News / Poland among the greatest enemies of Russia [112]

Thats your second victory over us in your history then :))))

History / World War II - a tragic story for Poland and the World [489]


Those are completely different situations, Poland was by WWII a nation and a country with nearly 8 centuries of independent state and over a millenium o national existence, Ukraine formed the beginnings of statehood only shortly after WWI and people of Ukraine didnt consider themselves as a nation untill 18 century.

So no there was no Ukraine as such.

News / Poland among the greatest enemies of Russia [112]


I agree, 7th place is just ridiculous, we deserve the first 3!

History / World War II - a tragic story for Poland and the World [489]


Dude, most people dont even know you exist, besides whats borshch and pyrogy? I got friends in Lwów and even i dont know:)))


Who? Just because You know something it doesnt mean its internationally famous


Hopefully.

History / World War II - a tragic story for Poland and the World [489]


The Jews, Polish nobles and citizens often of Ruthenian descent murdered by Cossacks were more often than not murdered simply because Cossacks were simple barbaric people not adhering to rules of war or simple civilized humanity.


I'm sorry all i can give you is Polish links (i dont speak Ukrainian) or Ukrainian historians. Cossacks were not pitchfork wielding peasants, they formed powerfull armies by any standard.

However i stand corrected i mixed Nalewajkos uprising which had at most 8.000 men with the later campaign.


We're famous for quite a few things Nathan, kiełbasa, vodka, hard work, WW2, Battle of Britain, what is Ukraine famous for?:)))


Yes we do, we deserve to be in EU and Nato, we deserve to have the strongest economy in Europe and we deserve to be a rapidly developing country with growing international leverage, and where is Ukraine today Nathan?:) Oh yeah where it was 30 or 50 years ago :)))

History / World War II - a tragic story for Poland and the World [489]

Allow the Polish army to cross Vistula, Polish regular forces outnumberd Germans pacyfying Warsaw 3 to 1 in manpower, 4 to 1 in tanks and 9 to 1 in artillery, if Stalin would allow Poles to help their countrymen they'd squash the German forces within days.

History / World War II - a tragic story for Poland and the World [489]


At the time most cities had Polish/Jewish/Polonized Ukrainian populations, sorry to break it to you bud but most cities had to be stormed.


No Nathan, Nalevajko had with him more than 9000 former registry Cossacks and at least 6000 dismounted and sich infantry, he had 15.000 regular troops which in that period has a massive amount, he also had Czern (armed civilian component) who were indeed poorly armed but even they were better off than you sell them.


Thats an interesting outlook, murdering wealthy people is ok because they're wealthy:)


You dont keep promises to rebels.


If you didnt fight us you'd be a part of Europe today, most likely with democracy and materially better off but hey whatever rocks your boat captain 40% of Polish GDP!

History / World War II - a tragic story for Poland and the World [489]


You're talking about a guy who edited a wiki article about a Polish-Ukrainian battle adding three times the combatants just so he could post an impressive "proof" of Ukrainian military achievements :))))

News / Poland and Germany - Germany unhappy with the present border with Poland? [88]


No its also the army with the highest general standard of training which again is Germany, trooper for trooper our professionals are much better and they proved it multiple times during excersize but a large component of our army is not yet professional.


Am i supposed to take this seriously? The first step to removing your weaknesses is to admit them, currently we dont stand a chance in a war with Germany.

History / World War II - a tragic story for Poland and the World [489]


Yes, murdering civilians and sacking defensless settlements, how... Ukrainian, and then Poles come and...


Force you to retreat since the victory at Biała Cerkiew was inconclusive and apparently you dont know that you can lose a battle but win a war, it also shows how superior our military was in that even after losing the battle you were still routed :)))


Well you were dealing with a professional military, of course they were going to pursue you untill they'd destroy you, you murdered civilians you didnt expect anything else than execution afterwards surely?


Again, he oversaw the murder of civilians, naturally that he was going to be tortured and executed, is there anything wrong about capital punishment for traitors and murderers?:)))


Wait? Is it my fault that your people were stupid enough to fvck with a country that in that particular period had one of the most powerfull militaries in the world? Of course we would outgun you, outnumber you and have troops of superior quality, that only shows how much more capable in organization and development of the miltary we are to you :))))


And yet you were forced to give yourself away to Russia to avoid Polish retaliation, you didnt win freedom, wealth or liberty and Poland still took back some of its land after WW1, thats what i call a minor victory for Ukraine.

Also Nathan i think you just edited that Wiki page under battle numbers, the forces under Piławce was 30.000 Ukrainians and 25.000, not 100.000 Ukrainians and 80.000 Poles, please dont resort to lying, entire army of commonwealth was no larger than 50.000 and Ukrainians never fielded more than 70.000 men on the field and that was only once together with the Tatar force.

But if you feel you must edit wiki to suit you it must really hurt you pride that you suck so much at war :)))))))

So yes Nathan my point still stands, Ukrainians won one war against Poland (out of 9) and thats it, you won 1 war in the entire history of your people.

Poland won over 80, and not against some redneck Ukrainian peasants but against Germans, Turks, Russians, Swedes ... :)))))

I edited the page back, also Nathan if you want to read up on your history read Boris Andreychuck, he's Ukrainian and gives a pretty good account of your conflicts with Poland.

News / Poland and Germany - Germany unhappy with the present border with Poland? [88]

Your military has barely enough money to feed its soldiers Nathan, you'd get overrun by a grandma with an attitude :))))


Lets be realistic, Germany has one of the most modern and efficient militaries in Europe, its going to be 20 or more years before we catch up in that regard.

History / World War II - a tragic story for Poland and the World [489]


And yet we still beat Ukraine in virtually every war, we're still almost three times as wealthy as you and we're recognizable in Europe whereas you are...what?:))))

News / Poland and Germany - Germany unhappy with the present border with Poland? [88]


Or perhaps your conquest by Muslims and cutting Serbs off from the internet so we're spared further fairy tales?

History / World War II - a tragic story for Poland and the World [489]


He had a Polish father, studied in Kraków and his workes were influenced by his Polish professor, he also most definitely spoke Polish.


That is incorrect, a few letter to Jagielloński Universytet are in Polish, his works were in Latin because that was the way of all Poles from the higher classes back then.


He had a German mother.

He also had a Polish father, fougth for Poland, learned in Poland, spoke Polish, he was definitely faaar more Polish than German and even today most dictonaries recognize him as such :))))


Who else was a famous German? Columbus?:))))

History / World War II - a tragic story for Poland and the World [489]


Actually a few of the mods aint Polish.


Polish Ukrainian wars:

1591–1593 - Kosiński Uprising - major Polish victory.
1594–1596 - Nalyvaiko Uprising - major Polish victory.
1625 - Zhmailo Uprising. - major Polish victory.
1630 - Fedorovych Uprising. - moderate Polish victory.
1635, Sulyma Uprising. - major Polish victory.
1637 - Pawluk Uprising. - major Polish victory.
1638 - Ostrzanin Uprising. - major Polish victory.
1648–1657, Khmelnytsky Uprising, - minor Ukrainian victory (Poland fights Swedes, Prussians, Russians and Balkan/Hungarian states )
1918–1919, Polish-Ukrainian War, - As always Ukrainians get owned.

Out of 9 wars you have won one when we fought most of the local powers, out of a total of 29 major battles you won 3.

Hardly kicking our ass all over the place Nathan :))))


Read the Polish way above, of course i was not serious about you being serfs or what we did to Ukraine being good, i was not serious about retaking Lwów but i'm completely serious when claiming you're well behind us on every possible field especially military.

Also Nathan in the only uprising which you won you have been commanded by a Cossack of Polish descent since Chmielnicki used a Polish coat of arms and his father has probably been an ethnically Polish noble :))))


Nathan if not for our wars with multiple powerfull nations you would still be our province today, Ukraine on its own never had potential enough to defeat Poland and history proves it.

History / World War II - a tragic story for Poland and the World [489]


Why do you people keep feeding him? I just scroll down not even reading his posts, it only pisses me off that you guys keep taking the bait, he's only here because people keep reading him and replying.

News / Poland and Germany - Germany unhappy with the present border with Poland? [88]


You know Crow i'm still in two minds, are you doing crack or is it some ongoing joke that only you're lauighing at ...

News / Poland and Germany - Germany unhappy with the present border with Poland? [88]


You realise we would lose any war with Germany? (Of course we'd probably break their industry and make their goverment collapse due to their losses in such war but we'd still lose).

History / World War II - a tragic story for Poland and the World [489]


Yes but could you please explain to us why did the awesome Ukrainians won only three battles out of more than 20? Why did you lose every single war? Why were we able to defeat you every single time we took the effort to fight you seriously?

While regretfully Poland fell behind the other old states of Europe you were never a power, even today you're the ass end of economic, political and military food chain, i find people like you have an amusing outlook on Poland, 20% dislike and 80% envy, you were always behind us on every field Nathan.

When discussing with BB i have to admit today we're well behind Germany but at least i can rely on periods when we were superior on every field and on the fact that legacy of the Commonwealth still lingers, our economy and political presence is proof and where is Ukraine today? A poverty stricken backwards state only a few paces past its communist period :)))


Or perhaps Europe will :)))

History / World War II - a tragic story for Poland and the World [489]


Maybe because we did almost all the fighting on the actual battlefield? Or maybe because you didnt have enough forces on your own which is why Austrians begged (and that is the word, they didnt request it, they begged for it) Polish help.

Its like French would claim they won the Normandy landings because they were there when its Americans and Brits who did the fighting, i simply refuse to diminish the credit of our soldiers.

If its a German victory its German, if its a joint victory its joint, this one was Polish, we did all the fighting and all the winning, that you were physically there doesnt change that or the fact that Germans of that day didnt think they could do it on their own which is why they called us.


Adoration or not we still kicked their arse.

History / World War II - a tragic story for Poland and the World [489]


Ok so who won the battle of Vienna? Your army which shot the cannons? Citizens of Vienna who sat behind the walls or Polish cavalry which massacred over 10.000 Turks?:)))


Which is why i think Germans are ungratefull twats and ultimately our enemies, you people never could show gratitude for what we did for you, we invited you into our lands, we gave you priveliges, we saved your arses and in return got arrogance, genocide and double dealings.

Ultimately it doesnt matter that you're polite about it all, you're still German with all its pleasant connotations.


How?:)))))

History / World War II - a tragic story for Poland and the World [489]


BBs version of history now?:) Just like with the "German built Gdańsk?

First of all there was no Lithuanian units in the Commonwealth force simply because they didnt make it in time.


Sobieski takes 27.000 Crown forces = Polish, Lithuanians acknowledge this as a Polish war too btw, the relief of Vienna is a minor point in their history for that reason.

The total of forces under vienna was 67.000 men, if you count the total forces available to the alliance it might be 80k but not under Vienna and the cavalry charge was delivered almost exclusively by Polish forces, there was German cavalry there but it was around 2000 out of a total of over 20.000 charging.

So yeah we're back to the "all Poles", turns out it was all Poles after all:)

And if you want further proof then how come after 11 hours of artillery duels it took us only 20 minutes to route the entire Turkish army? What part did the Reich had in it? Cheering us?:)))


Yes they did, the German contributions amount to about 1500-2000 heavy cavalry and 11 hours of fruitless artillery exchange, our contribution lasted about 20 minutes, in other words we didnt need the mass of infantry which didnt take part in the battle anyway, we didnt need German artillery even since it was our artillery that mauled the Sipahi.

The only Austrian achievement is succesfull defence of Vienna but then again Vienna was the largest fortress of its time so they just performed up to expectations.


Lovely, defending the greatest fortress in Europe:)) Personally i still think we should let Turks have their way with you, even your behaviour shows that saving Germans was a pretty serious fok up.

History / World War II - a tragic story for Poland and the World [489]


Nathan your country won three battles against us, out of a total of some 30+, you lost every single war against Poland and the only reason you exist in the form you do today is because of Russias protection so if we're pussies what does that make you:))))


BBs version of history now?:) Just like with the "German built Gdańsk?

First of all there was no Lithuanian units in the Commonwealth force simply because they didnt make it in time.


Sobieski takes 27.000 Crown forces = Polish, Lithuanians acknowledge this as a Polish war too btw, the relief of Vienna is a minor point in their history for that reason.

The total of forces under vienna was 67.000 men, if you count the total forces available to the alliance it might be 80k but not under Vienna and the cavalry charge was delivered almost exclusively by Polish forces, there was German cavalry there but it was around 2000 out of a total of over 20.000 charging.

So yeah we're back to the "all Poles", turns out it was all Poles after all:)

And if you want further proof then how come after 11 hours of artillery duels it took us only 20 minutes to route the entire Turkish army? What part did the Reich had in it? Cheering us?:)))

History / World War II - a tragic story for Poland and the World [489]


Who charged the Turkish forces? Poles.
Who broke the Turkish forces? Poles.
Who pursued the Turkish forces into their camp? Poles.

Oh i'm sorry there was a force of 2000 German reitars and dragoons who took part in the charge alongside 18.000 Poles, so yes it was Poles who saved the day since without Poles all those German forces could only stand there and look good.

Out of 31.000 cavalry 23.000 was Polish, Poland deployed more than 80% of all heavy cavalry, Poland deployed 100% of light skirmishers in the form of Tatars and Lisowczycy, Only Poland had lance armed cavalry capable of countering Sipahi charge.

And finally it was Poland that performed a four miles broad long heavy cavalry charge that massacred the elite turkish forces and routed the turkish army so any and all efforts of German forces were meaningless because without Poland German alliance was well and trully f*cked.

Also before you go "all Poles" the battle lasted for 12 hours. 11.40min of artillery duels and a 20 minute charge of Polish cavalry so yeah it was all Poland.

History / World War II - a tragic story for Poland and the World [489]


It was also your only major victory against regular Polish forces :)))


Whats to reduce? We know from multiple sources including a German Jesuit exactly how many soldiers Poles had: 9000 national cavalry, 3000 outlanders autorament cavalry and approximately 3000 infantry.


There was just this one defeat Nathan, you also won two battles against our militias, every single other battle fought against regular Polish military throught history ended in a disaster for you :))))


Ahhh so finally we get to the point! Yes Nathan you were helping us and you did a very good job too but you never "saved us" :)


That would be because Poles single handedly routed the bulk of Turkish forces at Vienna while Cossacks didnt contribute anything special at Chocim, the only thing you did was waste 4000 of your best cavalry against Polish orders which of course got your men massacred.


Thats wiki for you :)) It conveniently ignores facts that Poles called their heavy and light lancer cavalry Cossacks but these were regular Commonwealth units and "Cossacks" was a military jargon of the time, the actuall Ukrainian Cossack forces never exceeded 15.000-20.000 and except for your idiotic suicidal charge you were busy building a camp while Poles defended the position :)))

History / World War II - a tragic story for Poland and the World [489]


Its their only serious military achievement, even if its made up:)) What Nathan fails to mention is that at the time the term "Cossacks" was also assigned to Polish and Lithuanian heavy cavalry type namely "Pancerny" the registry forces were about 15.000 large and did not play any significant part in the battle of Chocim, a unit of them got killed off when they charged the Ottomans against all orders but thats it.

Amusingly enough they never mention the battle of Batoh which is the only battle in Ukrainian history where Ruthenians managed to defeat a large regular Polish military force instead they choose to make stuff up :))

Even more so, Cossacks didnt provide artillery, they ddint provide gunners and the registry was armed by Poles so Nathan at the battle of Khotyn your people were nothing more than cannon fodder so expensive units like Pancerni, Winged Hussars or elite infantries would not be wasted.

News / Is Poland ready for the swine fever stuff? [59]


You're so very very dead.

History / World War II - a tragic story for Poland and the World [489]

I'm not sure treating Nathan seriously does you any good, the guy is our little one man UPA forum warrior :))))

History / World War II - a tragic story for Poland and the World [489]


We are all communist freebird, for comrade Stalin! fokin' bugger


Yes we saved Europe, Ukraine always was rightfully ours and Russian and you're just temporary guests there and we never treated Ukrainian people like sh*t, we just made you our serfs and slaves, whats wrong about that? I mean you were happy, look at how bitter you are because you cant work our fields Nathan, you're just screaming "bring back serfdom!"

:))))

History / "Our Forgotten Allies" - Polish-American relations. [52]


You're out of respect for your allies too?:)


Completely irrelevant and Poland doesnt benefit from it.


Actually yes, it is, before Israel the Arabs didnt really give a crap about you and why should they?


Thats... thats probably the most outlandish claim ever.