Polish in Britain - will I get decked if I speak Polish to these people?

At this stage, there is no Polish person in the UK without basic English, unless they have learning difficulties/special educational needs. In Ireland, I never met a Polish person, even working in a Polish shop who didn't speak basic English. Even way back, when they first began arriving in signifcant numbers, they made a real effort to learn English as quickly as possible.

I have to say, without being sexist, that the men were much more active in that respect. I suppose it makes a man feel 'weak' if he can't communicate but the first wave of women, who mostly came over to join their men, felt they didn't really need to learn as their man could do the talking. However that really changed once they began having children. They wanted to be able to deal with all the situations that arise when you're a mother and need to discuss your child with teachers, doctors etc. Also, after a time, more educated, professional Polish women began arriving on their own and wanted to work in their professions.

I knew several Poles who passed their professional exams in Ireland in areas like accountancy, banking, etc. and several working in various roles in government departments. The level of English spoken by Poles in Ireland anyway, is really very good at this stage.

Unfortunately there are Atch, at least from my experience:-

polishforums.com/off-topic/teaching-friend-english-advice-62703

This friend of mine is one of quite a few and went back to Poland a couple of years ago now.
I also had a lodger for 18 months who didn't speak any English, and who didn't want to learn either for fear of being laughed at.

I am not surprised at what Dreamergirl, if she is being truthful, says about her boyfriend not knowing English.
I have seen first hand how it works. The ones who don't speak English rely on other Poles who do to help with translating letters etc, making appointments.

So to answer the OP's question, in my experience Poles are only too happy for you to speak Polish to them. So happy in fact that if you aren't careful you might just end up as being a constant translator, as I was, and my Polish isn't that great. I have lost count of the times I have gone to dental surgeries, hospitals etc with Poles, and I must have made hundreds of phone calls to varying agencies on their behalf.

I don't do this so much now as the situation was getting out of hand and I simply don't have the time.
I would say that of the Poles I know, about two thirds have basic to very good English skills, but the rest have extremely limited English.

That's the bottom line really, I suppose we all bring our personal experience to the table. The only Poles I met in Ireland in recent years with very little English were the grandmothers who'd simply come over to act as childminders to their grandchildren.

Having taken a look at the link you posted, the OP was referring to a Polish woman who hadn't learnt English in the six years she'd lived in the UK. However this Polish woman was also unable to use a computer. As she had recently had a child, she's clearly a young woman. Now, in this day and age, a woman of childbearing years, who hasn't learned how to use a computer, would suggest that she's not very bright. So as I said, those with learning difficulties or special needs..............


Yes that sounds like a fair assessment.


Judge for yourself as to her integrity:
This is how she introduced herself to the forum:

https://polishforums.com/love/men-penis-size-77796/

Her main topic of conversation is penises and in particular that of Wulkan whom she's been stalking for several weeks now. She has also requested nude photos of Harry and wants to know whether his penis is larger than Wulkans and whether Wulkan has to have his taped to his leg.

She's a trolly dolly Chemikiem.

I don't think that's very fair to be honest.
I have a friend here who was a midwife in Poland who still doesn't speak English after being here for years.
It depends on how keen they are to learn the language, whether they get the chance to mix with English people, many I know work only with other Poles for example. Some do feel they will be laughed at for making mistakes and are loathe to learn for this reason alone. It's not so simple as to say that if they don't speak English, they are therefore retarded in some way.


I know. I haven't missed her posts. What I meant to say was that if she's not actually trolling and if there is an element of truth in what she says.

No, I'm not saying that at all Chemi. I meant that in the case of the girl mentioned in the link you posted, her failure to pick up any English over six years together with an inability to use a computer would suggest below average intelligence. As a teacher I've known many children with below average learning ability who still manage to use the internet and by their teens can create a basic document and do simple computing tasks. When an adult shows a lack of initiative or interest in acquiring those skills, and has also failed to pick up even the basics of a language after six years in the country, it would suggest a deficit of mental acuity in the first place.

One of the first signs of future learning difficulties visible in young children is a lack of interest. When a young child shows a lack of curiosity, it's an indicator that they may have learning difficulties. A child's natural response at eg the age of four, when you put something like a jigsaw puzzle in front of them, is to have a go. The brighter child will generally sustain the effort to complete the task for longer even if they ultimately fail, the less bright child gives up more quickly and the let's call it 'remedial case' doesn't attempt it at all.

Also I wouldn't say it's fair to call somebody with an IQ of let's say 80 'retarded'. They can be quite capable within their own limits, if given the right tasks and can have other talents and abilities. But there are some things that are simply beyond them.

It's not that Atch. She had the attitude that I have encountered in others who haven't picked up English. Basically she had no real reason to use it. As she put it, " I work only with Polish people, I watch Polsat, and in the supermarket I just give the cashier the money".

Her sister looked after her child while she was working, which was often very long shifts, so on top of that, she didn't have much opportunity to even mix with English people. She didn't learn English at school either, it wasn't widely taught when she was growing up.

With regard to using a computer, perhaps she couldn't afford to have one when she lived in Poland, I never asked.

I have met other older Poles here, my ex-lodger being one of them. He sat the matura in Poland, so he definitely wasn't below average intelligence, but he too, didn't learn English at school. I have never heard him speak a word of English. He said he felt that at 43 he was too old to learn a new language, and he felt that he might be laughed at for trying :(

Others I have met have found it too easy to get help from English speaking Poles, so their lack of learning is more down to laziness than intelligence.

I do find it hard to understand as I personally would hate to be totally dependent on others in a different country, because circumstances always change and maybe some day that help might dry up.

So as I said before, this is my experience, others here might agree with you, but I certainly don't think that the only Polish people in the UK lacking basic English must be SEN/learning difficulties.

Yes, you're right there. But actually I think that kind of attitude indicates a certain lack of something in the upstairs department. I think you and I would probably both agree that 'intelligence' takes many forms and isn't just confined to the old book learning! There's a kind of mental apathy in some people, which to me is a certain kind of intelligence deficit.


Growing up, yes it's quite possible that her family couldn't afford a computer but later on, after she got together with her boyfriend (father of her child I mean), I find it hard to believe that they wouldn't have had a computer. Poles absolutely love their technology, best telly they can afford, mobile phone, definitely computer. However, culturally, working class Polish men can be very controlling with women and she might not have been allowed to use the computer.


Yes, you're absolutely right about the age thing and the more general lack of confidence issue. It's amazing how many Poles one meets who understand quite a bit of English and even know some English but they simply do not want to try speaking. And again, the age thing is very much a part of Polish culture, there are so many people who are grandparents in their forties and once your a grandpa/grandma in Poland, that's it. I know a man who's in his fifties now but when he was about 35 he lost his job and he tried to get on to some re-training programme, a kind of sponsored government thing but he was told, 'you're too old'. So that attitude permeates Polish society at every level. Of course it's improving but it has a long way to go.

So to sum up, I suppose we could say, factors that might influence someone's level of English would include:

a) Laziness
b) Lack of confidence
c) Lack of necessity - no motive to learn
d) Lack of opportunity - no means
e) Lack of intelligence
f) Individual circumstances: for example, maybe a woman might be in a borderline abusive relationship
where the last thing on her mind is learning English or computer skills.

congratulate him living in the ghetto then.
funny thing is, that most people like that would the whinging as **** if the migrants to Poland (all dozen of them) would behave in similar way.

personally- i find it a bit pathetic and incredibly patronising when someone tries to speak "Czesc, jak sie masz?" in Polish to me (when they wouldn't even understand the answer)- pathetic because in most cases they mis-pronounce it (so they have to say that again- instead of much quicker "how are you" or "what's app?") and patronizing because for me it seems they don't even believe that someone else has mastered, actually, a decent standard of English.

Which is more "patronizing" aka condescending, Rubaszny? Some clueless foreigner blithely asking "Cześć, jak się masz?" upon first meeting, in an embarrassingly bad accent, or, an equally clueless Pole innocently inquiring in something resembling English after having been introduced "Hallaoo, meesterrr John! Chaooo arrr dooink?"

Both sound fairly ridiculous, if you ask me:-) As always in such cross-cultural situations, gobbledygook cuts both ways:-)

Spot on. A nice greeting is very different from someone interrupting a conversation you're having in Polish by suddenly speaking English because they either want to show off that they've had English lessons or somehow don't quite believe that an immigrant to Poland can (or should) speak Polish...

they are just trying to be funny or polite or to break the ice - if you have a problem with that, then you are really a bit sad.

English speakers are forced to listen to people mashing up their language constantly - is that 'incredibly patronising'? no, just somebody trying to get by and be friendly.

I actually think it's nice (if delivered correctly). It's sweet someone tries to make that effort. I definitely prefer it to someone who doesn't even make an effort to say my name.

for example RR, you have already mashed up that usual greeting - it's not "what's app".. but 'what's up'. but that is fine, we don't mind you slaughtering our language, we are used to it.

Quite. And even then, where I come from, "what's up?" means "what's wrong?".


And nobody gets stressed about it. In Poland however, there are quite a lot of people who can't get their heads around Polish being used by others.

Where I come from it is, "Whuzza" Honky. means "what is going on white boy".

clearly, I've made a mistake. mea culpa (name of the IM app obviously sneaked into my mind).
Where else have I slaughtered (your words, not mine) English language?

and ad topic:
well... I may not be the friendliest of people (especially not to the strangers), but the vast majority of cases someone (non-Polish) spoke Polish to me were when they wanted something (mostly tips) from me, or were smirking in patronizing way- you know, when they were surprised you read the English newspapers (some crap like daily fail, but in the work the choice is limited sometimes) etc.

If a someone wrote/said "What's app?", silly me, I might logically (as well as innocently) conclude they honestly wished to inquire "What's an app.?" aka "application" in computer slang:-)

Many times, misunderstandings of this nature are indeed based upon mispronunciations of the English word, later understood INCORRECTLY because they are thought by the foreign speaker to be the word they have in mind!

perhaps not you personally RR; sadly our language lacks a 'youse'...:D
Anyway it is not our fault you chose to surround yourself with rednecks in some backward hickville, now is it?
If someone chooses to practice their few words of Polish on you, take it as a compliment.

Exactly! Who knows. You might meet an Anglophone who's learned to speak Polish as well as you (...perhaps even better):-)

Don't sell us short.

My boyfriend is a nice person only thing is he doesn't know English and that's not his fault and we will manage

.....if his ladyfriend's his teacher, it seems doubtful he will ever learn it:-) No offenseLOL

Why's that

Oh, just observed (more than) a few (minor) infractions, but then, hey, HE sure won't notice......in ignorance is bliss:-)

He's fine, we have an app with pictures on my phone so we can communicate better plus helps us both learn each other's language

Whatever floats yer boat there, Dreamergirl:-) Dream on....

Miłosnych snów!

It's nice to be in love yes

Quite, I myself have been married now for nearly twenty years. The Polish phrase I posted simply means "Sweet dreams!" (lit. "Loving" dreams!)

:-)

I'd like to be married to my bf for that long! You're lucky!

Stick to the topic please

Eastern European migrants have been a familiar fixture on the London scene since at least the late '70's:-) When I was first in England, I was walking along Oxford Street and can still remember the sign hanging above a small bookstore "BROKEN ENGLISH UNDERSTOOD FLUENTLY!"

Can you beat that?

Way before that, at least 80 to 70 years earlier quite a few Eastern European Jews made to London.