UK, Ireland / What's So Great About The UK? [416]

Thanks, BubbaWoo, I live in Hove.

You're right in that I have options, just like anyone, but it shouldn't have to be as drastic for me to leave the UK and live somewhere else.

I don't really want to leave. Broadly speaking, I like living here.

But surely the various Governments I've been voting in and out all these years and all the tax revenue they've had off me should count for something ?

I've played the game and got a job so being born here must entitle me to a slightly larger slice of the cake ?

UK, Ireland / What's So Great About The UK? [416]

Just in case anyone's interested, I specifically sought out a forum like this one as an alternative to all the slanging matches that are taking place right now on other forums.

I wanted an idea of what Polish and other Eastern Europeans think on all this and why they want to work for the minimum wage and hardly see their parents.

The British are perfectly capable of tearing lumps out of each other from behind their keyboards, some in favour of mass and uncontrolled immigration and but many others not, but I wanted to hear another point of view for a change.

And I don't think I am a "typical English whinger", Starchild, as if I was I wouldn't bother posting on here and ask for the opinions from the other side of the fence would I ? I'd be sitting in a pub somewhere getting drunk and whinging to people I know would agree with me.

I know I live in a city popular with tourists and students, but this runs deeper than the usual seasonal rush of a few extra people.

Alfriston is a very good choice for some peace, quiet and a nice village pub, BubbaWoo :-)

Anyway, no one has told me yet why they're so happy to be here.......

UK, Ireland / 13,000 Polish births this year, in the UK [180]

db1874

and the majority of these polish immigrants will be paying tax and NI contributiions so are perfectly entitled to use the education and health services.

Entitled from Day 1......

Are you serious ?

UK, Ireland / What's So Great About The UK? [416]


I came on here to try and have a serious debate / conversation and don't want this hi-jacked or to descend into nastiness.

UK, Ireland / What's So Great About The UK? [416]


Fair enough, pretty much the answer I expected , but I don't get how you all make ends meet ?

The cost of living is very high here and many British people I know have yet to be able to afford a mortgage. I'm lucky to have a mortgage and be on the property ladder, which is part of the reason why emmigrating would be harder. You're right in that I've only ever lived here, so can't compare it to anywhere that might be worse.

I appreciate wages are higher here compared to what you might be used to, but I don't really understand how it pays all your bills.

You maybe riding high now, but what about in ten years time when you're still renting ? Do you see your earning potential growing and job prospects getting better the longer you are here ?

The Poles I've met through work, and I don't mean to appear rude, are ok at what they do, but I don't seem them being promoted as their written English isn't so hot.

UK, Ireland / What's So Great About The UK? [416]


Thank you for your comments, Starchild, I hope I've gone some way to prove that I'm not the typical English whinger you might have first thought.

British banks are very irresponsible in the way that they lend money. Not only the that, they are also very bad at educating their customer in the way that various products, especially credit cards and overdrafts, work and whether or not they should be taken out.

Having worked in banks and for credit card companies for many years now I can say hand on heart that they chuck money at people and keep their fingers crossed they might get it back. In my day to day job I see a lot of people struggling with their finances and many are immigrants who can barely speak English enough to make themselves understood, let understand credit card Terms & Conditions. I truly don't know how these people can manage their lives with such a poor command of the language.

Although I only have one job, there is nothing wrong with my work ethic and, although I'm not saying anyone on here has suggested otherwise, I do get tired of being tarred with the "lazy British" brush and that the reason that immigrants seem to be doing so well is that they want to work and we don't.

UK, Ireland / What's So Great About The UK? [416]

Thanks so much for all your comments and replies, as I said before I'm genuinely interested in your answers and am not here to stir up trouble.

Yes I have issues with the way immigration seems to be going in this country, but I know that this is the fault of Government and I should probably be writing to my MP instead......although I doubt it would get much response.

I fully accept that it is the system that is at fault. Someone said that it only seems like there is loads of immigration as whole families mover over rather than just one family member. Whether it is part of their reason for coming or not, the immediate access to the services like the NHS does rub the British up the wrong way. We've been paying in a lot longer and resources are scarce enough as it is. I can't get an NHS prescription free as I have a job, so an immigrant mother who has lived here a few months and can get them free for her children does seem rather unfair. It also seems to work the other way around where a bloke working here can submit a claim for child benefit for his kids back home. Again, from "Day 1", this is a bit of a kick in the pants for the rest of us. Sure they can claim stuff in time (I would say five years worth of tax and NI first) but straight away makes a mockery of the system and makes the British feel like they're being treated like an ATM.

Someone also said that the current situation encourages us, the British, to renew our passion for our country. I think this is true. Never have I seen the Union Jack flag on so many cars and on so many TV adverts. In the past it has been seen as a symbol of the extreme right (the real f**k off home brigade) and has been associated with violent racism. Even I feel some national pride when I see the Union Jack now and I've not felt that in quite a while.

I don't have a problem with immigration, I just think it should be managed. I say this for the immigrants as much as anyone else as it can't be nice to be seen as a freeloader by people who don’t bother to find out anything about you first.

It seems that those on here who are Polish and live here have all had pretty positive experiences of the British people. That's great, but if something doesn't change soon and stronger rules put it place, I don't see that lasting.

UK, Ireland / What's So Great About The UK? [416]

Has anyone actually tried living on the minimum wage ?

What is it ? Just under £6 an hour these days ? I don't get more than £8 an hour and I struggle.

I'm a little further forward trying to work out what immigrants come flocking to the UK for and there seems to be more common ground on here (on both sides) than first seems to be the case.

There is one person on here though that needs to wash their mouth out with soap and water.

There was a comment on here saying that you represent your nation when you speak your views on issues like this. Damn right you do !!

It only takes one or two people from any country to be nasty and before you know it, an entire nation gets branded as this or that.

As the guidelines say....... "play nicely!"

UK, Ireland / What's So Great About The UK? [416]


I'm 34 years old, born and bred in the Home Counties of England in the shadow of the South Downs and named after a character in Britain's longest running drama serial .......can't get much more English than that, but I've still yet to see men walking to work in bowler hats carrying a brief case, an umbrella and a rolled up copy of "The Times". I think that is my parents' generation that you're talking about.

The genteel pace of life in the UK, similar to that seen on TV in things like Miss Marple or The Vicar of Dibley, has long gone and it has NOTHING to do with immigration. I'm not a social historian and can't give you specific reasons for it, but a "selfishness" has come from somewhere. I describe the current generation as the "Heat Magazine / Big Brother" generation with an unhealthy interest in the likes of David and Victoria Beckham.

That combined with what I see as soaring crime rates makes a grim future for all of us trying to make it here.

Keep plugging away Magdalena, but there is no shame in going home and saying things didn't work out. In fact it takes enormous courage to do that and should be seen as a real strength of character to be admired. Do what's right for you and don't worry about what others may or may not be thinking. Lands End really takes your breath away, so try and visit it if you can.

Osiol says this thread is the usual "shi*e throwing". Well, as I'm new here I can't compare it to what has gone before, but I think there is quite a lot of intelligent discussion going on for those who choose to find it and read it.

UK, Ireland / What's So Great About The UK? [416]

What do they prefer ?

UK, Ireland / What's So Great About The UK? [416]


Sounds like the lot for many British people living in Britain today.

UK, Ireland / What's So Great About The UK? [416]


Personally I think crime will get worse before it gets better, partly down to a lenient justice system and virtually full prisons.

Yes there are still some quiet country idylls left, but we the love affair with house and road building, how long is it before everything is concrete ?

UK, Ireland / What's So Great About The UK? [416]


You're assuming that his wife is not a British born asian, so she may have a British passport.


Yes I think I would feel better if there was less "Day 1" entitlement to things such as the NHS and the education system. Also no one could accuse anyone of wanting a free ride and anyone wanting said free ride wouldn't come here.

After five years of contributing it would be a different situation all together.


My main concern over the influx is mainly a practical one ie. where do we put everyone ? The UK is a tiny island and seems to be running out of space.

As for eroding British culture, that is something that is a much wider issue and if anything has been slipping away for ages. Some may think we're an intolerant nation, but in some ways we're over tolerant and allow ourselves to be walked over. There was talk on the radio this morning about certain areas of big cities being "no-go" areas unless you're muslim. This was probably a bit over stated, but it is that sort of thing that I mean.

In September 2006 I went to find my Dad's childhood home in Sparkhill, Birmingham. At best I would say it is now a ghetto mainly populated by muslims. I'm not saying anyone was forced to move away, but that seems to have been the result.

In some ways, we've not been "allowed" to hang onto our culture in that for fear of upsetting another culture or of being seen as racist, we've backed off, leaving them to do what they want.

UK, Ireland / What's So Great About The UK? [416]


There is a lot of language on here for describing a person's race that makes me a little uncomfortable.

Frogs ? You can accuse me of being PC if you like, but "frogs" just isn't very nice. Why can't just say "the French"?

I've also seen the words "brown people", which just leaves me shaking my head.

From what I have read, yes there are some British people who have issues with the Polish, but some of the the Polish seem to have an issue with almost everyone AND they're the ones wanting to be accepted without any aggro.

Who are the ones with the problem ?

UK, Ireland / Advice for my Polish friend who came to the UK to work [22]

He needs to learn English, that's the bottom line.

It isn't just a case of getting a job and a place to stay. He'll need a bank account and in time will be offered credit by Visa or similar if he hangs around long enough. You can't deal with these sorts of organisations without knowing the language. Sure the local council may have a few leaflets printed in other languages, but every organisation he deals with will expect him to speak English.

I work for a credit card company and the customers we have (of all shapes, sizes and backgrounds) who can't speak English very well make a rod for their own back in the long run. Apart from anything else, they often don't know what they're actually applying for or how credit cards work. This isn't because they are daft, I just think that credit cards are not part of Polish culture really so it is a steep learning curve for them.

Unfortunately, no one is going to sit down and explain it in any language other than English.

I can't believe anyone with real serious notion of trying to move to another country would do so without speaking the language of that country.

And people wonder why the British are getting so wound up by all this.

UK, Ireland / What's So Great About The UK? [416]

Do people on here think there will be a recession in the UK ?

If so, the effects on immigration ?

UK, Ireland / What's So Great About The UK? [416]


I am just finding that I have less and less money these days and am having to be very careful and not spend unless it is essential. Even a new, much needed pair of shoes is non-essential at the moment.

Just when I think it is safe, petrol goes up again which makes it more expensive to get to work and then that is more to find each month.

If it is about confidence then I think we're in trouble.

I think 2008 will be a very tough one financially.

UK, Ireland / What's it really like being a Polish worker in the UK? [25]


I take it you write for the Guardian.......

UK, Ireland / Many British have inferiority complex [131]


Used to what ?

Or do you mean "used too" ?

UK, Ireland / Polish doctors fly over just to work in the UK [15]

This is proof, if proof were needed, that the NHS has scant regard for its patients.

It shouldn't be allowed. It shouldn't be allowed, not because he is from another country, but because there is no way he can be alert enough all the time to make sound decisions.

Typical penny pinching NHS.

UK, Ireland / Babies of Polish couples born in England [25]


For every Michal who posts on a forum like he does here, there are 100s who keep their views to themselves.

That might be more polite, but it doesn't mean that the silent majority aren't about to bust a blood vessel I'm afraid.

On the passport situation, do the Polish want their children to be born here and to have British passport ?

Does having pride in their country mean nothing ?

UK, Ireland / Babies of Polish couples born in England [25]


So by that I take it that you mean that the average Polish parent can't wait to ditch their country and have their kids born here and brought up as British citizens with British passports ?

UK, Ireland / "Half of Poles in UK plan to return home" Telegraph article [8]

Interesting article, makes sense too.

The Daily Express seem to think different though.


dailyexpress.co.uk/posts/view/33067/Soft-touch-Britain

UK, Ireland / Do Polish immigrants wish to stay in UK - long term? [92]

I'm not Polish so forgive me for throwing my spanner in the works here.

I was also wondering this in terms of how the current economic situation is impacting on peoples' plans.

I have always sort of assumed that the Polish (and other EU migrants) came over to make some quick cash and then go home again. Some maybe staying but the bulk going back having witnessed first hand our crazy cost of living and general overcrowding.

Are people changing their plans now that the economy is taking a bit of a downturn ?

UK, Ireland / Three more Polish males lose lives on Irish roads [18]

Passing a driving test in one country shouldn't automatically give you licence to drive in another.

People should be tested again in the country they wish to drive in.

RIP

UK, Ireland / Multiple wives will mean multiple benefits in Britain (not only for Polish married couples) [29]

When I read articles like this I wonder if we (the British) are laughed at by the rest of the world.

UK, Ireland / Advertising for Electricians in Poland to work in the UK [14]

I agree with you Tony, however, I would tend to assume that someone hiring migrant workers is doing so to get cheap labour.

Therefore a firm of electricians who is hiring on the cheap isn't exactly going to be that bothered about their qualifications are they ?

There is good and bad in any industry, however, it's a bit of a kick in the spuds to British electricians who want the work to be passed over in favour of a cheaper foreign alternative.

Powerplus should be offering her jobs to the electricians who already live in Britain first.

UK, Ireland / Some EXAMPLES of salaries of Poles working and living in the UK. [49]

I'm a Brit and I find it's ok to talk about money matters with good friends or trusted work colleagues when you're chatting 1-1.

No one wants their nose rubbed in it if they're struggling though.

UK, Ireland / British/Polish baby [29]

Get married ? These days ? You're kidding me :-)