Foreign investor, properties in Poland, walk away from mortgages?

No what he means is that if you take a loan in CHF but pay back in PLN, and then the exchange rate changes against the PLN (which it has done) then not only are you dealing with high interest payments and a deflating property bubble, but you also have a CHF loan which is 30% more expensive than when you signed up.

I reckon no matter how bad things get, the Poles would be the last people in Europe to protest (unless it over a cross or something holy).

Are you forgetting the protests against food shortages and communism or are these other little facts that you like to leave out of your posts.

Mark likes the idea of communism, remember - he would be first in line for his state-subsidised flat.

Americans are used to solving the issues that are connected with mortgages that are "under the water" ( price of property < amount of credit ) by way of mailing the deed and the keys to the house to the bank and walking away from the deal.

I wouldn't be surprised if U.S. courts actually approved of that solution, based on the idea that in every credit deal the bank is the stronger party ( a legal notion that is completely alien for Eastern European courts and judges ).


Read what I wrote earlier. Not going to happen.


Polish people and people in Eastern Europe in general are VERY unlikely to mass-protest, it was really a lot of work put in by the Reagan administration back in the 1980's that they went on mass strikes and ultimately brought down communism.

And that's one of the main reasons why all this mess around the world has stared... Debt doesn't disappear then... Others have to pay it back... If not through government's bail outs then through general higher cost of debt.

So those are street parties in Romania and Slovakia?

How much are they likely to influence the goverments in any way?

You can protest all you want in the Ukraine or Russia, things just won't change. So people in Eastern Europe don't protest as often as others.

my point exactly,then again ,the boys are admitted Thatcherites.

There was probably a secret agreement handle power to civil parties and there will be amnesty for your crimes.The only presidents who refused to obey were Ceausescu and Milosevic and they were delivered exemplary death.

no, just the same system of markets dictate. Democracy, is well dead now.

" just the same system of markets dictate."
The markets do indeed dictate that those who can't be bothered to get a job will never own their home (a good thing, they'd only expect the taxpayer top pay for the upkeep thereof).

Man when i did everyone become banker's mouthpiece's, the banks lent the money, they also can lose and should, creating and lending money is not a one-way street to endless profit. Anyone who can walk away from an underwater mortgage should, banks need to learn lessons too,

If you have few assets the banks will not waste their time chasing you, lawyers cost money. Play the game, but play it better.
The banks put their hands out when they need to be bailed out and no mater how much right wing, moral bulls*** people here say, they will force governments to bail them out.

Is'nt it funny that banks create huge problems and then get all the ignorant self-interested people to fight there moral arguments,

yea ,,,no shortage of idiots. However, some are payed to fight the banks moral argument.

Ok as long as you never want to borrow money for anything again. If you might ever like a loan for your kids college or a car to get to work suggest you don't walk away but come to some kind of settlement

I cannot remember a time when I have read so much truth on such a complex matter in so few words.
This is one of the best posts on this forum I have read.

Coulda, woulda, shoulda...

I was labouring under the impression that we were actually taking into account how the currently binding Polish civil law works regarding debts, obligations, mortgage-secured credit and so forth and not talking how things should be.

Under the currently binding Polish legal statutes a credit obligation is still a personal obligation regardless of the mortgage. Thus the bank can ( and frequently - will ) pursue all available forms of recover, which often means wage garnishment, going after other property of the debtor and so forth.

halo,

I would like to put some comments to lodz161 and give a short advice to whose who consider to leave the abandon the mortgage and property.

to cut the long story short I do not advice to do that. Most of the investors got a mortgage through metro bank = noble bank = dom bank = getin bank which is the same bank and now this holding run a new institution getbank who will specialize in receiving debts from customers outside of Poland. they will not come in a year or two but they have 10 years to claim the debt and this is sufficient time how to learn how to get the money back. please do not worry about the bank lawyers, they will earn money for their salary...

I advise to contact the bank and speak with them how to restructure your mortgage. with every month we have a few enquires regarding "leaving property". if you want to have more problems you can leave it and forget it for some time.

regards
Daniel

HI again.
Thank you everyone for contributing into the conversation.
Just to clarify I did not mean to open a political debate; Communism, capitalism, who is right or who is wrong.

I simply would like to know how many people default on a mortgage in Poland. ( I am sure there must be many)
More importantly I would like to know how can bank in Poland force me to pay back if I live in USA?Can they go after my proprieties in USA? Will they just damage my credit? I would think that it has to be pretty complicated, taking in consideration that there are two different countries involved.

Please let's not get into the moral issues of this, I am looking for an advise on precisely how will the bank act if I walk away from the mortgage.

Thanks

They will never let up in trying to get you. You might be fine, but who knows how US law may change. If the bank can pursue you in the USA over the next decade they may well do.

Generally I'd suggest negotiating a get out with the bank. Try get them to accept 40% or whatever.

Knowing what they will accept is very difficult, depending on your age, assets and earnings. They could also sell the debt to a US company

Not that I know of.An aquaintence of mine from the states defaulted on his flat and they just took over the flat(I dont know how)But his properties in the states are safe and his credit score untouched. YET!,its been almost 3 years though.

Hi, I may help you solving 100 % out of your economic situation right away on a consultation fee basis.
Wide experience from similar situations.
Ostrich tacticts are absolutely not recommended
Just get in touch with me and I will inform you step by step or take care over the whole situation in your name.

Best regards

My friend has a property "investment" apartment, currently the apartment is valued at £120k (uk sterling) and the mortgage is £200k. It has been aboat 4 years since he paid a depost and fitted the apartment at a cost of about £25-50k (dont know the exact figures).

The rent income from the apartment (after the letting agency fee 25% and service charge 20%) is not covering the mortgage payment and is topped up by around £200 monthly.

What would be the best thing to do? Many have advised not to default and I agree it is not a good solution. I hear there are investors that step in and pay the mortgage in return for a share (or all) of the property.

The property is in a very good area and is always rented out.

That's not an investment, that's a liability.

How do people get themselves in such a mess?

Probably greed? I do not know what he was thinking at the time. You are correct in saying that he currently is in a financial mess.

Swiss Franc strikes again.


There is very little liquidity in the market today, if you are looking to sell quickly to a investor you can expect an off in the region of 75% of current market value.. Your friend may be better off finding a private tenant rather than going through a management agency.

Get your figures straight first, £50,000 for fitting an apartment, thats like paying £2000 for a Ryan Air flight to Poland. 25% of the rental income on agency fees and 20% of monthly rental income for service charges, those figures are way off.


Blinded by greed first and foremost, then fluctuating currency exchange rates add a property crash and a few dedicated commission hungry agents and boom.

I would guess Nadzski is the PF joker MoOli

The name Nadzski is uncannily like Nazi...

Nadzski was my nick name when I played football as a child. Im no Nazi. Why would you say that based on anything I've said? Many people have made these investments in property, not just in Poland. Those are the facts, ive made nothing up.


Those are the facts, beleive it or not. £50k for a deposit AND fiting of apartment. My friend showed me the monthly rental income and 45% was taken by the management company and service charge. I dont think that is unusual if you go though a management company.

Thanks warszawski, finding a private tenant would be a good option to save the 25% of the rent income making it more feasable to carry on with the payments.

I was hoping there would be investors that help pay the monthly mortgage in return for a share of the property?

Did he buy through the now insolvent UK investment company Property Secrets? those guys were pulling some epic scams back in the day.