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Posts by Kilkline  

Joined: 23 Jul 2007 / Male ♂ 		Last Post: 18 Aug 2015
Threads: Total: 1 / In This Archive: 1
Posts: Total: 682 / In This Archive: 577 		From: London

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Kilkline   
4 Dec 2008
News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]

... like leaving your brothers to die on the front?

And winning wars. Its a good habit to get into and we can wholeheartedly recommend it.
What you fellas dont seem to understand is the bigger picture. Poland was one brief phase of what promised to be a long arduous process of attrition. Britain understood this. We knew that the longer things went on the better our chances. Charging into Poland in 1939 like the cavalry at Little Big Horn would have ended in glorious failure. Something Poles seem to regard as normal but we however do not.
Kilkline   
4 Dec 2008
News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]

Yeah, funny that later on you Brits had such hard time defending your borders. And you were further away, on the island, with bigger military power and the enemy was somehow tired by then. THAT is humorous.

If the enemy was tired it certainly wasnt from fighting Poland.

It was still hard but we managed it and as a result we were able to enjoy post war freedom and prosperity. It was pretty sweet, shame you missed it.

Brave computer warrior LOL

Just carrying on the fighting traditions of my forefathers, and as your taking a whipping from a foreigner so are you in your own way. :)
Kilkline   
4 Dec 2008
News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]

Do you laugh and joke about Holocaust or just Polish trying to defend borders. I am sure you have viewed the statistics as far as troops & equipment Poland was up against. Sorry but that just cold and not funny at all.

Comedy is merely tragedy happening to someone else.

By your logic nothing historic is a suitable subject for humour. Or is it just Polish history that should be exempt?

How do you invade Poland?

You march in backwards and tell them you are leaving.

Do you know how Wikipedia is made and maintained?
Kilkline   
4 Dec 2008
News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]

As a human that doesn't bother you?

That you lost or that we expected you to lose?

Check Iron's comment. He said that we were worse than the French.

It was hardly a malicious comment. Poland's inability to maintain its borders is an obvious subject for humour, even amongst Poles I bet.

If it isnt then it should be.

Not really. It's obvious in this point that Harry failed to convince anyone on Polish side and we failed to convince him and I was reflecting on why.

Well his arguments were more convincing and largely unanswered with anything credible. I learnt something new from his posts but nothing from the respondents. Then again maybe I'm also a leftist, or a Jew or some such other label that will allow my opinions to be dismissed readily.
Kilkline   
4 Dec 2008
News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]

Yet you expected Polish army who had not yet a chance to fully modernize, having been resurrected only 19 years earlier, to successfully defend us and laughing at us that we failed. So British.

No we didnt expect you to win, we expected you to lose which is what you did. No one was laughing about it and there'd be nothing 'so British' if anyone did. Other than that you're spot on though.

No, darling, that would be your domain. You are typical product of some leftist university. It's bizarre but true that there is never any recognition by leftists that their own passionately held beliefs have been proven wrong again and again. On the contrary, my experience with academics on the left is disdain for any opinion other than that approved by the leftist fraternity. Open-mindedness is not a characteristic of the left.

Changing the subject is a well established diversionary tactic. I feel you've been unsuccessful on this occasion though.

I just happen to have this in my mailbox from today.

A blogger. Wow.

And it shows what a big-hearted nation the Poles are, that they don’t make more of it.

Yeah, thanks for that.
Kilkline   
4 Dec 2008
News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]

Is this not what happened anyway in Poland? Polish military I speak to were fighting for a free Poland, not Soviet occupied Poland. 1989 is not that long ago.

Poland and the Polish people still exist. I sincerely hope you're just playing dumb.

This quote is about France vs. Britain and had they attacked Germany. What I question is what if all three, France, Britain and Poland did all jointly attack, could the world war be avoided?

You seem to be all over the place with your arguments and this discussion. I think you really need to get your thoughts and ideas in order before you carry on with this.
Kilkline   
4 Dec 2008
News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]

If Poland never went to war for Britain then who was that Polish beside you?

Poles were there but not for Britain. This is a basic historical fact that you dont seem to be able to grasp or if you do grasp it you seem intent on denying with your usual smokecreen of irrelevancies.

What did you have on your plate that would be more important than keeping your word to the ones you told, "we'll be there"?

The small matter of preparing for a war that we were in no position logistically to fight. We were under armed and under prepared. If we would have fought the Germans in a land war in 1939 we would have been beaten quickly and decisively. The war in Europe would have then been over and the Polish nation wouild now be a historical footnote with the Polish people exterminated or enslaved.

I guess you never saw the death toll on Non Jewish? Yes we were being killed and lived in inhumane conditions. Some felt a gas chamber would have been more humane that freezing, starving, slaving and watching each other die a slow death. In the end losing our country that we fought to save.

Non Communist continued to live under the conditions you decribe. Food in "Stalin's Communist Poland" was for the ones that were Moscow Poles.

If you think the situation in Poland in the postwar period is even a fraction as bad as it was under the Nazis then you seriously need to read more. Just because your family, as we are all aware, suffered under the Soviets dont make this the lens through which you see everything.

Priorities like your precious 5 o'clock tea, dahrlin'?

There is a justice after all: Britain was the biggest looser in WW 2. You lost your superpower position. So go ahead and tell us there was no point of helping Poland all you want. Losers. LOL

Your rambling and laughing at your own attempts at humour would indicate that you have no sound argument on the matter discussed.

Please try again.
Kilkline   
3 Dec 2008
News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]

We were your allies, yes, you should have dropped eveything and helped save Poland.

Until you can come to an understanding of how childish and selfish that sounds you will never have any 'closure' on this matter.

Poland never went to war for Britain, Britain did go to war for Poland however. Maybe we didnt go to war in the style and manner which suited Poland but hey, we had a couple of other things on our plate at the time. We won in the end, the Nazis were defeated and 'most' of Europe was free again. Poland was in the 'not so free' bit but at least you werent all being rounded up and lead to gas chambers or being shot en masse in the streets or being forced to live on starvation rations as you were pre-1946.
Kilkline   
3 Dec 2008
News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]

"Poms and sporting prowess".

Better than the Aussies if you look at the Olympics, and football, and the last 2 Rugby World Cups. And we're not a nation that even sees sport as our only means of national pride, unlike some cultural wastelands that I could mention.

It does seem however that Harry is being attacked for daring to question the whole mythology that some Poles have chosen to surround themselves with. He's raised good points that no one has really been able to counter without either getting insulting or giving some pretty woolly answers.

The situation is reminiscent of the accusations that many on here have leveled against Jews e.g. falsely claiming a unique victim status, crying about how other nations should have dropped everything and saved them, a failure to accept that maybe other nations had other priorities at the time.
Kilkline   
2 Dec 2008
News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]

I guess we can go there. "Cover" would mean, respond and help Poland with "all the support and assistance in it's power". I don't feel this was done

Thats an opinion, not a fact. We could argue that Britain actually did much, much more than was required as the agreement was for 'support and assistance' and therefore didnt require Britain to lose its pre eminent position in the world by declaring war on the largest and arguably strongest nation in Europe in the cause of a minor central European nation. Its seems that many Poles on here dont see the war as anything other than a battle for Polish soveriegnty
Kilkline   
2 Dec 2008
News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]

Both had aggreed that they would cover Poland if Germany attacked.

What does 'cover' mean?

This is article one of the Anglo-Polish Mutual Assistance Agreement:

"Should one of the Contracting Parties become engaged in hostilities with a European Power in consequence of aggression by the latter against that Contracting Party, the other Contracting Party will at once give the Contracting Party engaged in hostilities all the support and assistance in its power."

There is no promise by either country to take military action against an aggressor in the aid of the other.

Even after Poland knew they were betrayed they continued to fight for the very allies that they knew were betraying them. This to me says alot.

The Japanese kept fighting even when they new they'd lost. So did the Germans. Poles werent 'fighting for the allies' anymore than the Brits or Americans were.
Kilkline   
1 Dec 2008
News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]

When Brits laugh at Poles for Spetember/October 1939, it is them who deserve the laughs. The British and the French, the two "superpowers" were powerless anachronisms wrapped in pretty flags and great speeches, while Poland was the only country where Germans encountered any resistance to speak of.

Hindsights a beautiful thing. The policy of pacification was understandable given that WW1 was a fresh memory. A whole generation wiped out, a local skirmish that became a world war because of alliances and treaties.

Because of restored independence maybe Poles have positive memories of WW1, Brits most certainly didnt as we paid a high price for continental belligerence.
Also the Anglo-Polish Mutual Assistance Agreement is vague as to what type of assistance would be given. There was no promise by either country to take military action against an aggressor in the aid of the other. These were the terms that Poland agreed to and no doubt if the table were turned, the terms that Poland would have followed.
Kilkline   
1 Dec 2008
News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]

A simple question to clarify the gist of this entire thread:

Should protecting/saving Poland have been a priority for Britain even if it meant that Britain and the entire outcome of war would have been compromised?
Kilkline   
1 Dec 2008
News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]

So far from what I can see it seems that Britain's crime was:

-not invading Germany for treaty breaking and thus starting another European war only 15 years after the trauma of the last one.

and

-not inventing a time machine and using it to go back and murder a Bavarian infant.
Kilkline   
1 Dec 2008
News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]

Whether they could or couldn’t is another matter. But expect us, Poles, to be thankful to Britain for doing ... absolutely nothing for us is ridicules.

The threads on here go along the lines of 'why didnt Britain do more for us when we did so much for them?'
That doesnt seem as though its Britain thats doing the whinging or making the unreasonable retrospective demands.

And here I've always thought your strengths lies on the sea not on the land, walking not your strongest suit! :)

Sailing was an option. We could have done a reverse-Dunkirk with little old men and schoolboys coming to the rescue of Poland by pedalo.
Kilkline   
1 Dec 2008
News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]

Okay...but how would they had gotten their forces to Poland???
The devil IS in the details!

We would have walked. Probably after a good lunch of fish and chips. We would have had to liberate France and Germany on the way but we like a challenge so its no biggie.
Kilkline   
1 Dec 2008
News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]

What could they have done more?

I believe the general gist of the argument is that Britain should have used its extremely precious military resources to fight Germany from Poland rather than from Britain. Of course this would have left Britain's defences weakened and probably have brought an abrupt end to the war in Germany's favour but hey lets not concern ourselves with the details.
Kilkline   
1 Dec 2008
News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]

Yeah, those selfless Brits just couldn’t wait to run to Poland's help in September '39. But we, ungrateful Poles, never thank them enough.

Brits dont want thanks but failing to acknowledge that the reason Britain declared war on Germany was because of a pact with Poland, and then following this by going on as though Britain owes something to Poland because Poland helped us fight in this very same war seems a bit cheeky.

Could Britain have done more for Poland?

Yes.

Did we do all that could be reasonably expected for a bankrupt country heading for annihilation?

I reckon.
Kilkline   
28 Nov 2008
News / What did Poland get out of the wars and struggles for others? [1108]

So can any British national tell me why the British govermnent has 'frozen' the documents pertaining to Sikorski's death for 50 years? If it was just an accident, what do they have to lose? I thought the EU strived for transparency? I guess not.

The British government has never strived for transparency on any matters that pertain to state security. The term 'state security' is also used extremely widely to include how many cups of tea a department drinks. There may be something sinister in Sikorski's death, maybe not.

Do these come even close to the human sacrifice of Polish troops whose struggle to defend Britain,

Poles got the ****** end of the stick but they were no more fighting to defend Britain than the British were fighting to defend Poland. Each was fighting for their own country. Neither owes a debt to the other.
Kilkline   
7 Nov 2008
Travel / New Year's in Krakow [22]

A guy I work with said about 10 minutes ago that he spent last night drinking with Shakin Stevens son. Eerie.