Is 6500PLN/month enough for 2 people from India to live on in Wroclaw?

Merged: Moving to Poland, need your advice

Hello dear Forum, I need your advice.

I know there are a lot of topics like this around the forum, I've read most of them. But probably something has changed or you can supply me with a more relevant information.

I'm from Russia, still relatively young, and recently I got a job offer in Poland, Wroclaw. The salary is going to be 6500 zlt gross.

If I get this correctly the tax is around 19% (if income is less than 85,528zlt per year, and it is less - 5600*12=78000) which results to 5265 zlt NET.

Even if the money are not a real concern, I just want to leave Russia, get polish permanent residency and citizenship later. May you please help me to answer and clarify the following:

1) Am I correctly counting NET income? There are no hidden taxes in poland? If yes, 5265 NET will be enough to live as single person? As a family of two (no kids)?

2) I suppose renting an apartment will cost me 2000zlt, utilities around 500zlt and food around 500zlt, transportation around 100zlt and cellular phone charges around 50zlt per month. This leaves me with approx. 2115zlt free per month. Am I counting correctly? 2115zlt per month is enough to buy food/entertainment/electronics, at least sometimes?

3) If you been in both Poland and Russia, do u find Poland more attractive place to live? Why? Why not?
4) Is Wroclaw a nice city?

Thank you very much for your aid.

6500 gross is ~4600 net. On the other hand regarding renting costs, you should find something decent for like 1500 a month...

What else is deducted apart from 19% tax? 500pln for NFZ monthly?

ZUS/NFZ and you have to pay it If you like it or not... It's gross minus ZUS/NFZ and then 19% of PIT out of what's left...

wynagrodzenia.pl/kalkulator.php -> type 6500 into the window and press the red button, it's broken down into details then...

Actually: "It's gross minus ZUS and then 19% of PIT out of what's left minus NFZ" or something like this... generally income tax is rather low, all those other things are pain in the ass...

But overall you can get lower middle class kind of lifestyle for that money, not a prince of persia of any sort but over average...

Of all the cities in Poland, Wrocław is the most progressive and feels most like the West. The student population is large compared to the general population, and it's probably the city that offers the most in terms of job opportunities and lifestyle to young people. I enjoyed living there very much.

A one-bedroom apartment will cost you about 2000 PLN, rent, administration fees and utilities included. A studio will cost you about 1500. A hidden cost is the administration fees. They are not included in the advertised rent for the apartment. Another hidden cost is heating. Older apartments can be very expensive to heat because they have bad windows that aren't sealed well. Make sure you have an older, experienced native Pole check out the apartment with you so you don't end up renting an apartment that costs a lot more than you can afford.

Also, this is the absolute worst time to be looking for an apartment because you'll be competing with hordes of students and recent graduates. If you come in January or February, it will be much easier.

In terms of public transport, the tram system is great. The most connected neighborhood is Szczepin-Mikołajów, particularly around Zachodnia or Plac Strzegomski, with direct tram lines to practically every part of the city, and where there is a little "private" railway station as well that is a godsend if you travel out of town a lot, and close enough to the town center that you can easily walk. In any case, you don't want to rent an apartment that is far from the center or not serviced by a tram line, preferably by more than one. Cheap apartments are often either 1) substandard, 2) far from tram lines or 3) far from the center, so remember that location counts for a lot when you are looking for an apartment. For the money you are making, it's worth getting a decent apartment in a convenient neighborhood.

Food and household expenses, on the other hand, are going to cost more than 500 PLN a month, unless you absolutely adore home-cooked cabbage and potatoes. Budget on double that, and perhaps more if you like to eat or drink coffee or beer out of the house. Nothing can blow your budget more than alcohol and tobacco, so it is best to abstain from both.

On 4600 PLN net you would be able to live a pretty comfortable existence as a young person. You won't be rich or able to save up a lot, but your basic costs will be covered and you will be able to put away a little for a rainy day. The first year or two may be a little more expensive until you learn Polish and learn the ways locals save on money, but with Russian as your first language, you ought to be able to do that quickly.

As for your long-term plans, eventually you will be tempted to seek employment in the richer countries of Western Europe because of the much higher savings potential there. With nothing holding you in Poland, chances are high that you will eventually leave. The biggest problems with living and working in Poland are the low wages, the high cost of living relative to wages, and, most of all, the low savings potential. People in richer countries are easily able to SAVE as much or more than their Polish counterparts can EARN, which is why so many young Poles leave to find work in the West. As you get older, you will become more and more obsessed with how much money you are able to put away at the end of each month, especially if you plan to have a family and buy a home, and afterwards for putting the kids through college and retiring. But as for getting you foot in the door, Wrocław is a reasonable option for you at this point, especially in terms of convenience and comfort.

Thank you DominicB for your detailed reply. I really appreciate it.

Hi James Blakeman,

The hidden costs may vary. I'm renting 60 square meters flat in Wrocław city centre - around 10 - 15 minutes on foot form old town for 2150 and it includes all charges except for internet.

Many IT companies that hire in Wrocław have hired a lot of people from Ukraine and other post soviet block countries. This means there's a lot of Russian speakers around. On the other hand you can expect people who are not very fond of Putin ( both Ukrainians and Poles are similar in that regard I suppose). Of course nobody cares during your average work day in the office, but I've been a witness to many heated arguments.

What I can add on top of what DominicB wrote. There's a lot of bike paths and a lot of people just bike to work, there's also a public city bike available which is free as long as you fit your commute in under 20 minutes.

Merged: Evaluating an international job offer

Evaluating an international job offer:

I am an Indian. I have been offered a job as a Business Analyst and 13000 PLN gross monthly in Wroclaw. I have 6 years of work experience. I will be leaving alone for 2-3 months and then my wife will also join me. I will be renting an apartment/studio. I follow a pure vegetarian diet. I drink occasionally (a beer or 2 every month).

I checked the tax rates in Poland and found it to be around 36% (including tax + social security contributions). So after this deductions, I would be getting around 8300 PLN net.

Will this amount be fine for a family of 2? Please consider the rent expenses, public transport to and from office to my apartment as well.

Please consider this as a genuine problem and offer sincere advise.

Hi Saurabh,

The salary you have been offered is outstanding. You will live a very comfortable life on it. You'll be able to find a very decent apartment for around 2000 PLN, maybe less. All the other living costs will be more than covered by another 2000 PLN (considering you don't eat meat and don't dine/drink out often). So good chances are you'll be able to save around half of your net salary.

No may I ask you a question out of pure curiosity and as a person a little familiar with Polish IT job market. Are you a BA bearing some specific rare experience in a certain domain or solution? And if yes - in which one?

Hi AngryPole, I have experience in Financial Markets domain.

And thanks for your inputs, AngryPole.