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Scotland and Poland. Mutual connections since 1576

27 Dec 2008 /  #31
Dunno, could be many people.

Anyway, right on topic, spread the word.
27 Dec 2008 /  #32
As a teacher in a regular school, with classes of 30, I must administer tests to generate more marks. The more marks I have for individual students, the fairer is their final grade.

BTW, I meant Kettling.
Hassling-Ketling of Elgin was a fictional character in Henryk Sienkiewicz's novel Pan Wołodyjowski, the third volume of his award-winning The Trilogy. A Scotsman, Ketling moved to Poland where he became a Colonel of Artillery in service of the king of Poland John Casimir. Ketling got married to Krystyna Drohojowska, a former fiancee of his friend, Michał Wołodyjowski.

Ketling was killed in the Siege of Kamieniec Podolski, when he (together with Wołodyjowski) he blew himself up in a gunpowder depot.

Jan Nowicki played Ketling.


See him in courting action

The final scenes during the siege when he blew up the powder depot and himself too. Wołodyjowski said: Keting! It`s time! And Ketling did it. So romantically Polish, quite unusual for a Scotsman, isn`t it?? :):):)
27 Dec 2008 /  #33
Not so unusual, no.

Ketling, eh? Sounds like a brand of tea, dunno why
27 Dec 2008 /  #34
Who is a famous "Polish" Scot (some sources say he was an Englishman whose family had settled in Scotland) whom my generation admired for his bravery and honour?

that would montgomery scott?
27 Dec 2008 /  #35
He wasn't a Polish Scot, come on man
27 Dec 2008 /  #37
Trust me, us Aberdonians know him. Our local council were actually gonna erect a statue in his honour. The actor himself is Irish-Canadian (James Doohan).

I was a Trekkie and know a fair bit about him. I liked his role in Star Trek:TNG
28 Dec 2008 /  #38
that would montgomery scott?

Who do the hell was Monrgomery Scott?????
18 Apr 2009 /  #39
On the 16th of April 1746 the last major battle on the British mainland took place between the supporters of Bonnie Prince Charlie and the supporters of the Hanovarian British Government.

The Princes full name was - Prince Charles Edward Louis John Casimir Silvester Severino Maria Stuart III.

His Polish names are due to his mother, Maria Klementyna Sobieska - granddaughter of the Polish King John III Sobieski.
20 Apr 2009 /  #40
Sorry to break it to some of you, but theres no special attachement between the two countries.

Oh p*** off to Greece
My gramma was descendant of the one of 100 000 Scots imigrants in Poland about 1600.
20 Apr 2009 /  #41
My gramma was descendant of the one of 100 000 Scots imigrants in Poland about 1600.

Maybe years later, her sons took part in the Deluge, on the Swedish side...
20 Apr 2009 /  #42
Guys, don`t forget masses of Scottish mercenaries who visited Poland on various occasions, mostly with invading armies. Where do our Polish red-haired types come from?

Actually, no, it's probably vice versa: red hair existed in Eastern Europe and turkic tribes long before Scot migration in the 16th Century, and actually could have migrated with the first Celtic tribes to Gaul and the British Isles.

Ok, here are some quick links and excerpts (I couldn't find my other links at the moment, but these will do):

"Origins. The Khazars were a Turkic people who originated in Central Asia. The early Turkic tribes were quite diverse, although it is believed that reddish hair was predominant among them prior to the Mongol conquests.

"The early history of Russia, like those of many countries, is one of migrating peoples and ancient kingdoms. In fact, early Russia was not exactly "Russia," but a collection of cities that gradually coalesced into an empire. I n the early part of the ninth century, as part of the same great movement that brough the Danes to England and the Norsemen to Western Europe, a Scandanavian people known as the Varangians crossed the Baltic Sea and landed in Eastern Europe."

"Red hair is often assumed to have emerged with the Celts, but the gene for redheadedness existed long before the Celts came into being, at the start of the first millennium BC around the headwaters of the Rhine, the Rhone and the Danube. One theory is that red hair arrived in Europe with the Iranic-speaking steppe tribes who lived the areas north of and around the Black Sea from 4,000 years ago to the 6th century. Today, there is a surprising number of redheads in Afghanistan, Iran and the Urals, as well as in Azerbaijan and Georgia. It is possible that this "Iranic" ginger trait was transferred to other populations, including the Celts, whose original hair color was various shades of brown and black in general."
derek trotter  
20 Apr 2009 /  #43
here is a real source, not like crap calicoe talks about
20 Apr 2009 /  #44
Maybe years later, her sons took part in the Deluge, on the Swedish side...

hardly possible as she had only daugthers lol
but if you mean her forefather I doubt it very much.
21 Apr 2009 /  #45
uhm, why was my response to derek trotter's crap comment edited out? There is absolutely no reason for that edit, as it is a response and relevant to his crap comment.

The title of this thread is : "Scotland and Poland - Mutual Connections since 1576", which make my comments totally relevant, especially in direct response to Paiwan's original comment which was untouched. Does the discussion of red hair between Scots and Poles not fall under mutual connections in some alternative, limited universe?

As I said previously, I was correcting the often erroneous belief that red hair in Eastern Europe comes from the Scottish re-migration to Poland in the 16th and 17th Century. Not the case, and most likely, Celts took the red-haired gene from the Danube region with them to the British Isles. You can check this thread for a further discussion and sources on this topic.

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