A very tired issue no doubt but me and my girlfreind (shes polish) were just discussing wether most of the polish people wholive in southampton UK will stay here longterm or will maybe earn enough money to save up and pay for education in poland or maybe housing and things.
She thinks most people will only stay for a few years.
I think most people would probably stay long term but either way its not an easy question to ask.
Would like to know your opinions on it if its okay
I'm not Polish so forgive me for throwing my spanner in the works here.
I was also wondering this in terms of how the current economic situation is impacting on peoples' plans.
I have always sort of assumed that the Polish (and other EU migrants) came over to make some quick cash and then go home again. Some maybe staying but the bulk going back having witnessed first hand our crazy cost of living and general overcrowding.
Are people changing their plans now that the economy is taking a bit of a downturn ?
Are people changing their plans now that the economy is taking a bit of a downturn ?
well according to the UK papers they are.. they say that droves of Polish people are returning home due to the falling economy in Britain.. that when they came the wages here were 4 times higher than in Poland, but now they are only twice as high and the economy in Poland in getting better, Poles are going home. Not sure if its really true or not.. stories about Polish people in the UK seem to be flavour of the month in the press.
personally I dont care either way as long as my bf stays.
For me the transfer here meant a step backwards. Moneywise I just about levelled with what I got before; maybe a little bit more, but that does not equal the huge rise in costs of living. I didn't need to go here, had some personal reasons to accept the offer of transfer here and I am not going to stay here. My plans are eventually to go to the US or Canada (like four years ago a transfer within the same company - so I basically don't need to go through complex visa-procedures). Also I do have certain reservations towards the way the society has been organized. But that's just because I am from a very-well organized and advanced country. Personally I think that any move to any country in the world would mean a step backwards, behold a very few exceptions. I can understand that when you come from a poor country with basically no opportunities to get a decent job with a decent income, you go to places where there are chances. Alas, most of those ppl end up in some crappy job like convenient stores, waiting in bars, clubs or restaurants - grossly underpaid and exploited to the core (that is actually an issue that should be addressed publicly in Ireland and the UK). But in all, what they make there is actually more than they would've made home with a more educated job, but it just generally annoys me how the locals think they should treat the so-manieth Eastern-European girl/boy who picks up the glasses in a pub. However, the costs of living are just as high as they are for me - and they make much less than I do. So I wonder about that quick money. There is a percentage of them that lives with 12 ppl in a 3 bedroomed house, pays about a tenner per week for rent, eats at the pub where they work for free and sending 80 per cent of what they make to the homecountry. Sure. But I think the majority has spends most of the income in the country where they work.
And yes - you see a shift in migrationstreams happening. Ireland and the UK are no longer the main focalpoints of migration, mainly due to the high costs of living and the fact that the economy is going down (Ireland experiences the first downward movement of the economy since the ocurrence of the Celtic Tiger - most young ppl haven't got a clue what is happening to them as they simply don't have any experience with a good economy going down: Ireland has been at the bottom of the European economics Top40 for almost always. 15 years ago they suddenly rised to the first place. And that is what most young ppl over here only know: rise to the top. They simply never have experienced economy going down, which it always will do: the wave-movement, which all other economies of Europe know and have gotten used to).
Some people at work say things like 'how much of your wages do you send home to your family every month'? to my girlfriend. That really ****es me off, people just dont have a clue about Poland especially if they read tThe Daily Mail or something. Even colleagues whom i regard as being quite intelligent have backwards views on things. As it stands Marta doesnt need to send money home and her family arent 'poor' as idiots would like to think.
Getting involved in a relationship with a Polish woman means constantly engaging in a debate about immigrants in the UK especially Southampton thesedays, thats is if you are proud of your loved one, if not then you shy away from heated debates.
It's a Brave New World, baby, only too bad that some don't weather change that good.
Glim: I noticed that, especially in the UK, where it is worse, much worse than in Ireland, the emphasis of the discussion about immigration lies more on it being bad for economy or they highlight the bad apples, than where it actually should be: the exploitation of foreign workers, the racism of the "100 per cent British" and the fact that those foreign workers who "come to steal our jobs, rape our women" and more of the crap you hear, while in fact they do the jobs the "true British" refuse to do.
Glim, My Irish friend told me that there is a Polish girl in the film "Once" ,an Irish production - the action thakes place in Dublin. You can imagine my disappointment when I discovered that she is not Polish but Czech!! Polish, Czech, Russian... it's all the same for them... What an ignorance!! They really now nothing about us :(
discussing wether most of the polish people wholive in southampton UK will stay here longterm or will maybe earn enough money to save up and pay for education in poland or maybe housing and things.
ive been to Southampton last weekend (shopping!) and there are loads of Poles there, its scary! and they're all out and about with very young children. that city is like little Poland, especially Shirley...
personally i dont think i will move back to Poland, but i also dont wanna live in England all my life.
I believe that you are so right in that statement, and naturally you would be dissapointed.
We are in a situation where the melting pot of humanity is bubbling on and on. Cultures and colours have been blending together steadily for a lo-o-o-ng time. We have to accept the inevitable problems and discomforts. Looking toward the benefits of unity and integration through helping each other to work through our ignorance of some aspects is, I believe, the way forward for all of us.
I'm not living in Southampton but I'll just share my opinion. Out of all the Polish people I know, most plan to head home after a few years, although i do know maybe 3 or 4 families who plan to stay here long term. I too plan on staying here for the rest of my life, and its nothing to do with the wages etc. My fiancee (shes scottish, I'm Polish) and I would just rather stay in the UK, as I have no problems with English, life in the UK, etc, where as I would worry about her in Poland where she doesn't speak the language.
im in the same situation as you with my Scottish fiance, i like it in UK, the UK people like me ;) and im happy to stay here, whilst he wouldnt enjoy Poland that much as he doesnt speak much Polish and there arent many things he could do for a living out there... the only thing that might tempt him to move to Poland is the beauty of Polish women lol.
thats true, but then you have to remember that Polish wages are lower than in UK... so the price pretty much works out the same if you live in Poland and drink Polish beer.
Some people at work say things like 'how much of your wages do you send home to your family every month'? to my girlfriend. That really ****es me off, people just dont have a clue about Poland especially if they read tThe Daily Mail or something
Yes, I agree so much with that and I`m happy someone else feels the same what I feel. I`m from Brazil so it`s even worse... when I say I have a polish husband people (specially english) tend to make a pitty face to me assuming tha myself being from Brazil and married with a polish guy we have no option other than live in UK earning " the marvelous pound" . People should travel more and know the world out there...
anyone see that TV show on immigration last night (in UK)? from watching this it seems like pretty much everyone in the UK hates the Poles now, especially other generations of immigrants such as the UK Asians, Caribbeans etc..who have been here for some years and feel angry about the recent tide of migrant workers from Eastern Europe who are coming here only to make money and not to settle and bring something to the economy like they did. 85% of those polled want to stop immigration to the UK altogether. God, Im sounding like NOImmigration here, Im not saying I agree with these views, but it cant be good that such hatred is fast becoming the majority view.. There will be race riots again before you know it.
Ok possibly I am, but I was just trying to make the point that Polophobia in the UK seems to be spreading and those who were previously targets of racism are now some of the keenest to diss it out themselves...as highlighted by this programme. very sad.
I wish people would stop using this word as is it is a nonsense. No one in Britain ever considered it worthwhile to refer to prejudice against black people as Afrophobia or against Asian as Asiophobia.
in the UK seems to be spreading and those who were previously targets of racism are now some of the keenest to diss it out themselves
True. It is mildly comic to see 2nd generation immigrants justify their support forimmigration control though. They often dont include there own family and friends as those that should be restricted.
It is mildly comic to see 2nd generation immigrants justify their support forimmigration control though. They often dont include there own family and friends as those that should be restricted.
Not sure I find it mildly comic, more like a damn bloody cheek!
As for the economy, when I walk down the street now I see more and more of those little yellow signs reading money transfers - when I go into a shop, Its not Polish people I see wiring money abroard, it is in general Africans so we could also say that they are not contributing to the economy and sending it all back home...but how true would that be?
Britain is full. We no longer need to leave the door open for immigrants and asylum seekers. If immigrants want to look elsewhere then they should try to look closer to home, ie Germany.
Ermm yeah since our economy has picked tremendiously after we got re-united no problem at all.
Anyway, personally I think the majority will go home or elsewhere at some point. I too came to Ireland from Germany for the job not for the country itself (although i like it here). For me (and I assume for most other human beeings) it is about making money and progress my career. If i ever feel like I can do that in a better, quicker way elsewhere I'm off. Now some people think I'm crazy but I actually feel that I can earn better wages and progress my career in Poland.
anyone see that TV show on immigration last night (in UK)?
I saw it. It caught my attention why in the program the journalist interviwed every race, former imigrants (idians, africans, caribbean) and not a single eastern european. Was The program was about imigration or about eastern europe immigration?
It was about immigration generally. I imagine that he will be interviewing eastern europeans in later programmes as he talked about polling people at all levels including those newly arrived.. presuming he can find any that speak English that is :)
