Communism, was it the best form of government Poland ever had?

4 eigner 2 | 816

6 Jan 2014 / #61

There is not a single communist regime that has not descended into murder and repression

every electorate is wise to the fact that it is an unworkable system that can only be sustained by terrorising the workers it pretends to represent.

no capitalist country has ever had to build a wall to keep people in.

i have honestly never met one who would like to go back to the old system lock stock and barrel.

two thumbs up!!!

gask7 - | 50

6 Jan 2014 / #62

Of course not. No doubt. But we have had no choice.

Ironside 50 | 12435

6 Jan 2014 / #63

Your comments on that, pretending the inquisition never tortured anyone, rather destroy everything else you've spouted in this thread.

Eh? This comes from a dude who claims that Communism and Christianity are comparable. The inquisition never tortured anyone check out those primary sources.

More so than you think.

It is not about what I think but rather about what you don't know, as I said your crazy myths belong to you :)

Harry

6 Jan 2014 / #64

" The inquisition never tortured anyone check out those primary sources."
I'd suggest you have a look at the papal bulls from 1252 and 1256: those show very clearly that you're lying.

jon357 73 | 23224

6 Jan 2014 / #65

Communism and Christianity are comparable.

So many parallels in what their founders believed.

The inquisition never tortured anyone

Google Torquemada.

smurf 38 | 1940

6 Jan 2014 / #66

The inquisition never tortured anyone

That isn't true:

Other Inquisitions followed after these first inquisition movements. Legal basis for some inquisitorial activity came from Pope Innocent IV's papal bull Ad extirpanda of 1252, which explicitly authorized (and defined the appropriate circumstances for) the use of torture by the Inquisition for eliciting confessions from heretics.[13] By 1256 inquisitors were given absolution if they used instruments of torture

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inquisition#Medieval_Inquisition

Ozi Dan 26 | 566

7 Jan 2014 / #67

Hey Iron,

You're quite right, and I think you should try and distance yourself from the wind-ups being attempted by PF's own version of Del Griffiths.

Can I respectfully suggest some things? Arguments predicated on things like "if not for the Soviet Occupation" whilst interesting, are counterfactual arguments, and can be easily dismissed. It's not up to you in any event to try and disprove that the Communist system was good, or did 'good' things, by reference to what free Poland did that was good, or what they may have done but for falling under the Soviet sphere. All you need to say is that Communism was bad for Poland - it speaks for itself.

Had it been 'good' for Poland then why:

1. up until the Soviet takeover, were there only a handful of actual Poles who were communist?
2. did the Solidarity movement come about?
3. was communism dismantled and left for dead?

Housing, bread, cheap cars, 'guaranteed' employment and so on seem to be put forward as examples of the 'good', but benefits should always be measured against the price paid, and balanced against the other end of the scale.

Going back to counterfactuals, you touched on Poland's dramatic progress prior to WW2 and perhaps what could have been achieved if it was allowed to exist further. What's your view on some of the things Poland would/could have achieved if it emerged from WW2 without the Soviet occupation (and perhaps having lost far less of its intelligentsia during the war)? What do you think about the political make-up of a non-Communist Poland post WW2?

legend 3 | 658

7 Jan 2014 / #68

I realized many self proclaimed communists
either had relatives in the Communist governments, or they are simply children who never lived in anything close to communism and think its cool to follow Marx.

If not for the Soviet occupation of Poland this country would be on par with France when it comes to economy or so near that it wouldn't make a difference.

I did some quick searching and from the figures I found, Poland would likely be above Spain and below Italian or French levels had WWII and Communism not hit Poland.