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Is it possible that Polish president was assasinated? If so then, by whom?


wildrover 98 | 4,451
13 Apr 2010 #31
have you not noticed which side is exclusively "updating" the media?

The crash happened in Russia...who else is going know anything to tell the media....?
czar 1 | 143
13 Apr 2010 #32
i do believe that first spontaneous Putin`s reaction, after heard about what happened to Kaczynski and Polish plane was- ``The crash happened in Russia...who else is going know anything to tell the media....?
``

Olga 1 | 330
13 Apr 2010 #33
The crash happened in Russia...who else is going know anything to tell the media....?

*Ahem* It was a Polish aircraft with Polish officials and Polish investigator's were "supposed" to be conducting their own investigation... so, gee anything besides being orchestrated by Putin would be a start. But that's too far out on a limb for you, is it? I take it you are not Slav who has had a peek behind Iron Curtain.
Jed - | 165
13 Apr 2010 #34
Three possibilities:
1) Tragic accident
2) Murder arranged by Putin
3) 'Third force' declares war on Putin

(1) yes, most probably.
(2) Some people believes he is a mad idiot - only in this case he could be involved. I don't think he is an idiot.

(3) The possibility is higher than #2. But who they planned to influence? Lunatics on different forums?

(4) I have no idea - are any enemies inside Poland for the President? Visit organization looks unbelievable... We need to think about who and how organized this visit - accident probability was too high in this flight.
OP Crow 139 | 8,157
13 Apr 2010 #35
Of course there is no independent evidence--have you not noticed which side is exclusively "updating" the media? And smearing nothing but the pilot. Why? Because dead men can't talk (KGB motto).

Olga, Olga, if i may suggest to you. Be realistic

if, IF, Kaczynski was assassinated, why would Russia do that? Because somebody in Russia didn`t like Kaczynski`s face? If Russia wanted to kill Kaczynski (for any reason), it was possible to arrange that in Kaczynski`s own house and make that all look like hard attack. Why would Russia want to assassinate Kaczynski on Russian ground and plus all together with Kaczynski great deal of Polish governing establishment?? Why, in moment when Polish president and Polish political establishments directed Poland in dirrection of batter relations with Russia??

Let me ask you, who would now have biggest influence on formation of another Polish governing elite? Who have exclusive influence on process of formation of that elite, in process of selection of army stuff and leading personal? Who? NATO and EU of course. Chances that Russia install more cooperative Polish political elite in Poland aren`t minimal but there are no any chance for Russia to do that.

So, let us be realistic. Shall we? If assassination happened, there are much bigger chances that NATO or/and EU (or some power from so called west) could be behind that then Russia.
Olga 1 | 330
13 Apr 2010 #36
Wow, Jed, that is really naive. Accident is LEAST likely whenever poltician dies violent death. I see this forum is dead space, aside from czar ;)
MareGaea 29 | 2,752
13 Apr 2010 #37
It may surprise you, but sometimes things are really what they seem.

>^..^<

M-G (accidents will happen - doesn't matter who's on board at the time)
Jed - | 165
13 Apr 2010 #38
Accident is LEAST likely whenever poltician dies violent death.

Lets take a look on the whole picture - is anybody here who would feel safe in this old plane landing to the old almost abandoned airbase in the thick fog?

It looks like a scenario for a cheap horror film, not a plan for VIPs visit...
czar 1 | 143
13 Apr 2010 #39
olga your making more sense than i am now thank you ;/

maregarea on the other hand face value? this has Putin's face all over it, please stop posting here you make no sense.
MareGaea 29 | 2,752
13 Apr 2010 #40
mare on the other hand face value? this has Putin's face all over it, please stop posting here you make no sense.

You on the other hand make much more sense.

Fog - Pilot Error - Advice to land on another airport - dodgy runway...All the ingredients for an accident. And it was an accident, nothing more, nothing less. There is no proof to state otherwise at the moment.

Edit: the rest are all assumptions/speculations. And assumptions/speculations are dangerous.

>^..^<

M-G (tiens)
Olga 1 | 330
13 Apr 2010 #41
if, IF, Kaczynski was assassinated, why would Russia do that?

Well, here's a start, Sherlock:
czar 1 | 143
13 Apr 2010 #42
the mistake would be to believe that this was an accident imo.
Olga 1 | 330
13 Apr 2010 #43
Thank-you, czar, my point exactly.
MareGaea 29 | 2,752
13 Apr 2010 #44
Death of Lech Kaczynski: political leaders who have died in plane crashes
Lech Kaczynski, the Polish President, joins a long list of world leaders who have died in plane and helicopter crashes. Here, in alphabetical order, is a toll of those who have perished in aviation accidents and assassination plots:


>^..^<

M-G (some were assassinated, some were not)
czar 1 | 143
13 Apr 2010 #45
mare your assuming that the russia is telling the truth and I am speculating that they are not, history will prove me to be right.
Olga 1 | 330
13 Apr 2010 #46
Anyone who buys this "accident" crap--proof that propaganda is working its "magic."
OP Crow 139 | 8,157
13 Apr 2010 #47
the mistake would be to believe that this was an accident imo

i am on the half way to believe that it was assassination

But then, real question is- who organized assassination? What particular interests?
MareGaea 29 | 2,752
13 Apr 2010 #48
mare your assuming that the russia is telling the truth and I am speculating that they are not, history will prove me to be right.

I'm assuming nothing. I go by the factual evidence that has been delivered so far. The rest is all theory.

Anyone who buys this "accident" crap--proof that propaganda is working its "magic."

And what would the Russians gain when they kill Kaczynski? A stop to some militairy programme? Even though it's all very tragic, Kaczynski will be replaced and what if the next President will continue his policy? Will they continue killing Polish presidents until they get what they want? Russia cannot afford that. And besides: if they wanted to kill him, they could've done so much earlier and in a much less obvious way.

>^..^<

M-G (tiens)
Olga 1 | 330
13 Apr 2010 #49
But then, real question is- who organized assassination? What particular interests?

Crow, did you click on the link I provided? Your answer is there for the most part.
OP Crow 139 | 8,157
13 Apr 2010 #50
Well, here's a start, Sherlock:

Crow, did you click on the link I provided? Your answer is there for the most part.

don`t say that you believe that Russia expect that if there is no Kaczynski, there won`t be missile shield in Poland? Its naive

If USA, NATO or/and EU wants missile shield in Poland they would found way to install it. Kaczynski was balanced politician and during his time, it was possible for Russia to protest at least.
Jed - | 165
13 Apr 2010 #51
Thank-you, czar, my point exactly.

You founded each other at last...
Didn’t you forgotten to check for putin under your table?
Olga 1 | 330
13 Apr 2010 #52
don`t say that you believe that Russia expect that if there is no Kaczynski, there won`t be missile shield in Poland? Its naive

No, motive was simply revenge as it was with Litvinenko, Yushchenko et al. Recall that Yushchenko too, like Kaczynski, was pro-West. Also, getting rid of Kaczynski will certainly discourage his successor from keeping Poland in this missile defense deal, as it is well known how furious Putin was with it. So, to avoid Putin's fury and therefore similar fate as Kaczynski, successor to Polish presidency will likely think twice.
wildrover 98 | 4,451
13 Apr 2010 #53
The idea is just too stupid to consider...Russia has nothing to gain from such an act , and so very much to lose....Even if they managed to avoid a war , which they can ill afford to fight , they would be hated by the whole world , and probably by most of their own people , Russia would collapse under the weight of the sanctions against them , nobody would want to deal with them , the country would be doomed....

Russia assasinating the head of a NATO country..makes for a good book...but in the real world , no..its just not a viable idea
ThePotatoe 2 | 38
13 Apr 2010 #54
Mr.Lech was terminated by SamFisher (code name: Splinter Cell)
the reason of termination is highly classified and is for the knowledge of selected intel only.

loading data....
File Type: Confidential
Error 404 : Abnormal signal termination....
connection lost... .... ...
Olga 1 | 330
13 Apr 2010 #55
Russia has nothing to gain from such an act , and so very much to lose

Quite the opposite--much to gain and little to lose. Little to lose because no country dares mess with Russia and suffer her wrath. Putin knows damn well he holds the aces and that nobody is so stupid as to dare starting a war over this. Gain--much indeed; too much to go into here...but if you clicked on the link I provided earlier that's a start.
MareGaea 29 | 2,752
13 Apr 2010 #56
Mr.Lech was terminated by SamFisher (code name: Splinter Cell)

I think Tom Clancy has sth to do with it as well.

>^..^<

M-G (grin)
czar 1 | 143
13 Apr 2010 #57
the russian connection is irans nuke program, the reason behind the polish missle sights.

putin knows obama is a push over

and yes as olga says do not underestimate the russian zest for revenge
OP Crow 139 | 8,157
13 Apr 2010 #58
No, motive was simply revenge as it was with Litvinenko, Yushchenko et al. Recall that Yushchenko too, like Kaczynski, was pro-West. Also, getting rid of Kaczynski will certainly discourage his successor from keeping Poland in this missile defense deal, as it is well known how furious Putin was with it. So, to avoid Putin's fury and therefore similar fate as Kaczynski, successor to Polish presidency will likely think twice.

let us presume that you are able to convince us all here and all people of the world that Russia organized assassination of Polish president

Do you know what could be consequences for Russian-Polish relations?
Do you know what could be consequences for Russian relations with other Slavic countries?
Do you know what could be consequences for Russian relations with NATO?
Do you know what could be consequences for Russian relations with EU?
Do you know what could be consequences for Russian relations with USA?
Do you know what could be consequences for Russian relations with the rest of the world?
Can you image level of sufferings of complete Russian society, man, woman and children if you manage to convince people of the world that Russia organized assassination of Polish president?

Are you aware that your ideas (such ideas) lead Poland and complete NATO/EU in military conflict with Russia? Are you aware that, if you are right, Russia in fact attacked one NATO country and started war, possible even nuclear war? Because Russia was motivated by revenge on Kaczynski, by your words?!

Are you aware that after disaster of Polish presidential plane in Russia, now NATO and EU, if just want that (no matter real reason for disaster of plane) could easily found excuse to attack Russia?

Why would Russia create this situation? In this moment?

Can you comprehend what you talking about? What are you?
MareGaea 29 | 2,752
13 Apr 2010 #59
the russian connection is irans nuke program, the reason behind the polish missle sights.

If Putin wants to kill all heads of states which hold a grudge against Russia, he will be busy.

Edit: for once I agree with Crow. The complications would be too far-stretching for Russia to even think about such a thing. And besides, Poland is important, but it's not THAT important.

>^..^<

M-G (North Korea?)
Olga 1 | 330
13 Apr 2010 #60
The idea is just too stupid to consider...

Stupid would be to only consider innocent and pure-as-virgin-snow propaganda version.

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