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The EU's New Pact on Migration and Asylum


Crow 148 | 9,276
26 Sep 2020 #31
Because Poland participated in the illegal Iraq war that did more than anything to destabilize the region

Won`t be consequences for Poland because of that participation. All knows hand of Poland was forced.

Besides, Poland is a Slavic civilization. Era when one could dream to harm Slavs is over. Things again came back to normalcy.
Ironside 50 | 11,090
26 Sep 2020 #32
Sure, but they won't because

I don't care for reasons. If their own people do not give a flying copulation about them why should Europeans go out of their way to help. Especially as it is not feasible in reality.

be Christians. As such t

Are you a Christian? If not I would appreciate if you would have refrain from bringing issues you don't understand it is akin to label people and tell them what they should think. Its condescending.

Just because there may be others in more need outside

999 out of 100 people out there are looking for better life in a mythical rich Europe. They will just keep coming. What you say is not practical and won't work in the long term. Helping is fine but it cannot be on the expense of our own people.

Your argument is based on some ideological or ethical standing that is ringgit and detached from reality.
I only hope that ruling elites in EU/Germany are driven by sinister plan to implement feudalism in Europe rather than some 'geek' ideals. Living in the Ivory tower must be nice.

Because Poland participated in the illegal Iraq war t

What legal is decided by those with an upper hand and more power. However the war in Iraq hasn't affected Europe and Poland that much. Whilst foolhardy introversion in Libya brought all kind of calamities and locust on Europe. Countries that took upon themslefses to act like imperial powers should fess up and deal with consequences by themslefses.

It is brazen of them to ask for help.
Tacitus 2 | 1,282
26 Sep 2020 #33
Are you a Christian

Sure. Not that nonbelievers have usually difficulties of understanding Jesus message, wthey just chose to not believe in them. This particular story is easy enough to understand though. And nonbelievers have of course every right to point out hipocrisy by those who claim to be Christian.

why should Europeans

Because we are better than that. Like the despised Samaritan was better than those who were supposedly better than him - including a priest.

Iraq hasn't affected Europe

Iraq destabilized the entire region. Former Saddam loyalists who were ousted from power played a key role in building up IS and it encouraged the kind of secretarian strife we see today. The direct consequences of Libya pale compared to that. Libyans make only up a small number of asylum applicants.
pawian 176 | 15,421
26 Sep 2020 #34
Are you a Christian? If not I would appreciate if you would have refrain from bringing issues you don't understand

I am and fully agree with Tacitus that we should help coz it is our fekking duty. What say you to that?
Ironside 50 | 11,090
26 Sep 2020 #35
What say you to that?

That you as a soviet are so lucky that cultural Marxism is prevalent in the EU, You have somebody you can easy swear an allegiance to, lick it boots and copy mindlessly. Whilst full of yourself for no sane reason and believing that you are superior by the virtue of being a copycat to all those normal patriotic/or not Poles that are disguised by your servility, your cultural alienation from Polish culture and by your poor grasp on realty as well as a deeply ingrained inferiority complex.

Your refences to Polish cultural treasury/heritage are so distorted and devoid of any deeper understanding that it sounds to me like mockery. The some goes for that twat Ziemko.

coz it is our fekking duty

Try to justify your claim. Prove me wrong as I think you are a moron and won't be able to. Not to any degree that would count.
pawian 176 | 15,421
26 Sep 2020 #36
disguised

disgusted??

s well as a deeply ingrained inferiority complex.

you are a bad psychologist. hahaha

Your refences to Polish cultural treasury/heritage are so distorted

Yes, as an emmigrant, you might get such an impression after being immersed in a foreign culture for nearly 30 years. After that time, Polish heritage looks distorted to you and you don`t know where you belong - here or there. Typical for all emigrants.

Not to any degree that would count.

So, if it doesn`t, we won`t bother, darling. Better tell us how you are going to burn my house as you threatened before. .
jon357 67 | 16,654
27 Sep 2020 #37
you are a bad psychologist. hahaha

To be a qualified psychologist he'd need intellectual rigour and academic application.

Basically the same sort of rigour and application that those who actually propose policy about migation in Europe have to have.

cultural Marxism

There is no such thing. Nor does Marxian theory in any way relate to migration and asylum. If anything, He was opposed ro it.
pawian 176 | 15,421
27 Sep 2020 #38
There is no such thing.

Yes, but extremists of all sides, in this case the right one, love inventing such illogical terms to terrify people and attract new fans for their cause.
Ironside 50 | 11,090
27 Sep 2020 #39
Sure.

Sorry. I wrote a reply to your post but meantime some clever mod decided to suspend me, my reply is gone. I don't feel like doing it all over again. Not your fault. I do apologize.

disgusted??

yes, disgusted.
pawian 176 | 15,421
27 Sep 2020 #40
Not your fault.

Of course not his, who would ever think so??? It is entirely your own fault if you don`t want to write it again.
pawian 176 | 15,421
27 Sep 2020 #41
Did you know today is the International Day of a Migrant and Refugee? That`s what the priest said at the beginning of the service. He asked the believers to open their hearts to the hardships those people suffer. He didn`t develop the topic in the sermon, though, probably fearing to outrage some "Catholics" in the hall.

So, there are still decent priests who notice the sad plight of migrants and refugees. When the migration crisis broke out and there were a lot of victims at the sea, a few priests in various churches put up symbolic displays to remind people about their duties of helping their brethren in difficult times. Photos below:

Jesus said: For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.'





Ironside 50 | 11,090
6 Oct 2020 #42
This particular story is easy enough to understand though

Those who pretend to be Christians very often misunderstand that. IOt is not about an encouragement to help a stranger but a refection that even those who do not 'share' the same faith can act as if they were. In other words - good deeds do not belong to a one religious group but are 'good deeds' regardless.

As for help there is order in which you help people. Doesn't pertain to people who travel hundreds of miles and demand help. Also a state is not a charitable institution and you can always help as you if you want.

[]Because we are better than that[/quote]
Better than what? there is no consensus, like 40% - 80% of people are not even Christians anymore. Who is better? A state? Politicians making decisions and paid by the taxpayers, to use those taxpayers money to 'help' some people? How is that even compute? IF they have such resource on their disposal why not use it better?

Seems to me like some countries want to use that issue to create precedent that so called EU has some kind of power over its less influent members. IF you want to builds 'union' on inequality no thank you.

[Tacitus]The direct consequences of Libya pale compared to that. L[/quote]
Not really. Look at the situation before and after Libya. It is clear that after fall of that country floodgates has been opened and Turks just used that opportunity to pressure EU.

who notice the sad plight of migrants and refugees.

Maybe they should notice poverty stricken people in Poland. Some of those refuges are better of than them. They couldn't afford to pay 2000 or 5000$ to smugglers?
jon357 67 | 16,654
6 Oct 2020 #43
Those who pretend to be Christians

Maybe they should notice poverty stricken people in Poland.

The cognitive dissonance is deafening...
pawian 176 | 15,421
6 Oct 2020 #44
As for help there is order in which you help people. Doesn't pertain to people who travel hundreds of miles and demand help.

Funny. Who set such a principle? Coz I didn`t find it in the Bible.
Ironside 50 | 11,090
7 Oct 2020 #45
Who give a F about you and your disabilities and limitations.
pawian 176 | 15,421
7 Oct 2020 #46
Oh, I see. So you set up your own sick values and principles. Ok but don`t expect decent people to accept them.
Ironside 50 | 11,090
8 Oct 2020 #47
So you set up your own sick values and principles.

No, it means that you have no clue and I'm not here to enlighten you as to what is what.
pawian 176 | 15,421
9 Oct 2020 #48
It seems you are here to enlighten nobody. hahaha
OP Bratwurst Boy 11 | 10,674
10 Nov 2020 #49
Merged:

The EU is about to reform immigration (integration + borders)



Government leaders Merkel, Macron and Kurz have formulated reforms concerning the integration and immigration in the EU.

EU draft declaration sets out stricter rules on migrant integration

theguardian.com/world/2020/nov/09/eu-draft-declaration-sets-out-stricter-rules-on-migrant-integration

...Contentious statement includes edict on learning language of new home country

But it also included "sanctions", saying EU governments should be able to tackle those who showed "sustained refusal to integrate".

They should also be able to "take systematic action to prevent radicalization", by taking down offensive online content.

They ought to cut public funding to "organizations that support content hostile to integration"....


euobserver.com/justice/150012

Additionally, the EU is set about to strengthen the EU Schengen border to get the control back about who moves in...that too should have been the rule but for years it wasn't.

Remember 2015? Merkel today:

..."I want to mention the entry-exit system in the Schengen area, which should be ready in 2022," she said after a meeting with other European leaders on Tuesday.

"It is vitally necessary to know who comes in and who leaves the Schengen area."...


At a first glance it doesn't look much but is nevertheless a 180° U-turn about handling especially the Muslim closed circles where the rules of the host countries are totally ignored in favor of living and enforcing a middle age, backward, fundamental kind of Islam, educating generations of Muslims unwilling and unable to adapt, integrate and assimilate...the never ending source of terrorists.

The eight-page text, leaked to the Financial Times and Guardian newspapers, said recent attacks in France and Austria showed the "extent of the threat we face from Islamist terrorism".

For the longest time Europe has looked the other way in the name of tolerance and liberalism...that ends now. IMHO these reforms, as small as they seem, spell the end of the easy life for hard core Muslims. But that won't be easy, they will protest and fight tooth and nail...
moondoggie - | 28
10 Nov 2020 #50
What a joke, there are 50,000 Muslim men in Bosnia alone ready to storm to Germany to get free apartments, they come for free stuff, which is why very few come to Poland, the ones that come to Poland take awhile to discover there is no free housing and they are not eligible for 500+
OP Bratwurst Boy 11 | 10,674
10 Nov 2020 #51
...thanks for merging, I couldn't find a good place!
Crow 148 | 9,276
12 Nov 2020 #52
come to Poland take awhile to discover there is no free housing and they are not eligible for 500+

Thanks to dobri Bog. You in Poland arent crazy as much as our brother in Christ, the Pope, thinks of you.

thanks for merging,

When we are at it, I heard many German woman cry while expect merging with children of Czarnybog.
OP Bratwurst Boy 11 | 10,674
13 Nov 2020 #53
From planned reforms to real politik appeasement!

Violent extremism linked to failure of migrants to integrate, EU says

theguardian.com/world/2020/nov/13/violent-extremism-migrants-failure-to-integrate-eu

In the heavily watered down accepted version of the reforms they no longer mention Islam or sanctions against integration denier at all.

I wonder how many more killed Europeans it will need for Brussels to really take a stand....

On the other hand the new "Pact on Asylum and Immigration" presented by VdL is probably being binned too as we speak as most countries, especially those from the EU outer borders, are quite unhappy with it.

taz.de/Migration-in-die-EU/!5728251/
Vlad1234 16 | 756
13 Nov 2020 #54
An interesting info: some sources claim that 95% of people from Ukraine who attempted to escape the war in Donetsk and asked for an asylum in Germany got instant refusals and were prohibited to enter Germany.

thestudentroom.co.uk/showthread.php?t=4463192
How many of the remaining 5% were turned back already in Germany?
OP Bratwurst Boy 11 | 10,674
13 Nov 2020 #55
Understandably, as those 95% surely came through Poland....

Country of first asylum

ec.europa.eu/home-affairs/e-library/glossary/country-first-asylum_en

Asylum shopping

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asylum_shopping

Poland is widely recognized as a "safe" first country, that's why their request for asylum needs to be processed there!

I wonder how the remaining 5% entered Germany though to get their request accepted here....
Vlad1234 16 | 756
13 Nov 2020 #56
Understandably, as those 95% surely came through Poland....

I don't know exactly, but I think that not necessarily. I think many could apply right in Ukraine, in German embassy. From what I know Poland accepted quite a few Ukr. refugees as well, so many of those who received refusals in Poland could ask in Germany later. But in any case it contrasts strangely with some claims of frau Merkel regarding refugees... But since it is internal German affair, I don't have any claims to her. Poland could be safe enough (as well as Russia, Belarus or Romania), but may be in a financial trouble to provide any normal living premises or jobs to those refugees. So, refusals would be expected...
OP Bratwurst Boy 11 | 10,674
13 Nov 2020 #57
. But since it is internal German affair,

It's not an "internal affair" but a law! :)

Poland is an EU border country (like Greece for example)....

To avoid abuses, European law, the Dublin Regulation, requires that asylum seekers have their asylum claim registered in the first country they arrive in, and that the decision of the first EU country they apply in, is the final decision in all EU countries.
Ironside 50 | 11,090
14 Nov 2020 #58
Poland is widely recognized as a "safe" first country,

Is Turkey unsafe and who decides which is which?
OP Bratwurst Boy 11 | 10,674
14 Nov 2020 #59
Turkey isn't in the EU but it still is a "candidate"....means it is still held up to EU standards (Copenhagen criterias) and considered safe.

Of course all EU member states are safe! More about "safe countries":

ec.europa.eu/home-affairs/sites/homeaffairs/files/what-we-do/policies/european-agenda-migration/background-information/docs/2_eu_safe_countries_of_origin_en.pdf
Vlad1234 16 | 756
14 Nov 2020 #60
Poland is an EU border country (like Greece for example)....

In this case Germany should be lucky enough not to accept any refugees. It doesn't border any unsafe country...


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