Years of Poland in the EU - assessment of pros and cons

You know, I'd think that with your supposed business acumen you'd realize that every country and even within individual countries gasoline prices vary greatly. There's a lot of ancillary costs than just the price per barrel. It's no different in the US, UK, etc. the price of oil may drop yet gasoline prices remain the same or even go up depending on other circumstances. Oil fell down to $20 a barrel for a period in spring 2020 yet there was no significant change with the price at the pump.

Gasoline is always far more expensive in Europe than USA. For one, there's very limited oil exploitation and what does occur is out of very small reserves i.e. even with the decrepit state of Libya they produce more oil than Romania. Gasoline is more expensive in Norway than Poland despite Norway being the largest producer in Europe after Russia. Meanwhile in Russia it's cheap.

It all has to do with taxes, logistics, refinery costs, politics, OPEC, etc.

But in the case of pawian and others it's all PiS fault...


I doubt the families living in near poverty consider the extra 500 z's they're receiving to be "stupid."


See now that would be stupid. One only needs to look at the billions Obama wasted on renewable energy with nothing to show for it just shows that it's a waste of money. Especially for Poland when there's plenty of coal and natural gas.

@Dirk diggler
Right now, gas is twice as expensive in Poland. Even with the VAT adjustment it is just under two times expensive. Your argument does not hold water. Prices in the US at $20 a barrel were much much lower, when in Poland they did not fall at all. Prices are fixed here, not fluctuating. When the state owns the refinery those costs are also fixed. In Poland it has very little to do with taxes, costs or OPEC.

regulation that would require probably leaving the EU to ammend - and that the previous PO government agreed to not PiS

where the money went - I can tell you - road and railroad infrastructure among others - also the social spending that you so much detest contributed to steady economic growth and general prosperity

Another lie by PiS. It was the first PiS government 2005-2007 which gave green light to the initial regulations about climate protection.


Funny how you became a supporter of socialism in this thread. :):) In other threads you are against socialist solutions in economy.


Which are terribly expensive and bad quality.


Down with this neobolshevik sozialism!

I know nothing about it and don`t care. I only now that PiS passed the laws which practically blocked the construction of wind turbines by individual investors and companies.

a quote from wikipedia on the ETS system:
Od reformy strukturalnej dyrektywy ETS, przyjętej w Pakiecie Energetyczno-Klimatycznym 12 grudnia 2008 przez kraje Unii Europejskiej[7], obowiązuje zakup uprawnień do emisji CO2 (EUA) na giełdzie przez firmy przemysłu energochłonnego i wytwarzania energii elektrycznej po wykorzystaniu przyznanej puli uprawnień przyznanym Państwom Członkowskim UE[8

in other words it was the PO-PSL government who agreed to free trading (which allows speculation) with the emission rights


it was the same PiS government that devised a pretty big programme of subsidies to solar energy

there are reasons why PiS doesn't want wind and solar energy to become the majority of energy sources - one: solar and wind energy are not reliable; two: Polish energy grid is not adapted to high output fluctuations and the cost to changing the grid is overwhelming (even Germans with their sophisticated and updated energy grid begged Poland to build an electricity bridge so that they can send their electricity somewhere when their own grid is overburdened)

as for wind energy: wind energy generation generates infrasounds that can cause serious health problems if you live somewhere where a resonance take place in the infrasound frequencies

No. It was PiS government and President Kaczyński who agreed to drafted plans for climate regulations, and formally signed them in March 2007. SImple. Don`t believe PiS` lying narrative. It was within PIS` power to veto those regulations during negotiations in the EU. But PiS didn`t do it coz they desired to receive other concessions from the EU.

cire.pl/artykuly/serwis-informacyjny-cire-24/79967-tusk-zawetowac-pakiet-klimatyczny-mogli-tylko-kaczynscy

ok you don't believe wikipedia - good for you I guess

you have your articles I have mine: wpolityce.pl/polityka/579023-jak-to-bylo-za-poco-kopacz-z-tuskiem-kryja-ws-cen-energii

:):) And I prefer mine coz PiS are known to be blatant liars, they lie day and night, even when they sleep coz Liars is their second name.

@pawian


I have the exact same opinion on Tusk and PO - we probably need to end that discussion now

You mean we are doomed to use coal till the last days of our lives???


It isn`t Tusk or PO who enthusiastically advertise Polish Deal as the 8th World Wonder and then everybody can see it is a complete failure. :):)


Already? I have only warmed up for a longer debate. hahahaha

optimal wind turbines wind regime is 15 to 20 km/h - in Poland the wind blows typically at 4 km per hour - when the wind is too strong the wind turbines shut down automatically (and if they fail to they are bound for a catastrophe - there has been such catastrophes already)

also there are so far no practical methods of storing electricity - one method that could store the excess energy could be water electrolysis that produces hydrogen which can be used later for electricity generation - as far as I know there are no such commercial installations though - and as far as I know storing large quantities of hydrogen is pretty dangerous

also the life of a wind turbine is about 20 years - in the past it was merely 15 years and the techology was more expensive to the point that at some locations the turbines failed to return the investment

as for solar energy you probably noticed that Poland is not the most sunny place on Earth

That is what I said. He lies about it.


Those are not viable sources of the energy. Forcing it on Poland looks like a war.


You are doomed to live as stupid person till your last days. That is sad.

there is also the environmental problem with wind turbines: they kill birds and migrating bats

quite informative site on hydrogen storage: energy.gov/eere/fuelcells/hydrogen-storage

90.000 deaths each year due to smog pollution is a war on the Polish nation.

wyborcza.biz/biznes/7,177151,26770155,mysleliscie-ze-przez-smog-umiera-46-tys-polakow-rocznie-szacunki.html


Yes, it is sad you don`t care about the death toll.


You worry about birds but condone 90.000 human losses? Do you live in Poland or in a clean country in the West like most our rightist members ???

there is also a question of energy safety and general safety - we HAVE coal - we could switch energy generating to natural gas but we would have to import it - as for nuclear energy: people have concerns after the Chernobyl


smog is not created by electric power plants but by households burning coal (and to a lesser extent by cars especially diesels) - my family uses coal to heat our home - you know why? : it's has been the cheapest method so far (we don't have access to gas grid as well - if we were connected to gas grid it would probably change our outlook on heating)

So what? I have an old bike from communist times in my basement. Do I use it? No.

you don't understand energy safety - poor you - it means that when Putin closed a pipeline you have no electricity nor heating - do you understand now?

We should use coal energy as long as it suitable. Meantime we should build nucleral plants( weapon too), hydorgen, water energy. Other so called ecological energy are not ecological or working, the same goes for electric cars.


Smog has little to do with using coal for electricity production. I hate you stubborn ignorance.


people die, there is no immortal people, it is a natural process. What is to care or not to care? If the wind blows or it doesn't you only care if it affects you, the same is with death toll. If you claim otherwise you lie.

:):):) Funny. Each main city in Poland has a power station fueled with coal. But no, they don`t contribute any pollution to the environment. :):):)


Of course. Conventional power stations are the cleanest of all. :):):):)

you never heard of electrofiltres - you poor pawian

you also never heard that coal is ground to produce dust for energy generation - yeah you smog expert

you also never heard of wet methods of desulfuring of fumes - well you should learn a bit more then

Of course I did. I also heard about yeti. hahaha

oh, yeah you're true intelectual, as everybody knows

Poor gumi, you should also read more about Polish power stations. The one in Bełchatów holds a No 1 record as pollution producer in Europe while the one in Kozienice - the 4th.


Darling, we both heard about them. But the problem is that the operators in power stations haven`t.

Sad, I hate your stubborn ignorance. Go check your facts.

My facts are facts while yours are fakes. Thank you, I don`t need them. Gumi is telling tall stories about filters while Polish power stations are the biggest polluters in Europe.


No, I think your hate of my person is funny, not sad. :):):)

I believe facts.


Do you? I live in Poland. Do you?You talk like an alien.


a tumbleweed

Be careful - I will suck your brain out like in Star Troopers. Unless it is already sucked out. hahahaha

You don't know English do you? I don't hate you, I don't care about you enough to have feelings about you. I hate your stupidity.


You poor fool - carbon polluters - it is not the same thing. lol!


Where do you live? moon?

:):) it is amazing how you keep on lying and manipulating.
Read this site about pollution from Bełchatów - it is not only CO2
clientearth.pl/najnowsze-dzialania/artykuly/rosna-szkodliwe-emisje-z-elektrowni-belchatow-clientearth-wnioskuje-o-kontrole-nik/

In addition to the increase in CO 2 emissions , which is the main cause of global warming, over 50% more arsenic, lead, chromium, nickel, sulfur oxides and particulate matter were released from power plant stacks between 2016 and 2018. Increase in concentrations was observed in 13 out of 11 monitored harmful substances

Gumi, where are your fekking filters???? hahahaha