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Poles in Ireland by Peadar de Burca. They "turned their backs on a country that gave them"


Seanus 15 | 19,706
12 Oct 2011 #91
Ireland should be reunited. Turned their backs, lol. What rubbish!
Ironside 49 | 10,474
12 Oct 2011 #92
Ireland should be reunited

why ?
legend 3 | 664
12 Oct 2011 #93
I want Ireland to be united too :|
Ironside 49 | 10,474
12 Oct 2011 #94
the question remains - why Ireland should be united?
delphiandomine 85 | 18,254
12 Oct 2011 #95
I want Ireland to be united too :|

It can be. There's a legal provision that allows Northern Ireland to join the Republic if the majority wish for it to be so.

Actually, there was a poll done recently - and the majority of Northern Irish Catholics want to stay in the UK. More generous welfare provisions, more generous subsidies - the list goes on.
Teffle 22 | 1,321
12 Oct 2011 #96
Although I doubt your reasons, this is the irony. NI has effectively become a nation state of its own. Many NI "nationalists" have little in common with, or interest in the republic. Many NI "unionists" have little in common with, or interest in Britain - although both pay lip service to both notions.
Barney 15 | 1,472
12 Oct 2011 #97
the question remains - why Ireland should be united?

Because the union with Britain was and continues to be a disaster for Ireland.

Actually, there was a poll done recently

It was called the assembly election which show the Belfast Telegraph's poll to be nonsense. (The Belfast Telegraph is a Unionist and therefore right wing conservative paper)
Seanus 15 | 19,706
12 Oct 2011 #98
It really makes sense. Why can't GB just be GB and eliminate the need for the UK?
Ironside 49 | 10,474
12 Oct 2011 #99
Barney Because the union with Britain was and continues to be a disaster for Ireland.[/quote]
For Ireland or for NI ? In what way ?

Seanus It really makes sense.[/quote]
Really? It also make sense that Lwów should belong to Poland, somehow you fail to see it!
Barney 15 | 1,472
12 Oct 2011 #100
For Ireland or for NI ?

Ireland the entire Island.

In what way ?

How long have you got?

Governance is about providing for the People whether you allow business to take the lead or it’s planned (to a greater or lesser degree) by the powers that be. The Union with Britain failed to give good governance and Ireland...The Island....suffered and continues to suffer.
Ironside 49 | 10,474
12 Oct 2011 #101
you are talking about the past, for the last say 90 years Republic was an independent entity,how Britain affected their governance ?

As for NI seems to me that until a few years back NI was doing well in comparison to the south.
Barney 15 | 1,472
12 Oct 2011 #102
An Editorial in the Manchester Guardian 15th May 1886

Ulster Protestants cannot destroy geography; they cannot dissolve the thousand ties that bind them to the Irish homeland. Represented in an Irish parliament, they could effectually protect Irish Protestantism; if they hold aloof from such a parliament, they will repent it. They will have refused to throw in their lot with their fellow countrymen, and their fellow countrymen will have a right to regard them as aliens. There will inevitably be a constant invasion of the special rights and privileges of Ulster, which Ulster can only resist by appealing for the help of England. If England listens to the plea, goodbye to the hope of friendly and peaceful relations between the two countries.

Its too complicated to go further.
Ironside 49 | 10,474
12 Oct 2011 #103
Its too complicated to go further.

you are still talking about the past and I tend to agree that in the past Ireland was abused but since 1922 Ireland is independent.
Why NI should be untied with Republic for other then political reason?
If implemented it would leave numerous minority inside Ireland's borders.
Teffle 22 | 1,321
12 Oct 2011 #104
If implemented it would leave numerous minority inside Ireland's borders.

This is where the problem really started (in case you didn't know but I think you maybe do) :

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plantation_of_Ulster
Seanus 15 | 19,706
12 Oct 2011 #105
I-S, they are part of one island. Lwów isn't part of the same land mass. The difference is that those in NI could vote yes to it. Those in Lwów are almost certain to say no.
isthatu2 4 | 2,704
12 Oct 2011 #106
Have you ever actually been to Ireland?

Wow, talk about dragging up an old post for no reason SeanBM............not that its relevent,but,I am Irish................and what part did you disagree with?

The fact that whenever the subject comes up a load of people with no connection whatsoever to ireland chip in with old republican bollox that they have no understanding of,just jump on the hollywood/plastic yank paddy bandwagon?

they are part of one island

So by that logic seanus, disolve the Scottish parliement and Welsh assembaly now because obviously the larger part of the island should rule over those inconvenient little bits at the top and side.
Ironside 49 | 10,474
12 Oct 2011 #107
This is where the problem really started (in case you didn't know but I think you maybe do) :

Yes I do know about that, and I do not question the past abuse. I just would like to know what would be a reason or reasons for NI united with Ireland.

Especially that British sizable minority would be strongly opposed to such merge and Ireland is not exactly Eldorado at it is.

I-S, they are part of one island. Lwów isn't part of the same land mass. The difference is that those in NI could vote yes to it. Those in Lwów are almost certain to say no.

So is England, Scotland and Walsh.
Well, if you would have had given to Soviets NI for a five years all their residents would be voting Russia no doubt about it.

Would you give up Dundee if for some reason fell into somebody's else hands?
Barney 15 | 1,472
12 Oct 2011 #108
Why NI should be untied with Republic for other then political reason?

Because it’s one Country, a line was drawn by the British through the country dividing families, farms, houses and villages. Its an artificial line drawn to ensure a sectarian state existed.

Reunification makes economic sense for example a unified transport infrastructure would be a good thing. In the North the Unionist government built a motorway to nowhere, not to the second largest city in the north Derry or Dublin the largest city on the Island but to a field 15km from the nearest town. This is an example of bad governance that union with Britain brought.

The provision of health care is another area that would benefit. There are so many areas that would benefit from reunification.
delphiandomine 85 | 18,254
12 Oct 2011 #109
Because it’s one Country, a line was drawn by the British through the country dividing families, farms, houses and villages. Its an artificial line drawn to ensure a sectarian state existed.

Interestingly, that should have been all cleared up - but the Boundary Commission's report was leaked - and it caused outrage in almost all quarters. As I recall, a lot of the absurdities were due to be eliminated, but because of the Nationalist population going mad because they didn't get the huge swathes of NI that they wanted, and the Unionist population going mad because of the loss of territory - it just couldn't happen.

There were plans to return areas such as South Armagh to Dublin - but, something that kept coming up - would the Republic really want such places? Ireland couldn't afford the 2bn+ subsidy given every year to NI, for a start.

In the North the Unionist government built a motorway to nowhere, not to the second largest city in the north Derry or Dublin the largest city on the Island but to a field 15km from the nearest town. This is an example of bad governance that union with Britain brought.

That was a fantastic example of how completely out of control the Unionst Government was in NI. The state of the road between Derry and Belfast to this day is a disgrace - but they do seem to be finally doing something about it.
Ironside 49 | 10,474
12 Oct 2011 #110
Because it’s one Country, a line was drawn by the British through the country dividing families, farms, houses and villages. Its an artificial line drawn to ensure a sectarian state existed.

Well, I would be my argument for regaining Lwów, somehow peeps on here found that hilarious.
Barney 15 | 1,472
12 Oct 2011 #111
but they do seem to be finally doing something about it.

Dublin is paying for the new road to be built.

Ireland couldn't afford the 2bn+ subsidy given every year to NI, for a start.

I've always thought that argument was a weak one.
delphiandomine 85 | 18,254
12 Oct 2011 #112
Dublin is paying for the new road to be built.

Not just there, but there's all the other improvements - the A1 is pretty much motorway-standard between the border and the M1 now, though they should just bite the bullet and designate the thing as motorway.

I've always thought that argument was a weak one.

I dunno - do you think Dublin would be keen on paying for all the stuff that keeps both sides quiet in NI? Would Dublin even want to have a lot of angry Unionists within her borders?

For what it's worth, I would have been a huge fan of handing over nationalist-majority areas in NI. Fermanagh, Tyrone and bits of Armagh could have gone south - and perhaps West Belfast. The Unionist part of Derry could have stayed in NI, along with most of the other counties. Given the circumstances of the time, they could have easily moved Nationalists/Unionists to the "right" side of the border - and NI would have remained as a overwhelmingly majority Unionist state.

Leaving Crossmaglen in the North was one of the most stupid moves ever made by the British, if you ask me.
Ironside 49 | 10,474
12 Oct 2011 #113
I've always thought that argument was a weak one.

what about British minority then ?

Seems that nobody knows or care what would happened with British minority in NI.
delphiandomine 85 | 18,254
12 Oct 2011 #114
What would happen?

Probably massive riots, open warfare and indiscriminate killings of Catholics.
isthatu2 4 | 2,704
12 Oct 2011 #115
Seems that nobody knows or care what would happened with British minority in NI.

No such thing old chap. NI Irish population is 100% British.
Ironside 49 | 10,474
12 Oct 2011 #116
Well, I think that somebody forgot to tell them about it.
Teffle 22 | 1,321
12 Oct 2011 #117
NI Irish population is 100% British.

Under the terms of the good Friday Agreement, not necessarily.
Barney 15 | 1,472
12 Oct 2011 #118
what about British minority then ?

They will have a larger voice/say within Ireland than within the UK.

For what it's worth, I would have been a huge fan of handing over nationalist-majority areas in NI. Fermanagh, Tyrone and bits of Armagh could have gone south - and perhaps West Belfast.

Partition didn’t work repartition wouldn’t work either. It seems strange but the way the electoral boundaries are means Belfast is almost a majority Nationalist city, Derry is Nationalist as is Armagh, Newry, Omagh and Enniskillen. Unionists dont really have a rock solid major city/town outside of Antrim or North Down, also the patchwork of nationalist areas in the Unionist Heartlands combined with the huge areas that are majority Nationalist would involve massive forced ethnic cleansing again and that would be a nightmare, repartition would be immoral.
hythorn 3 | 580
12 Oct 2011 #119
Seems that nobody knows or care what would happened with British minority in NI.

they have not exactly done themselves a lot of favours recently

Let's face it, the Poles are not exactly falling over themselves to welcome back the Polonia from Kazahkstan and other former Soviet Republics
Ironside 49 | 10,474
12 Oct 2011 #120
They will have a larger voice/say within Ireland than within the UK.

the way I see it they would lose economically....they maybe be a potential long term problem for Ireland,maybe in 25 yeas all circumstances change and unification would be possible

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