Additional capacity for Nordstream II - Germany plans to buy hydrogen from Russia and use NS II for transport

The coal plants need to be closed sooner or later, Iron. Better prepare now than to delay the unavoidable.

To close all the nuclear power plants on the other hand is something Germany definitely did go overboard with. But they are still only means to an end to get totally green. Not only from an ecological view point (one you could share or not), but from an industrial, technological, ressources and financial view point. Once it's installed and fully working it's much safer and alot more profitable (not to mention cleaner and INDEFINITELY sustainable).

To only see a Poland-hostile conspiracy in working towards Green Technology is just not smart, Iron. Not for polish long term interests!

So,

coal plants - NO

power plants - as long as we need them

green tech - YES

If you want to modernize Poland you will want a gov that phases coal plants out....there is no other way.

euractiv.com/section/climate-environment/news/europe-halfway-towards-closing-all-coal-power-plants-by-2030/

Well, I would say that fact do not rather sail smoothly with Soviet and now Russian claims about so called great war. It would be much batter to put Soviets as a different category and not use their narrative in Russian context but It is what it is.

So Russia has to take responsibility for starting the WWII,
That is the bottom line.
Like you and your buddy started the fire and then you helped to put that fire down.
Should you get a medal for that? Nope!
---


Maybe maybe not. Poland is not in a position to do that.
IF you want to close them go ahead. Why Germany opened another coal powered plant last year? Priorities.
So don't dictate Poland what they policies should be.
---


Let Poland work in this, all right?
Because pushing it seems like Germans producers of windmills and other 'green' tech want to sell their crap to Poland. In other to do so they have to make sure Poland close its coal power plants ...

Economically it doesn't make sense unless you are a big producer of so called 'green' junk!

Who else is?

The EU will surely not invade and do it themselves! :)


Nobody does dictate anything. It's just my opinion!


Imagine in the near future green tech becomes the new hot stuff and Poland has nothing to gain from it because it missed this chance....and has to buy and follow instead of selling and leading!

We know how it feels to stay on the sidelines of new technology....Germany is just experiencing that with digitalization, we got to comfy with "how things had been always run". One can only hope the new gov fills the gaps and takes the right course soon.

Coal plants are also part of the reason why air pollution kills tens of thousands Polish people every year.

statista.com/statistics/827777/air-pollution-deaths-poland/

Which makes a lot more sense than letting others invade your country. Russia - smart. Western "democracies" - stupid like a brick.

I think Poland should take their part of responsibility as well.

The Polish side blocked any military support for Czechoslovakia from France and the USSR in order to make the situation of Czechoslovakia hopeless and to obtain the cession of the Teshin area while Germany annexed the Sudetes.

After that, any sympathy for the "exiled" Polish political elite is lost on me. In fact, in the Molotov-Ribbentrop Treaty, Poland itself received the medicine that it assiduously pushed for Czechoslovakia in the Munich Pact.

I don't know and I don't care. IF you want and can afford it go ahead with the plan.
Why bother Poland?

@BB
I know it is your opinion. Well why you don't look up stats and numbers... I mean that is your forte isn't it?


So far that tech is an expensive junk is not as cost effective as more standard ways. On the top of it it has many drawbacks - for example its not as environment friendly as they claim. Windmills are too noisy and so on...


For what exactly? The WWII started in 1939. Soviet/Russia actively took part in flaming the world as a part of their manifesto.
Took part on the side of Germany for about two years. That clear cut what, why and timetable.
sympathy? Did I ask you for a sympathy or empathy? Nope.
So those two Poland toward Czechoslovakia and Russia and WWII are different subjects. Why would you mix it? To change the subject?

Prague had it coming. They have been hostile toward Poland for no sane reason. They stabbed Poland in the back breaking an agreement about Cieszyn while Poland was defending against Bolshevik hordes..

While they grab that land they committed what is nowadays termed - 'war crimes' - against Polish population there.
That military Support from France was purely theoretical. As for the Soviet military they could fly over if they so wished or ask other countries for an access. The thing is no sane country would let Bolsheviks army on its territory no matter a reason.

Nope, over 80% of that pollutions comes from domestics coal heated boilers, fire places and so on. They are often low quality and lots of people are using low quality coal in those domestic devises.

Sure that problem should be addressed properly and fixed but that has little to do with the issue debated here,
Coal power plants because we are talking about those plants that produce electricity are responsible for about 20% pollution in Poland.
Further more coal power plants can be tweaked by a new technology to reduce pollution considerably. There is a future in that. Rather than close those plants and become power deficient Poland should modernize those plants..

Merged:

Poland objects to Nordstream 2

pgjonline.com/news/2021/may/poland-says-nord-stream-2-sanctions-waiver-a-threat-to-energy-security

What right does Poland/Pis have to complain about Nordstream 2, when they're building their Baltic pipeline from Norway? This is strictly a collaboration between Germany and Russia, and numerous companies involved in the construction. As much as I despise Putin's past actions, I don't see how they could be prevented in finishing it when its already 95% complete.

@atlantic
Nordsream 2 needs to be stopped now..... I really cannot understand what the Germans were even thinkig when they took this on....totally nuts.

They were thinking about themselves. Business is business.


Nope, just very pragmatic. Both Germans and Russians are very pragmatic nations and that's probably one of the reasons why they've been getting along so well - no matter whether it's about building a pipeline or carving up countries in the past. Realpolitik, no sentiments. It looks like Biden has joined them... Or maybe he got persuaded by Angela's charm :))

Btw, the CEO of the company behind the pipeline is a former Stasi intelligence officer :)) You couldn't make this sh1t up :)) I bet they throw parties together with Putin :)))

...not to forget Gerhard Schröder...the ex CEO from Germany Corp.

That Putin managed to build such a deep bromance with him is stuff for the history books!

(Maybe they bonded over their dislike of Merkel?)

Schröder and Merkel have in fact a pretty friendly relationship. He notably hardly ever criticized her, which is unusual for a former chancellor. There may have been other factors involved too, but their mutual dislike for Bush Jr. probably helped a lot.

Is he that idiot who said that Saddam had an A-bomb?

He was just being polite!

@Ziemowit

The very same.

@Bratwurst Boy

Schröder is not someone who is polite with people he dislikes. Just read what he says about Lafontaine... .

Balkan Stream and Nord Stream, both via Poland.

What is most funny to me is that in a post-Covid world Germany depend on the good will of Poland to allow transit of gas and oil to Germany. Its nothing but Godly justice at work.

What is most funny to me is the utter gibberish that you post...... too many posters on here seem to live in a fantasy world.

Being above, Poland finally enjoy the coitus.

biden's cancellation of Trumps sanctions meant to halt the completion of the Nord Stream 2 gas pipeline is a blow to the Ukrainian economy that will strengthen Russia's ability to wield its influence against the Eastern European partner, Ukrainian.

The Russian pipeline that would transport gas through the Baltic Sea to Germany would displace older Ukrainian pipelines that generate an annual revenue worth around $3 billion.

All companies operating on the line had been under U.S. sanctions until biden removed them, bowing to pressure from Merkel.
Are you missing Trump yet ?

Does anybody have more infos why he stopped the sanctions?

Probably because he realized that they were counterintuitive to his attempts to build an alliance against Russia.

project-syndicate.org/commentary/biden-nord-stream-2-part-of-broader-china-strategy-by-melvyn-krauss-2021-06

The sanctions were also ultimately not enough the pipeline.

Hmm....I dunno.....

An alliance against Russia and at the same time building a pipeline which supports Moscow and Gazprom? Which the rest of Europe (and lots of Germany) doesn't want?

Sorry, I meant China.

What if China and Russia become allies in that "new world order"?

This pipeline will become an achilles heel....

I would guess that they already are to some degree.
The Altai gas pipeline (also known as Power of Siberia 2) is a proposed natural gas pipeline to export natural gas from Russia's Western Siberia to North Western China.

It's already under construction.

That is part of the argument behind the pipeline. If we completely boycott Russia we will leave them no choice but solely depend on China. If Russia however still has an alternative, it might not go through with de facto becoming a junior partner to China.

Besides, the sanctions are not what will decide the fate of NSII but the next federal election in Germany.

Laschet will become most probably the new chancellor, with the Greens as their coalition partner.....and Laschet is outspokenly pro pipeline (as much as I've heard)!

Isn't he the same guy who said that Putin should teach Lukashenka a thing or two about democracy?

He is counted as a "Putin-Versteher".....