Yes. People in Ukraine know very well what that particular part of the UPA did..
Rubbish,as has been reported many times that the Ukrainian migrants hear about it for the first time in Poland.
and although he did his best to rein in..
As opposed to the leaders of UON-B which gave direct orders for the ethnic cleansing of Poles, as they believed in the nazi ideology that a nation had to be ethnically pure to exist
OUN-B leadership does indeed bear primary responsibility for initiating the policy, but it was the UPA that carried out most of the massacres on the ground.
By the way, could you guys please remind me what the 'B' in OUN-B stands for?
Whatever, In Lwów they should pay what they own to that Polish company that build some thing or other. Breaking contract and stealing? Why Lwów's Mer is not arrested as soon as he steps his foot on the Polish soil? I hear he comes to Gdansk, Come on Torq do something.
The paramount thing here is working together in the fight to stop evil times returning.
Exactly. Well said, Jonno.
That's why there has to be absolute zero tolerance for genocide whitewashing and honouring of banderite perpetrators.
*thumbs up*
Come on Torq do something.
Unfortunately, Polish teachers at the present juncture are not allowed by law to arrest foreign politicians coming to Poland, even if in some cases we would like to.
By the way, Iron - do you remember what the 'B' in OUN-B stands for? I forgot...
But wait a minute... I distinctly remember there was a certain retard on this very board - I can't quite remember who it was - who claimed that Bandera had nothing to do with the genocide because he wasn't even present in Volhynia and East Galicia when it took place.
I wonder if Hitler was present in Auschwitz when genocide was commited there? If not, then I bet the aforementioned retard would claim that Hitler had nothing to do with it.
They should have been called OUN-MF!
Hear, hear.
Make some noise (...) Reach to your connections
Believe me, I am making noise, but they are cowards. They will make some wishy-washy statement, they will make a general condemnation and they will brood over the difficult history etc. etc. but they are not willing to do anything concrete, anything substantial to defend Polish interest. They are puppets whose strings are being pulled elsewhere.
are you a party member?
No, I am not. I told you some time ago that I rejected the offer of moving up on the ladder and gave up on politics. When Poland regains independence, and I am not too old by then, I might enter politics; but, for the time being, under the joint Washington-Brussels occupation being a politician in Poland means being a puppet (and a muppet in most cases).
At least they didn't ask to be called "Heroes of UPA-B".
What?
In October 1942, the OUN-B established the UPA as its armed wing.
There is no such thing as "UPA-B". OUN-B and UPA are one and the same. Merely that OUN-B was a Ukrainian fascist political organization, and the UPA were their "SS".
In 1943-44 the UPA carried out ethnic cleansing of Poles in Volhynia and Galicia, with the aim of preventing Polish efforts at re-establishing pre-war borders following the conclusion of the war.
-//-
During the Cold War, the CIA covertly funded and directed the OUN-B. This yielded few tangible results, but kept the organization alive.
In 1991, the OUN-B set up the Congress of Ukrainian Nationalists political party. They have contested each parliamentary election since, usually in coalition with other nationalist parties like Yuschenko's "Our Ukraine", or Tyahnibok's "Svoboda".
UPA - since its foundation until late 1950s, killed about 8,000 Soviet soldiers and officials
Impressive that they managed to kill even that many, from out of their forest dugouts and from under their wive's skirts.
Their brothers from SS Galizien were nearly completely wiped out, within the first 45 minutes of battle against Marshal Konev's forces during the Battle of Brody. The few rats that survived, fled West at full sprint (while drying their underpants), where they immediately surrendered to British forces.
Smart move.
Had they lingered a little longer, they would have been sent to mine nickel with their bare hands beyond the Arctic Circle - providing much needed nutrition to polar bears and Arctic foxes.
This is what amazes me, and many other observers, about the annual marches of "veterans" in SS uniforms:
1) They should be 110-120 years old at this point.
2) Archives indicate that 8/10ths of them should be successfully fertilizing the forests of Western Ukraine, since at least 1944-45.
So who are these clowns putting on SS uniforms? Mentally/spiritually disturbed people with an active imagination?
During the Cold War, the CIA covertly funded and directed the OUN-B.
Just goes to show: if you ask the US to pick between a communist and a fascist, they'll pick a fascist every time. Because the fascists aren't heretics to their religion of capital.
@OUSAN That's a good point. The billionaire class hates "socialism" and "communism" because they know what the peasants are capable of - a prime example being the expulsion of Trump from New York to Florida. Look how often they attack the Islam religion and stay quiet about the fact that 60% of the US congress are Zionists.
Anyway - an idea for Russia / Bobko. When you come clean about Kaczynski's association, Poland may forgive you faster than they may forgive Ukrainians for the WW2 crimes. The sooner you apologize, the better.
Maybe they are UPA veterans who put on their SS-Galizien brothers' coat of arms, out of pure solidarity. If the last UPA unit was locally active in 1956, and some banderists were 20 years old then, it means that there are some veterans who are 90 years old today. True, it is very odd that God should give them such long lives but it's possible.
The youngest SS-Galizien veteran, if he was 18 in 1945, should be about 100 years old now.
One way or another, 95% of the various "veterans" whom I saw in the photos in UPA and SS-Galizien uniforms look much younger than 90, so maybe they are wearing their dads' uniforms? Keeping the family tradition alive and all that?
It's not possible for there to be so many of them, and for them to look so young.
Besides, most of them live in Australia and Canada now. Speaking of Canadians...
... the Canadian parliament, a year ago or so, scandalously honored a Ukrainian Nazi - and was then forced to walk it back and apologize (accompanied by enormous dupa explosions from Ukraine and its fascist supporters).
Look at the photos from that day - that's a real 100 year old man.
Old piece of sh*t got so emotional (because he thought this day would never come, when his Nazism would be celebrated), that he cried like a woman and then promptly shat his pants.
Canadian retards... Man hates Russians = good man!
... the Canadian parliament, a year ago or so, scandalously honored a Ukrainian Nazi
Yes, we discussed it here. Poland even took initial steps to extradite him because SS-Galizien division has been linked by historians and Polish investigators to atrocities against Polish civilians, including the massacre at Huta Pieniacka. Unfortunately, whether Hunka personally participated in specific war crimes has not been established in court and no extradition took place.
One way or another, nobody in his right mind can celebrate a Waffen-SS division and claim that it has nothing to do with atrocities but only with them fighting the Soviets. The same applies to the UPA, whose victims consisted overwhelmingly of civilians.
It is depressing that some people here need to be reminded of something so obvious.
Unfortunately, whether Hunka personally participated in specific war crimes has not been established
According to Arel, it was "difficult to determine" whether specific groups of the division took part in atrocities, but he said that by the time Hunka's unit reached the front, German operations relating to the Holocaust, would have ended in that area. He said, however, that the SS Galizien had been implicated in the killing of Polish civilians. In his memoir, Hunka referred to the Wehrmacht as "mystical German knights who give 'bullets' to the hated cowards", referring to fleeing Polish soldiers and civilians.
"mystical German knights who give 'bullets' to the hated cowards", referring to fleeing Polish soldiers and civilians
That's exactly the sort of wisdom one would expect from a Waffen-SS veteran. When he finally kicks the bucket, may God grant him precisely what he deserves - nothing more, nothing less.
the sort of wisdom one would expect from a Waffen-SS veteran
But Maf will tell you - "these poor, innocent, children had no choice!"
WRONG!
Waffen SS was fully volunteer. Not volunteer, like I volunteer to accompany my wife to the store, but volunteer like - "Do you promise I can kill Jews and Poles?"
-//-
Jon will say - "Evil times!" or "They were good guys, but couldn't rein their men in - alas!"
WRONG!
Direct order from Dmytro Klyachkivsky to UPA commanders in the field:
"We should carry out a large-scale liquidation of all Polish elements. As the German armies retreat, we must take advantage of this convenient moment for liquidating the entire male population between the ages of 16 and 60... We cannot lose this battle, and it is necessary to reduce Polish forces at all costs. Polish villages that are located near large forests must disappear from the face of the earth."
Text of a leaflet distributed by UPA soldiers in Polish villages:
"To the Polish population! ... We give you an ultimatum: either you leave this land within 48 hours beyond the Western Bug river, or you will all be cut down and your villages burned to the ground. Do not think that anyone will protect you. If you stay, death awaits you."
Yuri Shukhevich in an internal report:
"The Polish question is being solved according to the directives. The terrain is being cleansed of the Polish element. The operations are progressing successfully, and the population assists us everywhere with great enthusiasm."
Mykola Lebed's textbook featured this wonderful piece of text:
"Our state must be pure. We are not interested in the laws of the occupiers or international rules. The revolution knows no humanism, only the absolute right of the dominant nation to clear its living space."
See - Jon? Not "failure to rein in".... but directives, orders, teachings...
I think Bobko's point was that they can't all have served in SS-Galizien, as most of them definitely don't look at least 100 years old. So majority wearing those Galizien insignia are not actual SS veterans.
the entire male population between the ages of 16 and 60
If only they had restricted themselves to murdering fighting-age males.
So majority wearing those Galizien insignia are not actual SS veterans.
...true too!
But people are funny that way.....I remember growing up in the GDR, with marxist-antifascist teachings in school and everything, but outside....in the schoolyard...the kids asked each other:
What did your Opi do in the war? Mine was in the Wehrmacht....psshhh....mine was in the SS! REALLY? Lotsa adoring looks...as if the kid was now somehow "better"....a thing to be proud of...
Unbelievable actually, but I remember it quite clearly....and young kids at that....
Ehhh, BB... standing next to what leader? The transvestite Bandera, who went in and out of his concentration camp "cell" seemingly at will?
A "cell" granted only to "Ehrenhaft" prisoners, in the Sachsenhausen "Zellenbau". A fully furnished space, with an office and a separate living room and bedroom? Full ability to write and receive letters? A "cell", from which he was released in 1944 - and then immediately moved to a luxury apartment in Berlin?
I spend months, every year, at home. I do not have US citizenship, or even a Green Card. I am in the US on a work visa. The maximum amount of time before I leave the US - 1 year.
I'm tired.
I grew up on my grandparents farm - both complete orphans through losing their parents in the war.
If I include my grandparents' brothers and sisters, nephews and nieces... just my family lost more than 10 people in that war.
I am deeply connected to the history, and am not reporting as some "tourist".
Then why do you still support Putin and its agressive war in Ukraine
Because nationalist b*tches deserve to get hammered mercilessly. This is the main idea of the Soviet "Internationalist" ideology.
A Cuban is my brother. An Angolan is my brother. A Vietnamese is my brother.
Do not confuse this with the rabble that flood your streets, flouting all the laws and cultural norms.
Nationalism is a heavy and seductive power
We are all children of God. Each one of us carries in his heart the same blueprint as every other.
You can be unhappy about immigration, and cultural decline and whatever else - but this is no excuse to treat your fellow man as livestock to be exterminated.
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