are not the will of Polish nation. Stop being afraid and start trying to understand.

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]


He doesn't get plenty of things, like basic economy, not only Poles :-)

But he also makes this thread more popular so all is forgiven

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]


Yes, and since the last 12 months the whole city has made an U-turn and everything has changed for so much better. One would simply not recognize the place and its population :-P

You're a bit dim witted, aren't you? :-D

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]


London is, for the very first time in the history, more dangerous than New York.

telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/10/20/london-now-dangerous-new-york-crime-stats-suggest


And rightfully so.

I'm living in a quite good neighbourhood in East End London but few steps away the 3rd World starts already. The streets of Aldgate [which lies in a city centre] up to Whitechapel look like a long stretch of smelly south asian street markets, and when they are closed, all the rubbish is left behind on a pavement. And the smell of rotting fish is almost unbearable, especially in the summer.

Funny thing is that all those "progressive" people that I know from work live mostly in white neighbourhoods and have mostly white "progressive" friends. I'm yet to hear about any of them moving to muslim/african area to fully enjoy multiculturalism.

News / Polish Independence Day March in Warsaw. Is it going to be the biggest march yet? [1530]


True. Poland took in over 2 millions economic immigrants on work visas from Ukraine, Belarus and Moldova

Overall more than 50% of new economic immigrants who came to the EU [to work - not for handouts] are now working in Poland