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80 years to the Battle of Moscow!!!


pawian 187 | 17,896
27 Jan 2022 #181
lost even larger share of manufacturing

Well, it isn`t always a disadvantage coz manufacturing is good for developing countries still stuck in an industrial era, while modern post industrial economies provide wealth mostly from other branches, e..g, services and high tech. However, this has changed recently due to pandemic and more and more experts claim they should return to the old industrial model.
OP Vlad1234 18 | 1,203
27 Jan 2022 #182
services and high tech.

I cannot remember any large high-tech company in all the former socialist block High tech is not only software but also hardware. It cannot exist without manufacturing as well.
pawian 187 | 17,896
27 Jan 2022 #183
I cannot remember any large high-tech company in all the former socialist block

Quite correct coz they are still too poor. A modern plant producing microchips costs a dozen billion $.

It cannot exist without manufacturing as well.

Yes, I also thought about it. I meant that one thousand microchips may cost the same as a million kilogram of nails etc.
OP Vlad1234 18 | 1,203
27 Jan 2022 #184
I understand now why so many Russians nostalgically recall the Soviet Union.

The level of inequality, corruption and organized crime is definitely not in favour of modern Russia.
pawian 187 | 17,896
27 Jan 2022 #185
The level of inequality, corruption and organized crime

I am sorry about it, that is the grim heritage of the communism. However, Russia had always had problems with corruption and inequality since its appearance so it is nothing new. Remember pieces of Russian literature which describe it?
Strzelec35 36 | 1,541
27 Jan 2022 #186
poland's biggest export is either apples or strawberries to the world i believe alongside the witched and cyberpunk from cd projekt red.
Novichok 3 | 7,111
28 Jan 2022 #187
Poland's biggest export is...

...people.
Alien 8 | 1,270
28 Jan 2022 #188
@Novichok; ...people
+ goods worth 280 billion euros (2021).
OP Vlad1234 18 | 1,203
28 Jan 2022 #189
One of the most respected and tragically famous hero in Russia is Zoya Kosmodemyanskaya. She became the first female in USSR who was awarded with "hero of the nation" title.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoya_Kosmodemyanskaya

She was hanged after severe tortures by German soldiers for partisan activity. It is claimed she didn't reveal any secrets and kept silent after tortures. She was 18 years old when she died. Her last words to the public during executions were:

"Hey, comrades! Why are you looking so sad? Be brave, fight, beat the Germans, burn, wipe them out! I'm not afraid to die, comrades. It is happiness to die for one's people!

and to the Germans:

You hang me now, but I'm not alone. There are two hundred million of us. You can't hang us all. They will avenge me.

Before the moment of hanging, with the rope on her neck, she said:[12][13]

Farewell, comrades! Fight, do not be afraid! Stalin is with us! Stalin will come!"
Many girls in USSR and modern Russia admired and continue to admire with her courage and wanted to be like she was.
There is a new novie after her. I wonder if someday someone could make translation to English or at least subtitles.
Later there were not a few other young Soviet girls and women who followed this mortar path. Typicaly they been cought, survived terrible and continous tortures, often sexual violence, kept silent and unbroken and been publicly executed. Interesting there were even a girls of Baltic ethicities among them who willingly fought for USSR. Often these women got gray hair just afer one day of tortures. Nowdays premortal words about Stalin could make somebody smile, but in those days it was a serious patriotic thing.
Miloslaw 14 | 4,389
28 Jan 2022 #190
Zoya Kosmodemyanskaya

She was a communist pig.
OP Vlad1234 18 | 1,203
28 Jan 2022 #191
She was almost a child at her 18 years. Just like other famous martyr - Joan of Arc.
Miloslaw 14 | 4,389
28 Jan 2022 #192
She was almost a child at her 18 years

And a stupid communist pig.
pawian 187 | 17,896
28 Jan 2022 #193
She was a communist pig.

You are a filthy pig if you talk this style about a person who was killed by Nazis for fighting them. It is really sad how swinishly you can behave sometimes.
Miloslaw 14 | 4,389
28 Jan 2022 #194
@pawian

She was a communist you moron and no better than the Nazis.
Witness a patriotic.Pole, Pawian,defending a Russian communist!
It is hilarious!
She was a pig.
pawian 187 | 17,896
28 Jan 2022 #195
Witness

Yes, witness how Milo swine is siding with Nazis. You lost the grip completely. :(:(:(
Miloslaw 14 | 4,389
28 Jan 2022 #196
Yes, witness how Milo swine is siding with Nazis

Really?Please explain exactly how I did that.
I won't let this go so please answer.
Paulina 13 | 3,474
28 Jan 2022 #197
She was a communist you moron and no better than the Nazis.

How do you know that she was "no better than the Nazis"? She was just 18 years old, like Polish "Inka". I don't think it was the girls' fault that she was raised in a Soviet state and fed it's propaganda, like many others, since she was born. I think you went too far with this. Who knows, maybe if "Inka" was raised in the Soviet Union, she would be shouting the same words. Think about it. We don't choose the place where we get born.
pawian 187 | 17,896
28 Jan 2022 #198
I did that.

You abused the memory of the person who was killed by Nazis coz she had taken up an armed resistance against them. Pure logic of it is that you wanted Nazis to remain unharmed and continue their killing spree. The conclusion is that you are siding with them. That means you are a Nazi lover swine. Simple.

I think you went too far with this.

Yes, he got carried away visibly but now is playing innocent.
OP Vlad1234 18 | 1,203
28 Jan 2022 #199
At least she didn't invade foreign country or advocated something like this. She didn't use violence to promote her political views. She just wanted to protect her country and people from occupation.
Paulina 13 | 3,474
28 Jan 2022 #200
@pawian, I'm afraid you got carried away too.

coz she had taken up an armed resistance against them.

I don't think that's the case. I'm guessing he called her like that because of the things she was shouting before her death ("comrades", "Stalin"). That is, if that's even true that she was shouting those exact words, because that could simply be Soviet propaganda - I wouldn't surprised.
pawian 187 | 17,896
29 Jan 2022 #201
I don't think that's the case.

Unfortunately, it seems you misunderstood my post. Read this part again: who was killed by Nazis coz she had taken up an armed resistance against them.

It seems you imagined reading this: You abused the memory of the person {..} coz she had taken up an armed resistance against them. which was wrong of course.

carried away

Nope. :):) Everything is as it should be. :):):)
Paulina 13 | 3,474
29 Jan 2022 #202
@pawian, well, the fact that he called her a "communist pig" doesn't automatically make him a Nazi lover. I do find his comment shocking though. Especially that she was so young...

That is normal between us.

Yeah, I've noticed. *rolls eyes and sighs*
(I think I'll go to sleep and leave you two to it lol - night night)
pawian 187 | 17,896
29 Jan 2022 #203
Nazi lover.

You have the right to keep your opinion. :)::)

leave you two to it lol

No, time to call it a day here, too. He can wait till tomorow. Or today. . :):)
OP Vlad1234 18 | 1,203
29 Jan 2022 #204
she was shouting those exact words, because that could simply be Soviet propaganda

Quite possibly. And I don't see an outright political propaganda in her words. Word "comrade" could be associated explicitely with communism around the globe, but in Russian there is no such a word. Word "tovarisch" commonly used in USSR wasn't originally invented by Bolsheviks. Basically it means just a "friend", "companion". And it was appropriet in the context she used it. It would be more foolish if she would say to the crowd of villagers and her compatriots who gathered to watch her death something like: "Ladies & Gentlmen"! Refrence to Stalin also isn't complitely communist. If some British soldier would mention Winston Churchill during his execution, does it mean this one soldier was a rabid conservator just like Churchil? It was just a name of a leader of the nation and country...
Paulina 13 | 3,474
29 Jan 2022 #205
Unfortunately, it seems you misunderstood my post.

Yes, I did, I'm sorry - I'm tired and I have a cold, I guess I shouldn't be writing on the forum when I'm in such a state, because apparently I have reading comprehension problems then lol

You have the right to keep your opinion. :)::)

Well, thank you... And I do stand by my opinion :)

Vlad, yes, I think I can agree with you. And she said: "It is happiness to die for one's people!" (and not "for Stalin" or "for communist"). She sounded like a patriot, I guess.

*"for communism"

Sorry, I ran out of time for editing (I really need to go to sleep ;D)
Novichok 3 | 7,111
29 Jan 2022 #206
She sounded like a patriot, I guess.

She sounded like a person whose risk of dying is near zero. There is nothing more stupid than dying for anything or anybody who is not your family.

Years of experience tell us that once you are dead you are not only useless but your decaying body is a health hazard to the living.

Conclusion: Don't die for your country. Help the other guy die for his.
Oathbreaker 4 | 492
29 Jan 2022 #207
@Vlad1234
Well if a Russian heard "Kameraten! Let's put bullets between these filthy untermenschen when we escape! *then proceeds to praise mustache man*"

Would you have a lot of warm feelings for said person? Regardless of gener or age? What you think Soviet soldiers and officers shouted in 1917-1921? In 1939-1945?

You would grow a very negative image of the word "kameraten" simply cause of when one heard it the most

PS: I am anti-communist and anti-nazi if it is not clear to all posters-> good example: "pawian"
OP Vlad1234 18 | 1,203
29 Jan 2022 #208
Don't die for your country.

Paradoxically, but if everyone would think like this, development in our World would be impossible. For example all the Europeans would be conquered by Mongols and still were living under their rule. And because Mongols didn't respect science and city culture too much, we all would be a horse herders by now. Progress is impossible without collective courage and self sacrifice.
Cojestdocholery 2 | 1,430
29 Jan 2022 #209
She was a communist

She was brainwashed. No need to call her a pig. Howere I wouldn't call her a hero, I'm sure Nazis too have their crop of 'heros' with really brave deeds. In context they are no heros they are poor people used by an evil idology.

Being a hero in service of the evil cause doesn't really count.
pawian 187 | 17,896
29 Jan 2022 #210
In context they are no heros

The definition of a hero is simple - it is a person who carries out brave deeds disregarding their own safety and risking their life. She is a hero coz she stood up to powerful Nazi terrorists while she could have hidden in the closet of her house, hoping they wouldn`t find her.

Was she right fighting on the Soviet side? It wasn`t only Soviet, let me remind you. Nazis planned the annihilation or deportation of mostly all Slavs from occupied Eastern territories. She decided to fight not only for herself, but also for her family, friends, neighbours and all other Slavs living in the East. She died shouting slogans about Stalin coz she was brainwashed, but she fought for her peoples, in fact.

Being a hero in service of the evil cause doesn't really count

It depends. A German soldier who performed heroic acts in the service of evil Nazis, wasn`t a hero but a terrorist who needed to be dealt with properly. Her case is different, though.


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