Return PolishForums LIVE
  PolishForums Archive :
Archives - 2005-2009 / Real Estate  % width 33

Angel city Development in Krakow

10 Dec 2008 /  #1
Has anyone bought any of the units in Angel city in Krakow, beside the trainstation?
The Developers are late and I will need to finish the place off once we get the keys in Januaqry.

On the web
DaniB 1 | 12  
14 Dec 2008 /  #2

Yes, we have bought an Angelcity apartment. Which building are you in and when are you or have you already signed for it? I don't know if this forum permits exchanging email addresses but if so mine is and I would appreciate contact, not least to discuss the signing. We are in buiding B and when we were there some six weeks ago there was absolutely no way they would be finished by the end of 08 - the place was still a complete building site so we were surprised to received an invitation in yesterday's post to sign on 30th Dec! Please email me if poss.


OP Guest  
22 Dec 2008 /  #3
We have also bought an apartment in block B and are going to sign for it mid January. We assumed everything would be finished! Do you have any more information regarding progress? Jackie
DaniB 1 | 12  
26 Dec 2008 /  #4

Re. Angelcity. Please refer to my previous post and email me on
OP Guest  
26 Dec 2008 /  #5
Dear Dani and Jackie,

I am the original poster and I have emailed Dani. Most of block "B" is going to be finished in 08 and the rest in 09. I am going to sign in January and it was supposed to be finished in December. There is a penalty clause, which I will be following up. I live in Krakow and I will be getting several tenders for the finish.

Apart from being late and refusing to make alterations unless it was notarized, it is in a great location and ought to be very attractive. I intend to let out.

Best regards,
26 Dec 2008 /  #6
There's a blog on what appears to be these apartments here.
hyson - | 1  
21 Jan 2009 /  #7
Hi, I am home from work today and I found this site. I got a place there and plan to close in '09. Any thoughts about finishing and alterations I should ask about?? I am so excited-

I love Krakow and plan to start living there part time next year. I am going to pursue college alumni and international education programs for occasional renting out when I am not living there- any thoughts on any of the aforementioned. Hello neighbors!!! hy
OP Guest  
25 Jan 2009 /  #8
I have now been over to Krakow and signed the notary deed on 14 January. As you said, the contract stated a completion date by the end of Dec 08 - what penalty do you think might be involved here? We have not done anything about this. My email is pinkyrobbin@hotmail. Jackie
minton - | 2  
10 Feb 2009 /  #9
Jackie, John, Dani

I have an apartment in Block B, still not complete. We haven't signed final deeds. This is well late, and looking at the state of the common areas (stair, lift wells etc) we're still at least 6 weeks from being in a position to live here, or rent out our unit.

Our unit, and basement storage area, are also smaller than agreed.

I am interested if anyone has information on the penalty clause, and if there is a consolidated course of action we can take to see our interests looked after.

seanbm 35 | 5,812  
10 Feb 2009 /  #10
the state of the common areas (stair, lift wells etc) we're still at least 6 weeks

I agree with these observations.

The penalty clause is 11,000 Euros for the client I am dealing with but Angel city developers are claiming it is

Dear sir etc...

We had a problem with the agent of the Krakow Municipality, that was carrying out it's own road and building investment in our neighbour hood and forced us to suspend our works for 2 months; there was also another problem with the utilities providers, that imposed on us additional works and requirements that were previously established in the contract. We were forced to carry out new works that lasted about a month and had to incur additional costs.

I am really sorry....

I.e. not our fault and therefore no penalty clause.
I have received no back up information about this.

From the street the building looks fabulous.
minton - | 2  
10 Feb 2009 /  #11
Yes -can't complain about the externals - the brickwork is excellent. hope the landscaped areas and the internal common areas come up as well.

My view is that the municipal works do not absolve the developer from sticking to their agreed program. The developer is laible to damages, and should in turn seek compensation from the local muniicpality for these damages.

Furthermore, as investors we had a right to be informed if there was to be any delay to the completion of the project. I was never informed of any 2 week lapse due to works by the local muniicpality.
DaniB 1 | 12  
10 Feb 2009 /  #12
We have an Angelcity apartment and are currently communicating (or not) through a lawyer - have not yet had a response to his letter, which I won't go into at the moment. My email address is and it may be better to communicate privately for obvious reasons.


SeanBM 35 | 5,812  
12 Feb 2009 /  #13
I was in Angel City yesterday to see how things are proceeding.
The builder told me, realistically it will be the beginning to mid April before absolutely everything is finished.
Block "A" is further on than Block "B".
Some people have taken over their apartments already.

I am doing a number of finishes in Angel City and Wislane tarasy.
For further information, you can email me on domator.invest@gmail

Here is the fronts and the court yards of block "A" and "B".
There is still quite a lot of construction to be done inside.
I have very many photos of both blocks and the new drawings with the newly allotted apartment numbers, if anyone is interested.

13 Feb 2009 /  #14
Those pictures look pretty impressive. The courtyard of block 'A' looks good and not unlike the original artist's impression except for the omission of narrow windows in the wooden elements . It might be me, but it all looks about 3% smaller than I expected! It's also nice to see that the courtyard looks bright. Should give some sanctuary from the dismal external views.
SeanBM 35 | 5,812  
15 Feb 2009 /  #15
It might be me, but it all looks about 3% smaller than I expected!

3%, how did you come to that conclusion?.

It's also nice to see that the courtyard looks bright.

There is one section at the end of block "B" in the first photo that looks very dark.
Apart from that it looks fine.

In the 2nd photo you can see the hotel being built across the road.

I liked the look of the 3rd photo, nice feature.

The last photo is of the underground parking.

I also have many photos of the interiors, they are very well thought out.
The plumbing and wall lights are all in easy to finish places.
But they are behind and it needs to be finished well.

GodandBrown 2 | 63  
28 Feb 2009 /  #16
Hello Sean BM,

do you know any prices for the square metre?
And do people have to pay a deposit firstly? And what about
the partnership of the developer with Lehman Brothers? (See homepage...)
I have also noticed that there are no windows in the bathroom. Danger of
Photos have no evidence at all. It is said that there will be more developers in
Cracow who have to go to the cuckoo soon. I would be not too naive and I recommend everyone here not to invest without any bank information about the developer.
SeanBM 35 | 5,812  
28 Feb 2009 /  #17
do you know any prices for the square metre?

Do you mean the price for finish or to buy?.
Finishes are around 1000 Zloty per M2.
Purchase price depends on which floor and the exchange rate.
The price is set in Euros, so it is substantially cheaper today than it was last summer.

And do people have to pay a deposit firstly?

For finish, the answer is yes.
To purchase an apartment, I would imagine the answer is yes too but I am sure you can make a verbal reservation until you can transfer the money.

And what about
the partnership of the developer with Lehman Brothers?

When instalments are paid to Angel City it goes into a bank account that Angel city can't touch but the bank use it as collateral.

If something does happen to Angel City, the money is returned to the purchaser.

I have also noticed that there are no windows in the bathroom. Danger of

It is very common not to have a window in the bathroom.
So long as the bathroom is well ventilated and the correct materials are used, there should be no problems with mould.
I am from Ireland, Poland is a much drier country and does not have the huge problems with mould that we have.
Although you are right to ask.

Photos have no evidence at all.

Evidence of what, exactly?.
I have many photos of this project.
The builders are working on it.

It is said that there will be more developers in
Cracow who have to go to the cuckoo soon.

There are always developers that will not be able to survive trying times.
I think this project is too far in not to be finished but of course anything is possible but I do not see any real danger.

I would be not too naive and I recommend everyone here not to invest without any bank information about the developer.

You are correct, people should check out all aspects of a developer before committing.

The project is near completion.
Hand overs have taken place and there is about a month left before completion.

In my opinion, this is an excellent project.
The quality and layout of the plan is very good, with thought put into it.
The location is second to none, especially with all that is happening across the road, hotel, offices, train station being moved under ground.

The one worry I had was noise form the traffic but the windows absorb most of the noise and I do not see it as a problem any more.

The builders have however been very difficult if you want any changes made.
The late completion is frustrating a lot of people.

Have you bought in this project, are you thinking of buying or just curious?.

I am not associated with Angel City in any way.
GodandBrown 2 | 63  
28 Feb 2009 /  #18
Yes, we are just thinking about an investment in Cracow. It is not so easy to find the right object. The project looks great, but as we all know...everyone has to check all details thoroughly. Our bank consultant recommended us to wait a little bit. In May or June it will be the best time for an investment. We will see.
Avalon 4 | 1,068  
28 Feb 2009 /  #19
"Our bank consultant recommended us to wait a little bit."

The phrase, "blind leading the blind" comes to mind. Since when have the "banks" known anything?
GodandBrown 2 | 63  
28 Feb 2009 /  #20
Laugh - you are right. But things would not go better if I betrayed myself being a professional. And just getting frustrated...I don't know whether it is the better attitude. Angel City...if ...nomen est omen...we will be in heaven soon...? Or we are damned to fail.
DaniB 1 | 12  
19 Mar 2009 /  #21
Sean BM

Is it possible for you to email me on It seems that you know quite a bit about this development and we are having certain worries about it and perhaps you will know answers to certain questions which we don't want to ask in public.

many thanks
SeanBM 35 | 5,812  
19 Mar 2009 /  #22
Hello DaniB,
I would be happy to help, if I can.
I sent you an email.
Krakowfitout - | 8  
13 May 2009 /  #23
Angel City have written promissory notes attached to the final handover contract.
That they will be completely finished and have obtained the "Use permit" at the end of June for block B.
And they say end of this month for black A.

We are doing some fit-outs in both blocks at the moment.
Our company is setting up a show room apartment at the moment, to be completed in four week's time.
DaniB 1 | 12  
16 May 2009 /  #24
Following three years of problems galore with our purchase of an Angelcity apartment we have now finally - three months after officially withdrawing from the contract - received most of our money back (which Angel have had in full since Dec 07!). Never again! It has been a costly and frustrating learning curve!

If we had gone ahead we would have definitely gone with Joshua Mills for fit-out because we had reached a relatively advanced stage with them in the planning, costing etc and they were very good in every way and reliable too!. We are still hoping to purchase an apartment in Krakow at some stage and it may be that in a few months time we may purchase an Angelcity apartment but through a buyer and definitely not through the developer so we may end up requiring a fit-out service after all.

Off-plan? NEVER AGAIN!!!!
SeanBM 35 | 5,812  
16 May 2009 /  #25
in full since Dec 07

What was the date of completion in your contract?.

we may purchase an Angelcity apartment but through a buyer

There appears to be a few foreigners who are desperate to sell at the moment and have dropped the price significantly, so not a bad idea.
DaniB 1 | 12  
17 May 2009 /  #26
The date of completion in our contract was stated as 31st December 08 but when we originally signed up in June 06 we were told that completion would be around December 07 and our payment schedule was geared to finish in December 07, since when they have had a very large sum of our money. It has take three months of phoning, badgering and solicitors letters from the official date of our withdrawal to get some of our money back.

Whilst I appreciate that developments nearly always end up finishing late, 18 months late is ridiculous and not acceptable to us. We wanted an apartment to use regularly and not primarily as a long-term investment and we were naiive enough to consider the off-plan option, which looked a reasonable one at the time, given the original timescale.

We also paid the developer a substantial additional amount for structural alterations within the apartment which they agreed to be completed whilst building the development and they happily took our money and issued an official annex to the agreement, signed dated etc. They failed to carry out the work even though we went there especially to sort things out and received promises, signatures etc that everything would be done but it wasn't.

The main reason we finally decided to withdraw (after 31st December 08 when it became clear that building B had some way to go) was when we received the final payment notice which showed that our apartment was almost 3% smaller (nearly 2 sq mtrs) than originally signed for - why? Whilst this was covered in the agreement as being acceptable and they had knocked the difference between 2% and 3% off our final bill, it actually changed our apartment from being a two very small double-bedroomed apartment into a two single-bedroomed apartment, which we would definitely not have considered at the outset. When we asked to change apartments to a larger apartment and to pay the difference (even based on the significantly increased current cost per sq mtr) they told us that was not possible and that they would refund what we had paid and charge us the whole current cost of the larger apartment! A ridiculous additional amount of money to pay for an additional 8 or so sq mtrs!

As to what we do next we have yet to decide but we soon realised that fruitless dialogue and ongoing excuses were just delaying tactics by them and we decided to pull out and retrieve what we could now and think about the rest later. We have not signed any disclaimers and are therefore considering our options.

The whole experience has been problematic, frustrating and expensive and I would be interested to hear about other similar experiences.
irishdeano 5 | 304  
17 May 2009 /  #27
Are these on piawa street? I seen a few guys working at them last month
OP Guest  
17 May 2009 /  #28
Hi DaniB,
After our first attempt at trying to buy an apartment in Krakow fell through because the developer increased the price after we had signed the reservation agreement we decided to stop looking and stay in rented apartments or hotels when we came to Krakow.

We finally ended up buying in Sobieski Residense on Ulica Lobzowska (great location) through a company called Properky Krakow Group last month (they were extremely helpful). They have several ready finished apartments to choose from which are completed to a high spec for resale by the original buyers. If this sounds like a plug for PKG well then all I can say is they deserve it.

Our biggest problem is trying to find some nice furniture for the apartment so judging by your story we got away pretty lightly. :)

Goodluck with your search!!
dtaylor5632 18 | 2,007  
17 May 2009 /  #29
If you need a fit out company, give me a bell ;)
DaniB 1 | 12  
26 May 2009 /  #30
I would be interested to hear from anyone who has had problems with this purchase or is waiting for the return of their money.

My email address is

Archives - 2005-2009 / Real Estate / Angel city Development in KrakowArchived