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I'm a Polish immigrant. And I'm not going back to Poland.


Markos  
4 Sep 2006 /  #1
I have a question to Polish immigrants. Would you be willing to come back and live in Poland? I was 100% sure I would go back to Poland when I was 1 year in the US. On the 2nd year I was 80% sure, on the 3rd year 60%. Now on the 5th year I'm sure I won't go back to live permanently in Poland.

I visit Poland every 2 years and everytime I'm there, it's just -- I keep repeating "DUH" or "WHAT?" because some social norms, laws, people attitude, beaurucracy, Polish politics, or other things seem so weird to me. I know not much changed in the past 5 years in Poland, but now from a new perspective I think some things are just unacceptable and that's why, sadly, I don't think I'll go back and live in Poland.

I'm sure I'm not the only one who feels that way -- I know many poeple who don't even have a drivers license not to mention social security, but they don't want to go back "unless they deport me". It's not good for Poland, I know.. but poor economic situation doesn't bring much choices.

BTW. I know some Poles tend to be "annoyed" or "angry" when an immigrant tells them he doesn't want to come back. Some of them try to talk - "traitor; don't like Poland then Fcuk off" or similar.

But some of them forget they go back to Poland on vacations only where they have a good time and can spend money they earned abroad. If they were to live there just like regular people do, they would change their minds quickly. I don't like such hypocrites who talk BS.
krysia 23 | 3,057  
4 Sep 2006 /  #2
Your story repeats itself over and over. I've heard it so many times.
I know a lot of Polish people who came to America. After the fist year they couldn't take it anymore, but waited another year. It got a little better. Next year was even better. And now there is no way they want to go back. I know some who are here 20 years illegally. They don't have a driver's license, don't have a green card and are finding ways to stay, for example through marriages to US citizens. (They pay them a lot of money for that).

And some can't go back to Poland, even for a visit, because thay overstayed their Visa and wouldn't be allowed to re-enter the US again.
OP Markos  
4 Sep 2006 /  #3
And some can't go back to Poland, even for a visit, because thay overstayed their Visa and wouldn't be allowed to re-enter the US again.

That just proves they don't see themselves in Poland anymore; otherwise they wouldn't care if they was not allowed to re-enter the US, would they?
ola123  
4 Sep 2006 /  #4
BTW. I know some Poles tend to be "annoyed" or "angry" when an immigrant tells them he doesn't want to come back. Some of them try to talk - "traitor; don't like Poland then Fcuk off" or similar.

This is silly, I personally admire peole who are able to just go and start new life so far from home, friends, family. But thats life. This is understandable that you want to live there where life is better. You wrote that it is not good for Poland but sadly I think it IS good for Poland because less people in the country means more work for those who stay. It is sad to see that people have to go, want to go and dont want to go back though. I understand you and Im happy that my fellow Pole found his place. Good luck.
krysia 23 | 3,057  
4 Sep 2006 /  #5
I know some people who want to go back, even if their chances of returning to the US were slim, but, they don't want to because they didn't make enough money in the US and are afraid of what people will say.

IS good for Poland because less people in the country means more work

Yes, but you can make 5 times more money doing the same job in America.
OP Markos  
4 Sep 2006 /  #6
Thank you, Ola :)

You wrote that it is not good for Poland but sadly I think it IS good for Poland because less people in the country means more work for those who stay.

I disagree. You know why? Because it does not solve the problem of unemployment and low-wages in Poland. It just makes the Polish politicians' job and demagogy much easier - they don't have to do ANYTHING and in spite of that the unemployment rate will be steadily going down (because young Poles would leave the country in search of jobs).

because they didn't make enough money in the US and are afraid of what people will say.

I can understand that -- it's so Polish. I don't care what other people would say -- for unknown reason most Polish do.

less people in the country means more work for those who stay

In extreme situations a mother would tell her child: "Son, you were born Polish. When turn 18, get ready to leave Poland because you won't have a chance here to make a normal living."
ola123  
4 Sep 2006 /  #7
Yes this is probably not so good in the long term because Poland lose brave young people but in a short term emmigration over last two years helped to decrease unemployment. Politics wouldnt do anything with this no matter what, I lost my faith in them, in fact I have never had faith in them.

In extreme situations a mother would tell her child: "Son, you were born Polish. When turn 18, get ready to leave Poland because you won't have a chance here to make a normal living."

This is too true :(.
opts 10 | 260  
4 Sep 2006 /  #8
Every time I visit Poland, (every couple years), I see Poland changing and becoming more and like UK or US. People eating American junk food. They look fatter every year. They talk on cell phones, and look stupid. Their attitudes are becoming more Western, more American. They are only concerned with money. They are concerned what neighbor next door has. They are less and less concerned about each other. Sometimes, I see no cultural difference. Eventually, there will be no reason to visit Poland.

But, if assured employment, I would go back. I know Poles who did go back.
OP Markos  
4 Sep 2006 /  #9
I know Poles who did go back.

I'm sure some do go back. But - let me guess -- those Poles who you know that went back... they are well-off, correct? They are not coming back to Poland in the hopes to make a good living "from start"..
Tlum  
4 Sep 2006 /  #10
I'm sure some do go back. But - let me guess -- those Poles who you know that went back... they are well-off, correct?

I guess, that's correct. Why would they come back with empty pockets - to file for unemployment benefits? :) (some of them do file for unemployment benefits anyway - to get free health insurance or other benefits)
krysia 23 | 3,057  
4 Sep 2006 /  #11
I live close to a Polish family currently. Their son is 18 years old. He works illegaly. Doesn't pay taxes. He bought himself a Brand New motorcycle. He bought a Brand New Boat. Brand new Computer. Brand New TV. Brand New Stereo. They have to have everything Brand New and the Best. They like to show off what they got to their friends and family in Poland. In America, unless you are extremely rich, we mostly buy used stuff. Used boats, cycles, snomobiles, cars. etc. Whatever's the best deal.
OP Markos  
4 Sep 2006 /  #12
"Look what the neighbour's gonna say" -- The 11th commandment of some Poles.
krysia 23 | 3,057  
4 Sep 2006 /  #13
That is so true.
plg 17 | 263  
4 Sep 2006 /  #14
krysia whats your mother tongue- polish- english

and what part of usa u from
lef 11 | 478  
4 Sep 2006 /  #15
Look what the neighbour's gonna say" -- The 11th commandment of some Poles

Spot on..

Now on the 5th year I'm sure I won't go back to live permanently in Poland.

The longer you stay overseas the less chances are you will return to poland, if you have children you stay where the children live...Children adapt well living o/s and don't even want to visit poland...A lot of polish people who have never left poland and lived for some time o/s make nasty comments about polish people and question why they left... well the sad answer is poland has little to offer...starting from weather to social security, poles are obsessed with politics (who cares) and religion (that would be o/k if they practiced what they preached.) If you are prepared to work hard o/s, you will do very well.

Poland in time will change for the better Ie wages and conditons, but there will always be a rich few and majority just making ends meet..The ones who have not will always be envious of the ones who have.. and if you are better off be prepared for constant demands for funds from other family members and friends..someone will always have his hand out for a share of your wealth.mmmmmmmm how true.
krysia 23 | 3,057  
4 Sep 2006 /  #16
be prepared for constant demands for funds from other family members and friends..someone will always have his hand out for a share of your wealth.mmmmmmmm how true.

Ya, like when you win the lottery. You suddenly have "new" family members and "new" friends who will help you with your money.

krysia whats your mother tongue- polish- english

My mother's tongue is pink with white spots on it.
Matyjasz 2 | 1,544  
4 Sep 2006 /  #17
Quoting: ola123, Post #5
You wrote that it is not good for Poland but sadly I think it IS good for Poland because less people in the country means more work for those who stay.

I disagree. You know why? Because it does not solve the problem of unemployment and low-wages in Poland.

In my opinion it does actually solve this problem. At least at some extend. There are more job offers on the market, and the employers are rising the wages in order to keep workers in the country. Of course you still can't compare them with those from the UK, but you can feel the improvement.

I keep repeating "DUH" or "WHAT?" because some social norms

Do explain.

Children adapt well living o/s and don't even want to visit poland..

I think that often this is being very painful for their parents. If you had a good childhood, you will always have some kind of nostalgia towards the place of your birth, and upbringing, but this doesn’t have to mean that your children will feel the same way about it. Actually why should they? They have a new, totally different home now.

But then again, maybe their grandchildren will visit some day this forum in order to get some information’s about the strange country their grandpa was always talking about. :)

well the sad answer is poland has little to offer...starting from weather to social security, poles are obsessed with politics (who cares) and religion (that would be o/k if they practiced what they preached.)

There's nothing wrong with polish weather! :) Nor with the discussions about politics or religion. I'm of a opinion that you should know what is currently going on in the world, and especially in your country, as it affects your life. It's maybe boring for you lef, but it's still far better than talking about what happened in the Big Brother house yesterday, or who was cheating who on the Jerry Springer Show.

Poland in time will change for the better Ie wages and conditons, but there will always be a rich few and majority just making ends meet..

And how can you be so sure of that? Are you some kind of a medium?

nd if you are better off be prepared for constant demands for funds from other family members and friends..someone will always have his hand out for a share of your wealth.mmmmmmmm how true.

Greed has been accompanying humans long before Poland started to exist. Please, remember this.

PS: The thing that astonishes me the most, is that the people that are actually moaning on this forum about the lousy condition of modern Poland are those who are no longer living here. I always thought that in the western society people tend to have a positive attitude towards life, but it seems that I’m the only one who is being truly positive here. It's quite funny, isn't it?
lef 11 | 478  
5 Sep 2006 /  #18
I think that often this is being very painful for their parents.

The world now is international just remember your parents didn't have the opportunity to travel and live overseas, now you can move around and live where it suits you.

you will always have some kind of nostalgia towards the place of your birth,

for a captain cook only (look), you live where you feel at home and what suits your lifestyle.

There's nothing wrong with polish weather

if you enjoy cold weather most of the year sure, poland is lovely.

Nor with the discussions about politics or religion. I'm of a opinion that you should know what is currently going on in the world, and especially in your country, as it affects your life.

People in a democracy elect a government to govern and do the right thing, if not they don't get re-elected...politics in poland is very erractic, each one trying to feather his own nest...(I do think the present leaders in poland are better than average) but how can you have a person like lepper who has only about 10% of the votes (his party) have so much say???.

Religion is important but lets practice what is taught to us in church, too many poles go to church and next moment are ripping people off etc...(I'm not saying all)

[

It's maybe boring for you lef, but it's still far better than talking about what happened in the Big Brother house yesterday, or who was cheating who on the Jerry Springer Show.

Not many watch US style rubbish...however, horses for courses, and each to his own..like the poles say, some people like cucumbers and some people like the gardeners daughter. mmmm.

And how can you be so sure of that? Are you some kind of a medium?

I think we can take this as read, once you have big businesses in poland, wages increase dramatically to management type jobs and filter down to the working class, unfortuanately when wages go up , so do commodities, pensioners feel the brunt because the government is unable to keep increasing the penson.

Greed has been accompanying humans long before Poland started to exist. Please, remember this

thats why

The thing that astonishes me the most, is that the people that are actually moaning on this forum about the lousy condition of modern Poland are those who are no longer living here.


People who have lived in poland under the harsh conditions from post war to the 80's cannot trust people in government, if you live in the west long enough you might understand.

but it seems that I’m the only one who is being truly positive here. It's quite funny, isn't it?

Not all poles have it bad, and if your happy with what you have, your are a blessed man.
iwona 12 | 542  
5 Sep 2006 /  #19
I think it depends on perosn and age she/he emigrated.

If someone emigrated as a child with parents this person will finish school abroad, find friends there and stay there. It is his homeland even he was born in Poland.These popel are sometimes interested in Poland want to visit parents homeland but that is all.

If someone moves as adult he will always have some nostalgia but again it depends on personality some people easier get used to new environment some

It makes me smile when someone says that when visiting Poland everything annoyes him. It is the same everythere- awkward rules in England, bad NHS, overpriced houses.....and USA?

I was there ones for 6 weeks I liked there a sa tourists but I wouldn't like to live there- my impression was that it is quite racicit place there, much more than Europe.

And the law? all strane rules? I wouldn't say it is free country.
I was reading yesterday that woman in USA was taking crack as pregnant and child was stilborn.
She got 12 years prison sentence for "killing "- ? It is bad what she was doing but they don;t even know if it was a reason.

or a captain cook only (look), you live where you feel at home and what suits your lifestyle.

lef,
It is quite shallow statement.
not everyone thinks so.
eddien  
5 Sep 2006 /  #20
you people have deserted your motherland...you should be ashamed.

You flood into other peoples countries to make a better life for yourself...you are selfish.

Go back to your own country and help to make it a better place to live...you are all cowards and parasites.
iwona 12 | 542  
5 Sep 2006 /  #21
eddien,

Why did you join this forum if you so much hate polish?

I don't understand.
Shelley  
5 Sep 2006 /  #22
iwona - i think they need to vent somewhere, I also think it's getting a little bit out of hand and the postings putting Polish people down are going to an all time high
iwona 12 | 542  
5 Sep 2006 /  #23
it is upsetting really.

I moved here over 4 years and was always saying that people are so tolerant here. Noone was hostile towards me because of my nationality.
I know that emigration is too big now, but these posts are just radiculus.
truebrit 3 | 196  
8 Sep 2006 /  #24
Go back to your own country and help to make it a better place to live...you are all cowards and parasites.

No eddien,you are the coward and parasite.You hide behind an anonymous name posting messages you are too cowardly to voice to real people.
Shelley  
8 Sep 2006 /  #25
Well said!
blur13  
8 Sep 2006 /  #26
The literacy of most of the Polish peeps on here is far better than a lot of my fellow countrymen posting on here. And they certainly seem more tolerant.

Not the most friendly forum I've ever visited, but then again there's always going to be the odd arsehole who spoils it for the rest of us.

I guess it's more noticeable because there are so few people posting. I wonder how many members regularly post here?
Shelley  
8 Sep 2006 /  #27
The literacy of most Poles in general is better than that of your average Brit in the UK, they study harder and actually don't see being studious as something to be ashamed of.

As for the forum, it's only forum I have ever visited so cant say if it's good or bad.
Decorator 4 | 291  
8 Sep 2006 /  #28
There is only a minority, when it comes to anti-polish comments i think blur13. I guess this stems from the amount of migrant workers in the UK at the moment. It is a lot easier to blame the Polish people rather than our own Goverment for not dealing with the issue in the first place..
Matyjasz 2 | 1,544  
11 Sep 2006 /  #29
Quoting: Matyjasz, Post #22
I think that often this is being very painful for their parents.

The world now is international just remember your parents didn't have the opportunity to travel and live overseas, now you can move around and live where it suits you.

You misunderstood me lef. It was just a mere statement driven from my experience. I have met few couples abroad, and I saw how they suffered because their children didn't share their affection towards Poland. I wasn't trying to judge them. I think you may have taken it to personally.

Quoting: Matyjasz, Post #22
you will always have some kind of nostalgia towards the place of your birth,

for a captain cook only (look), you live where you feel at home and what suits your lifestyle.

You make it sound so easy, but if you were to immigrate to another country because of pure economic reasons, wouldn’t you miss Australia? Do you love your country only because of the healthcare system, job availability, politicians, money that can be earned there or is it maybe because of your friends, family members, some good old memories, beautiful landscape, food, music, culture, tradition, etc…? What exactly does Australia mean to you lef?

Quoting: Matyjasz, Post #22
There's nothing wrong with polish weather

if you enjoy cold weather most of the year sure, poland is lovely.

I love the fact that I can go ice-skating in winter, swimming in summer, witness everything coming back to live in spring, and appreciate beautiful sites of "Polish Golden Autumn".

Besides, I can't imagine Christmas without snow. :(

but how can you have a person like lepper who has only about 10% of the votes (his party) have so much say???.
Religion is important but lets practice what is taught to us in church, too many poles go to church and next moment are ripping people off etc...(I'm not saying all)

Just two out of many topics that polish people like to discuss. :)
lef 11 | 478  
11 Sep 2006 /  #30
Besides, I can't imagine Christmas without snow

I couldn't imagine xmas without sunshine...mmmm

Just two out of many topics that polish people like to discuss.

pretty boring?

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