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CULTURE SHOCK! (of my Polish finance who visited the US)


FUZZYWICKETS 8 | 1,883
2 Dec 2010 #121
convex wrote:

Is it the relative poverty that throws you off.....?

i mean, that is certainly part of it, but it ranks towards the bottom. before I left america to come here, i lived in a pretty run down city. it had money in certain neighborhoods like any other city but it had plenty of poverty....crime as well.

-general infrastructure differences was a big shock to me.

-without a doubt, the mentality of Poland. it's night and day compared to america.

-the work ethic here was also an adjustment. how often convex do you remember, in America, someone coming to work and telling their boss that they have a ''note from their doctor" and then not showing up to the office for 2 weeks because they were on sick leave? for the record, I'm not saying that's good or bad.....just different.

convex wrote:

the first time I visited Poland (the countryside, of course..), it was a lot like visiting a Mexican village with people that look like me.

haha, i know what you mean.
zetigrek
2 Dec 2010 #122
Black music. Yeah, a bit of a stark term.

Although the term MOBO is in common enough use (music of black origin) so it's not maybe as bad as it sounds, just a bit blunt maybe.

For me it doesn't sound bad at all. I was shocked to hear it can be consider racist...

-without a doubt, the mentality of Poland. it's night and day compared to america.

as I'm a person lacking of life experience could you name a few examples for me? I agree with you that the mentality is different, I'm just curious how does it look in the eyes of American.

Btw when I watch American reality shows it always strikes my that American women seems to be very affectionate - they easily start to cry. There was a stupid show on MTV (but also really funny that's why I was watching it) - 3 candidates for boyfriend/girlfriend were inhabiting with the family of a person they were competing of. They had some weird task to do and if they did not done it properly some dirty secrets about their lives were revealed in front of the host family. The parents were to chose best candidate for their daughter/son and the prize was the holiday trip. In use there was also a lie detector while nice questioning make up by host parents.

And I could not understand why those mothers were always crying and talking things like: "I will miss you all", "I regret I have to chose one of you" etc when dismissing playboys addicted to prns, cheating on partners and being lying that the like host mom's dinners. Most of them were just plain bastards but all the mothers in the show were always behaving like that. Is it some kind of savoir vivre to cry and say I will miss you all?
Teffle 22 | 1,321
2 Dec 2010 #123
I was shocked to hear it can be consider racist...

Well I can maybe understand how it might be considered so by the over sensitive or those looking for something to complain about, but no, I don't think it is racist either.
zetigrek
2 Dec 2010 #124
Well I can maybe understand how it might be considered so, but no, I don't think it is racist either.

It seems it is, at least for Americans. The guy asked the MediaMarkt stuff where they have then "white music". Afterwards he wrote on some forum about the whole story and that's why he consider Germans as racists... I heard that similar story was also in the UK where was some great discussion upon a radiostation advertising that they play "black music" :|
Seanus 15 | 19,706
2 Dec 2010 #125
Black man's music is considered correct but what about black women? ;) That's why black music is fine IMHO. We can't be overly PC.
Teffle 22 | 1,321
2 Dec 2010 #126
As well as blunt sounding it is also a bit lazy and inaccurate - what is black music: reggae? blues? rap? house? dance? soul? R&B?

It is of course frequently all these things - and often much more.

And of course white musicians also create music like this.

Where would Eminem's records be then since he arguably produces "black" music?

The shop was careless and should have expected trouble.

Anyway, very unlike a record shop to be so blasé about categorisation - they usually overdo that to the nth degree!! Not unusual to have dozens of sub genres for metal, dance etc.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,456
2 Dec 2010 #127
-the work ethic here was also an adjustment. how often convex do you remember, in America, someone coming to work and telling their boss that they have a ''note from their doctor" and then not showing up to the office for 2 weeks because they were on sick leave? for the record, I'm not saying that's good or bad.....just different.

The difference between the European and American work ethic is like night and day full stop, I think. Look at Europe - almost at the point when every worker has 4 weeks holiday. America on the other hand...

No doubt about it - Americans work harder than the vast majority of Europeans.
zetigrek
2 Dec 2010 #128
black music: reggae? blues? rap? house? dance? soul? R&B?

all kinds of music which are perceived as of African American origins. That would be: jazz, blues but MOSTLY hip-hop, r'n'b and soul. Even though rock'n'roll, techno, samba have "black" roots they are not consider as black music, probably because those generes are not so connected with black cultural movement of 70s. Also reggae rarely is discribed by this term because it's not US american phenomenom.

The shop was careless and should have expected trouble.

I think it's just a little faux pas and accusing of racist in this case is purely hysterical

The difference between the European and American work ethic is like night and day full stop, I think. Look at Europe - almost at the point when every worker has 4 weeks holiday. America on the other hand...

No doubt about it - Americans work harder than the vast majority of Europeans.

and where's time for life?
convex 20 | 3,978
2 Dec 2010 #129
As well as blunt sounding it is also a bit lazy and inaccurate - what is black music: reggae? blues? rap? house? dance? soul? R&B?

Black music is contemporary hip hop, rap, and r&b which originated from black communities in the US, therefore, black music. The term "Black music" reflects urban black American culture.

Where would Eminem's records be then since he arguably produces "black" music?

Eminem does indeed produce what would be called black music in Germany.

The shop was careless and should have expected trouble.

From some politically correct foreigner? Natives don't have a problem with it (black or white, you can see that in clubs on "black music night"), why should it be changed because someone has a problem? It's not meant to be offensive.
FUZZYWICKETS 8 | 1,883
2 Dec 2010 #130
zetigrek wrote:

as I'm a person lacking of life experince could you name a few examples for me? I agree with you that the mentality is different, I'm just curious how does it look in the eyes of American.

hmmmm.....mentality differences, yeah? ok. i'll give it a shot.

for one, america is a country with a looooong history of capitalism and democracy, successful business, ingenuity, invention, manufacturing, entertainment.....it goes on and on. Poland cannot claim the same. that, if anything, means a country full of people with entirely different ways of thinking.

secondly, poland is just polish. america is a huge melting pot so the country's "mentality" is made up of people from all over the world. in poland, often times one pole doesn't vary from the next.

thirdly, as previously mentioned, communism took a big bite out of poland and it's aftermath regarding the country's "mentality" still looms today.

4th, the socialistic attitude. you're more likely to find people that support such a system here than in the USA. this was very evident during the last presidential race in the USA and is still a huge issue today. Obama wants to socialize medicine a bit and the next thing you know, FOX news is screaming "he's a communist!"

it honestly goes on and on. maybe some other americans or people with extensive time spent "here and there" can continue. curious how others see it.
Teffle 22 | 1,321
2 Dec 2010 #131
what is black music

Guys, guys - thanks but it was a rhetorical question!

From some politically correct foreigner

Seemingly, yes.

Look at Europe - almost at the point when every worker has 4 weeks holiday. America on the other hand...

But is it not more that the US is unusual in this respect?

Not just Europe with the 4 week holiday - it's pretty normal throughout the developed world I think.
zetigrek
2 Dec 2010 #132
for one, america is a country with a looooong history of capitalism and democracy, successful business, ingenuity, invention, manufacturing, entertainment.....it goes on and on. Poland cannot claim the same. that, if anything, means a country full of people with entirely different ways of thinking.

Problem is that what works in US not always works in Poland. Poles are very skeptical, don't trust other people. People in poland are stingy and they rather buy cheap bad quality stuff and spare some little money than buy something of good quality. That's why its really hard to make a business in Poland. Everyone wants to have everything cheap or for free. They don't get the idea that if they let others to earn some money they will also gain as the country will grow economically. Now Poles let only to make money some big comapnies which can afford to produce/sell things very cheap. Why there is no ordinary grocery shops left? We have only: Biedronka, Tesco, Real etc. Where are all those little business which make countries rich and balanced?

Also the way the employers treat their emplploees is wrong and make sick situation when the employees don't give a sh of good work ethics looking just when to give up job and start own business useing old connections (stealing clinets of former employer).

secondly, poland is just polish. america is a huge melting pot so the country's "mentality" is made up of people from all over the world. in poland, often times one pole doesn't vary from the next.

I have no idea what you mean here. Maybe you did not soak enough in any group to know the people better. People are reserved when socializing with foreigners. You have to be really open and friendly to break the stiff athmosphere and remoteness.

4th, the socialistic attitude. you're more likely to find people that support such a system here than in the USA.

just like in whole Europe.

Obama wants to socialize medicine a bit and the next thing you know, FOX news is screaming "he's a communist!"

Yep it's quite funny. Do you know a Polish saying: wylewać dziecko z kąpielą?
FUZZYWICKETS 8 | 1,883
2 Dec 2010 #133
zetigrek wrote:

Problem is that what works in US not always works in Poland. Poles are very skeptical, don't trust other people. People in Poland are stingy and they rather buy cheap bad quality stuff and spare some little money than buy something of good quality. That's why its really hard to make a business in Poland.

ok. regardless, they're huge differences, whether they "work here" or not. I answered your question.

zetigrek wrote:

just like in whole Europe.

again, regardless. it's a difference between "here and there". I answered your question.

zetigrek wrote:

I have no idea what you mean here. Maybe you did not soak enough in any group to know the people better. People are reserved when socializing with foreigners. You have to be really open and friendly to break the stiff athmosphere and remoteness.

i think you misunderstood. there's no denying the fact, regardless of how social you are or aren't, that america offers a far wider range of mentalities than poland. poland is 98% polish. what more do we need to say.

zetigrek wrote:

wylewać dziecko z kąpielą?

same in english. "to pour the baby out with the bath water."
Teffle 22 | 1,321
2 Dec 2010 #134
Everyone wants to have everything cheap or for free. They don't get the idea that if they let others to earn some money they will also gain as the country will grow economically

Remnant of a communist mindset maybe?
zetigrek
2 Dec 2010 #135
i think you misunderstood. there's no denying the fact, regardless of how social you are or aren't, that america offers a far wider range of mentalities than poland. poland is 98% polish. what more do we need to say.

I still don't understand you. Could you give me a specific example?

Remnant of a communist mindset maybe?

Well yes, of course.
southern 75 | 7,096
2 Dec 2010 #136
Yes,Poles are stingy as hell.We on the other hand Mediteraneans cannot control our spending.
Seanus 15 | 19,706
2 Dec 2010 #137
Stingy or thrifty? There is a difference. The Greeks were a prime target for bankruptcy.
Teffle 22 | 1,321
2 Dec 2010 #138
Stingy or thrifty? There is a difference.

And believe me, a Scot would know ; )
Bzibzioh
2 Dec 2010 #139
Yes,Poles are stingy as hell.We on the other hand Mediteraneans cannot control our spending.

Maybe that's why Poland's finances are in sound condition, and Greece's ... not so much.
zetigrek
2 Dec 2010 #140
Just heard in radio. Ours aren't in good condition too...
FUZZYWICKETS 8 | 1,883
2 Dec 2010 #141
zetigrek wrote:

I still don't understand you. Could you give me a specific example?

geeze, i didn't expect this to go so long.

let's try this:

would you agree that people in china have different mentalities than people in poland? what about people in india? people in france? people in mexico? people in japan? people in Africa? people in Italy?

now, picture millions of people from all those countries including many others, all living in one big powerful country together........and that's the USA. compare that to a country (Poland) that is 98% polish, and 99.99% white.

if that doesn't make it clear how the USA's mentality is different from Poland's, I don't know what else to say.
Bratwurst Boy 11 | 10,703
2 Dec 2010 #142
What's wrong with "Black Music"?

I don't like rap or hip hop or R&B or what'siscalled...but it all falls under "black music" in Germany and nobody sees anything wrong with it.
zetigrek
2 Dec 2010 #143
is:

would you agree that people in china have different mentalities than people in Poland?

suprisingly not really.

what about people in India?

my tv tells me it's a myth.

people in France?

I heard they are mean. But that's all ;)

people in Japan?

ok, those are really weird.

now, picture millions of people from all those countries including many others,

They all become 100% American in their 2nd generation.

if that doesn't make it clear how the USA's mentality is different from Poland's, I don't know what else to say.

So it's just a transparent feeling. Nothing substantial?
Teffle 22 | 1,321
2 Dec 2010 #144
but it all falls under "black music"

I think that's the problem. It just lazy and not very accurate. It can sound dismissive too.
Bratwurst Boy 11 | 10,703
2 Dec 2010 #145
if that doesn't make it clear how the USA's mentality is different from Poland's, I don't know what else to say.

The US mentality was overwhelmingly WASP for the majority of their existence...meaning:
White Anglo Saxon Protestant

They mainly build the country and made it successfull...that is about to change sadly as the non-WASPS start to build majorities and hence taking over...expect the US to lose their edge.

I think that's the problem. It just lazy and not very accurate. It can sound dismissive too.

That's all your subjective opinions.

Rap, Hip Hop, R&B etc. stems from black artists, is still made mostly by black artists even as it now is part of the mainstream and whities try themselves on it. It belongs to their heritage, ask any black!

Black music is a term encompassing music produced or inspired by black people. In the 20th century, this term has come to usually refer to the many music genres of African American music, especially in the United States and Brazil.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_music

That's all!

If YOU have a problem with using "black" and think it's dismissive it shows more about your mindset than ours!

How are you calling it? "Chocolate" music? "Dark brown" music???

;)
Teffle 22 | 1,321
2 Dec 2010 #146
If YOU have a problem with using "black" and think it's dismissive

No I don't - I said it can sound dismissive

I can understand why it might cause problems but I've no real problem with it myself.

Anyway, it's not a term I would use because it's way too general and almost useless as a descriptive term.

Put it this way, if I went into a record shop in a predominantly black area with predominantly black clientele and saw all the categorised sections - "old school hip hop" "funk/rap fusion" "Detroit Soul" etc and then came accross "White music" I would be surprised to say the least.
Bratwurst Boy 11 | 10,703
2 Dec 2010 #147
I can understand why it might cause problems but I've no real problem with it myself.

That's what I was asking....WHY would it cause problems??? I never heard of anybody having problems with it till I read it here in this thread.

Anyway, it's not a term I would use because it's way too general and almost useless as a descriptive term.

Well...for most like me it's quite descriptive...all that we don't like! ;)
(I really detest rap and such)

Put it this way, if I went into a record shop in a predominantly black area with predominantly black clientele and saw all the categorised sections - "old school hip hop" "funk/rap fusion" "Detroit Soul" etc and then came accross "White music" I would be surprised to say the least.

Might be that there wasn't much of a black music till a few decades back?

Jazz is the only other form of music I know of where black musicians prevailed...but that is already it's own category.
Teffle 22 | 1,321
2 Dec 2010 #148
Well...for most like me it's quite descriptive...all that we don't like! ;)

Well for me, I love soul, funk & some old style blues. Don't like rap/hip hop etc.

So does that mean I "like black music" or not then?

; )
zetigrek
2 Dec 2010 #149
That's what I was asking....WHY would it cause problems???

because Americans think if you say aloud obvious (and neutral) fact that black people are black that means you are a racist.
I have no idea, especially knowing that Afroamericans like to use that term.

Well for me, I love soul, funk & some old style blues. Don't like rap/hip hop etc.

So does that mean I "like black music" or not then?

Black music is more commercial term. It is indeed a lil bit awkward when describing specific tastes.
pgtx 30 | 3,156
2 Dec 2010 #150
I have no idea, especially knowing that Afroamericans like to use that term.

how nice... yes, blacs can and whites cannot... i think that blacks are bigger racists than whites anyway...


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