Poles and Russians -- love-hate relationship?

i noticed that but i was never jealous. Well, maybe little.;)


:)


ma, ja sam bio kriv. Previše sam se otkaèio


nisam ga video, i ja ga èekam


i am absolutely disappointed in Britain. To brake alliance with us Serbs and to attack us in alliance with worse Arab mujaheedines, to send their soldiers, side by side with Islamic fanatics, against us. I didn`t expect that. and just how did their politicians lied on us hysterically in mass media. Unbelievable, what did they think. What happened to progressive Britain

Care to name any names there? Or even to give any quotes from the people you so describe?

And I thought that Russia doesn't have a say in Poland since 1989. Silly me... ;)

i was clear. You know what i mean. One can agree or not with Russian politics but, not to consider Russia for the global power always proved to be mistake. It is on Poland and Serbia to convince Russia, that Russia have nothing to lose if support our vital interests and that actually have a lot of to gain if we strengthen.

Hello :)), I'm happy to see that you had the will (strength was never an issue) to survive here :) (although, I didn't have doubts about it)


Indeed, it does. I will find someone and invite him/her here :) ( I have a candidate informed well for the discussions)

now, something Slavic for DE and those who like Slavs here ;)))

'Fear passes from man to man
Unknowing,
As one leaf passes its shudder
To another.

All at once the whole tree is trembling,
And there is no sign of the wind.'

Charles Simic (American- serbian poet)

Thank you for the poem Natasa.
Alas Slavophilia is in short supply here. People are free to calls Slavs racist but if anyone dares to say the same about a Western-European poster then they are threatened with suspension. The double standards of Orientalism are sadly present here.

Thanks for this Natasa.

you gave me nice idea for new thread. :)

Let`s give something beautiful to this forum, to anyone

Himmm... Dangereous slavic spirit have been rising again. I have to be around :)

Nah. But Polish politicians do still sit around waiting to be told what to do.

By whom?

But look how Lech Kaczynski criticized domination of world powers in international relations, when he defended Serbs at UNGA

i know, don`t tell me. You point on Polish politicians that are alive


by NATO and EU ruling elite

That is called 'international cooperation' and is done by almost every country on Earth. Serbia doesn't do such thing anymore?

well, they (NATO, EU) conquered 12% of our territory so yes, you can say that we are more cooperative now


we maybe call it 'international cooperation' but we all know that is dictate

You really believe there would be a difference if the Russians make the rules again? 45 years of their "leadership" should be enough to cure even the most nostalgic.

Being dominated by Russia, France, Germany, Britain and, later by EU, NATO,... are all negative choices. Negative choices are wrong. One must stand for himself and know what he want and where he go.

Russia tried to dominate. And failed. Now, Russians offering cooperation and as long as they don`t interfere in our unique agreements with Czech Republic, Slovakia, Ukraine, Hungary, Poland,... we won`t have reason not to trust them.

You know, Zawisha Czarny, Chartorisky, Pilsudski,.... they trusted to Serbians. We do have our role

I'd rather deal with western democracies than with a dubious character like Putin. What makes you think that you can trust this guy? He's already rebuilding the old USSR on a local level, and who knows what else he has in mind. In my eyes, Poland can call herself lucky to be in the NATO/EU.

I don't know about Serbia but Poles have many reasons not to trust Russia.

and Russians would tell you that they have reasons not to trust to Poles. Poles and Russian can live in that circle of misery to the end of time, whose responsibility is older. That situation upsets us Serbs and reduce our maneuverable space.

But, listen what would Serbian tell to you. Poles have all historical reasons to trust to us Serbs. Let us agree that we want new Commonwealth and then walk with us to that goal. If we agree to be militarily neutral on global military alliances that would satisfy Russia. We Serbs would oblige them. You Poles should deal with Vatican and provide Vatican`s support to the creation of new Commonwealth. In new Commonwealth, Vatican could have better position then just in Poland. You can promise that to Vatican and, we Serbs would respect stance of Poland. After all, Catholic and Orthodox Churches moving toward reunion. Then, when we have Russian and Vatican`s support, when they see their mutual interests protected in new Commonwealth, let them convince Britain, France, Germany and USA. Let they deal with them.

Polish PM Tusk and Serbian PM Dacic, Belgrade, 2013

As a pole I understand our relationship with russians. Russians have hurt us greatly. We were under russian imperial rule for 123 years, after that we had to fight against soviet domination, and as happened after ww2 we were dominated. The result is a general sense of mistrust and fear directed towards russia. While many poles have a dislike towards russians, I would not sa we dislike the individual people. In my family, and amongst my friends we hold the view that russians as a whole are victims of centuries of slavery inflicted on them by their own people and leaders. Russians are viewed as distant slavic cousins. We do not trust russia, and russians do not trust us. This does not get in the way of individual relationships, but it shows. We know how they think, they know how we think, that is why the are so dangerous.

Polish are closer to russians than we are to ger man's because of a shared slavic ethnicity. I do believe that poles are even closer to the ukraine, even thought we have had a difficult history with them. While the people in my family are wary of russia, we have built very close relations with ukrainian people. Ukrainians and polish are brothers. Sometimes we fought, and sometimes we stood together.

Simple, MUST SEE

Singing PM: 'Fats' Putin over the top of 'Blueberry Hill' with piano solo

youtu.be/IV4IjHz2yIo

About how it started. At the end of 18-th century Ottaman Empire was on the verge of collapse. They've been beaten badly by Russian army and the Western Powers realized the next war won by Russia may mean all the Balkans falling to the Russian control and immense strengthening of Russia. They decided to prevent it at any cost. Prussia and Austria threatened Russia with war if they going to fight Ottamans again and as a compensation FORCED Russia to participate in partition of Poland. Poland was divided into three parts one of which passed to Russia. In difference from those parts which passed to Germany and Austria Russian part preserved some nominal official autonomy and became called by Russians as "Princedom of Poland". They preserved even some government institutions such as the Senate and separate legal system. Russian Queen Catherine the II made the last Polish king Poniatowski her official favorite (lover) and settled him in a luxury palace. She allocate a huge allowance for his luxury life. Later in 19-th century there was Polish uprising against Russian rule lead by Kostushko. There were large casualties from Russian side both military and civilian. Yet Russians didn't punish captured Kostushko anyhow and simply released him for a sake of a Russian-Polish brotherhood. Later Kostushko fought in US and made career of a prominent general.

I'm not aware if Russians personally owned large parcels of land in Poland during "imperial rule" period. But the opposite is know exactly. Ethnic Poles owned many, likely majority of private lands in large territories of modern Western Ukraine, Belarus and Lithuania. And constituted a prominent segment of Russian nobility. And even though Polish often severely discriminated their Ruthenian/Ukrainian/Belarussian serfs, Russian rulers not only refused support anti-Polish uprisings of the Orthodox peasants (for example in Central and Western Ukraine) but even sent Russian troops for Polish protection. For example Catherine the II. And this is regardless the fact that the leaders of the uprisings represented themselves as pro-Russian!

Please don't waste your time on this forum.
Poles in general do not like or trust the Russian state.
We have nothing against Russian people.
But we will never trust your leaders.
Until you start to criticize your leaders,we will never trust you either.
Poles may be many things,but stupid is not one of them.....

Principally I'm not trying to achieve it, so do I waste time?


This is a more realistic direction we can work to.


I never lived in Russia, so why do I need regard their leaders as my leaders (at least at a given point)?

Still relation of Poles to Russia makes me wonder. Russians can live good or bad in their country, they can be happy or unhappy with

their leaders. But what is a deep concern and even obsession of other nations about that?! If Russians experience(d) some problems in their own country, why hate them for this?! Some generous person would rather start to think how to help them...

If you want justify your hate by issuing some historical count to Russians maybe we will go more deeply in it and come to the facts?

The Skripal attempted murder was stupid,farcical,inept and failed in it's objective too.
And the main protagonist was a highly decorated colonel in the GRU!!
We have little to fear from stupid,imbecilic,incapable Russians....

Perhaps because Russia brought the world the worst geo-political disaster of the 20th century and keeps invading her neighbours ?

Spot on G!

What do you exactly mean by that?

Changes are coming. History again repeat itself. Like snake changing its skin. Like sun. In the circle. In constant cycles. Must be as have to be. Must be in order to change again.

From what ive experienced russians and poles around 35 30 and under get along well, especially those who are into mma or firms, more so even than with ukrainians. Amongst older generations not so much. I think among youth the thinking is different and many have a sort of mutual respect for the other for not buying into the multikulti homo crap and theyre often into the same hobbies

I mean tens of millions of death people and dozens of countries invaded or thrown into civil wars. That makes ISIS or even "nazis" look like scout boys.

Go type "history of 20th century" into google and start from the basics as apparenty you don't have a clue about them.