Races of white people...

I live here and really like it. Where r u from in Silesia?

opolszczyzna.net

OK. Who else ?

In my opinion the races in Europe are the Slavs,the Anglo-German and the Mediteranean race.There is also the hungaro-finn race and some smaller but these are minor.

The Slavs are divided into eastern Slavs(Russians,Ukrainians),Western Slavs(Poles,Czechs,Slovaks) and South Slavs(Serbs,Bulgarians).
The Anglo-Germans(or Aryans,western,whatever) are divided into English,Germans(Germans,Dutch,Austrians,Swiss) and Skandinavians.
The Mediteraneans are divided into Italians,Spanish,Greeks.
There are mixes.
French is mix between mediteranean and germanic race.
Bulgarians are mixed Mediteranean-Slavic.
Slovaks are mixed Slavs-hungarians.
Many Czechs are mixed germanic-Slavs.

Don't exist - The population of the British Isles might be some sort of Celtic / Germanic split, but then many of these were probably just indigenous people who went through a few changes of language (Pictish - what was that?)


So what about Finno-Ugric speakers, who include Finns, Estonians, Sami (who, to all appearances are not closely related at all), Hungarians (again, not so closely related - an admixture of Uralic, Turkic, Slavic people - whoever they're supposed to be)? The eastern Finno-Ugrians do not appear to be that closely related to some of their western counterparts.

What about Balts - Lithuanians, Latvians, the original Prussians (before the German thing started with them)?

Basques?

Caucasians (the ones from the Caucasus) who are often called European - three or more indigenous language families, all seemingly unrelated, plus Armenians (Indo-European), Azeris (Turkic)...

Then the fact that people have moved around so much throughout history and before, whether in warfare or in other forms of migration...

Variations between different groups of people do not often change dramatically across borders, but seem to chnage more gradually in a continuum. I find terms like 'white race' very problematic. Linguistics seems to be a very poor basis for describing race. The same also goes for geographical location, although perhaps slightly less so.

Let's all get a DNA test and then we can argue based on some new category! Fun! :)

There is no such thing as race.

But don't we need a way to describe differences in humans, just as a botanist would describe and differentiate variation in plants?

What is the problem with acknowledging differences?
Or is it just the term that you don't like?

*looks confused*

We can describe differences without the use of categories that place individuals in different groups according to things like appearance. One man may be one thing, his brother something else because he looks just about different enough.

If it's about heritage, has a new race been created every time a novel combination arises?
'Ladies and gentlemen, please give a warm welcome to the world's first half-Eskimo half-Hottentot!'

With plants, I shall admit that these intra-species classifications do exist. However, a Betula pendula from Poland is not in a seperate classification from a Betula pendula from Scotland (aaargh - the curse of Scotland on PF again). Differences between differently classified plants are those that have a difference to how the plant grows or reproduces. Humans do not have these inherent differences.

So then...if I am following your logic correctly....you are acknowledging the difference between genetics and the physical appearances that are expressed? Kind of a genotype vs. phenotype thing?

Or am I wandering in the fog (which has been known to happen and I rather enjoy the fog)

Ashkenazi Jews ;)


The best kind of Poles. Apart from the above, obviously. ;)

I mentioned before the continuum of variation within the human population. There has also been a lot of mixing between different groups.

Here's an example: a friend of mine is from London. Both his parents were Mauritian. He looks a bit Indian, a bit European and a bit African. This combination is not entirely unique to Mauritius, but it doesn't occur in all that many places around the world. Is Mauritian a race? Then what about his daughter who is half English? Another race?

There are genetic differences between people and it can be interesting, but assigning people to defined categories of race is problematic for reasons I think I have already explained. Humans are all of one species.

In fact, Homo sapiens sapiens is the only extant subspecies of Homo sapiens. I think we wiped out all the others because they looked funny or something.


Much racial categorisation is an attempt to clear the (unclearable) fog. All the while, the fog thickens around us.

I wrote about major categories.All these you mention are less than 10 million people.

But it is the groups of smaller numbers (between less than 10 million people and 1 person) that help make the world an interesting place and make pigeon-holing people difficult. What race are Poles when there may be not just Slavic but also Baltic, German, and (dare I say it) Jewish included in the mix? Does that make a Polish race?

This is lawyers' logic,not scientific.Small numbers are not important.


They are Slavs.They look like Slavs,talk like Slavs,move like Slavs and drink like Slavs.Of course within the slavic race there are differences and Poles have different looks from Russians,however they look more like other Slavs than they look like Germans.

Poles are also extremely homogenous,I saw the smallest variability in comparison to other slavic nations and this makes me think that they married between themselves and the mixes with other populations were negligible.

But good science takes every variable possible into account.


True.


I have already said that language has little to do with it. How many different languages were spoken across the Roman Empire for example, and in how many of these areas did they end up speaking Romance languages. What is the overwhelmingly dominant language in Ireland?


But when did this Polishness become defined?

When it comes to somewhere like Poland, I agree that it is a relatively homogenous nation in comparison with many other parts of Europe. There is still more than just Slav in Polishness. This doesn't make any difference to my point. Where there has been more mixture with other people in countries neighbouring Poland, does this assign them to a seperate races? Does it then depend on your population of 10 million cut-off point?

So some people may in fact be raceless in your opinion? Or is there a huge possibility of races, including half-Eskimo, half-Hottentot?


As I said at the start of this post: that is unscientific.

Don't forget Teutons. They're white.

Well, as far as I can tell, EU is a giant melting pot, and most of us were blended before our great-great grandparents opened their eyes.

On the basis of just one family (mine): 50% Czech, 25% Polish (actually Kaszubian and Catholic Byelorussian, to be exact), 25% German (from East Prussia, so actually somewhat "Slavicized" - if there is such a word). But I have Polish citizenship, speak Polish most often, have married a Pole and have Polish citizens for children who have a very vague idea of their origins. I am sure that at least 30% of all Polish citizens have such convoluted backgrounds ;-)

But we're still Polish, because what makes you Polish is in the water, the soil, the air, the literature, the bricks and mortar your house is built of.

European Races by Hitler lol :



in result Germans wanted to kill all "non-germanic" Poles and make form rest Germans (blue eyed childerns (1-4 year old) were taking form their Polish parents and given for German families)

European Races by Madison Grand:



Pan-Salvists have their ideas as well (main stream in Poland personaly I consider Poland slavic country):

Of course Russians or Serbs have some ideas of Slavic world:

DNA analysis will solve all these problems if it has not solved them already.Do you think it is incidental that there have been found slavic,western and mediteranean haplotypes?

What is phenotypically obvious has genotypic background.

it looks like Poland is the most Slavic country in all over the world ... lol. Hitler was wrong :P When he ordered to take Polish blue eyed kids to Germany ... ;)

Germany is more Slavic country than Serbia ... Russians are more Mongolians than Slavs ...

Hmm...that's Germanic...and originally Aryans have nothing to do with Europe ;)


That's too simple. The northwest region of Brittany is neither Mediterranean nor Germanic (for most of the people). They are of Celtic descent (unless you include the Celts into the Mediterranean branch).

Btw, isn't the haplogroup I typical of the Nordic countries ? Cause it seems that Germany and Poland have approximately the same proportion of hpl. I... Hitler was a fool ;)

Lots of similarities to Gaelic language too.

what can be interesting R1a (yelow) is very noticable in Norway, Island, Sweeden and Baltic States. They are Slavs as well ;-) ... even more than some nations who consider themselfes Slavs.

genraly it is funny, because it looks like Poland is homeland of genotype R1a and our neighbours are influenced by us ;-)

Breton is a Gaelic language ;) Not Gaelic sorry, Celtic, like the Gaelic ^^


Hehe ;) Where did you see that R1a is considered to be Slavic ? Isn't it just a common "feature" to most of the Slavic countries...cause all haplogroups are represented in each country...

If I were Hitler I would say WE ARE VIKINGS we are homeland of white race heheh (joke) and Germans wanted our blue eyed kids to improve their race ;)

Or maybe it is result of that we burned last Vikings capital and robbed them ;) (in middle ages)

All in all results are funny esp when we look on theories we had before.

To be honest it seems that we have to write new books about races in Europe ;) or just forget about races.

I think that nationalty, history, culture, climate have more influence on way of thinking than blood we have ...

Hehe, yeah he was a big fan of Viking sagas and Nordic mythology...The thing is that i do like Vikings too, i have a necklace representing Thor, and i find Nordic mythology very interesting ;) But i'm not planning on exterminate people just because they don't have the same hair or finger length... ;) I go almost every year to Wolin's Viking Festival (PL). Wolin was known as Jomsborg in the sagas, and Jomsborg's Vikings were ones of the bravest, strongest Vikings ever ;)


To make it purer. Basic German race is not pure enough, Polish blood adds something they don't have ;) LoL


I agree, and as we don't even know everything about our blood...
Imagine, maybe Hitler had some Jewish blood (not only on his flag), i mean in his veins ;P

I think this map is interesting. There are some centers of "our" genome group.

Poland, Norway, Western Ukraine, Czech rep, Island. finally central part of Serbia looks Slavic as well ;P

R1b genotype is interesting as well:

J genotype is interesting as well

I think it is vikings blood:

LoL ;) Haplogroup I ?...