The BEST Guide to POLAND
Unanswered  |  Archives 
 
 
User: Guest

Home / News  % width posts: 19

Reorganization of Polish special forces. Strong deterrence forces needed in Poland?


boletus 30 | 1,366
7 Jul 2011  #1
some excerpts translated from [altair.com.pl/start-6034]

On June 30, a new special military unit - Jednostka Wojskowa Agat, JW Agat - a subordinate to Krakow's Special Forces Command was created on the basis of the Military Police Special Branch Gliwice (Oddział Specjalny Żandarmerii Wojskowej Gliwice - OSŻWG, established just in 2005), while the OSŻWG unit was formally dissolved. The first candidates for the future special soldiers will be selected from about 600 former gendarmes. The first stage of forming of the unit will last till the end of 2011. The first combat ready subunits should be operative by the end of 2014, the entire JW Agat - by the year 2016. The commander of the unit is Col. Sławomir Berdychowski, former Grom operator. The year 2014 is not accidental here, because this is the year when Poland becomes part of high command of NATO's special operations.

The name "Agat" comes from a WWII code-name of a combat subversion unit "Agat" (short for Anti-Gestapo) of Destruction and Sabotage Command (Kedyw), subordinated to Headquarters of Home Army in Poland. "Agat" will be an airborne and air assault military unit, tasked with safeguarding and supporting role during actions of the other special units commanded by Special Forces Command (DWS) - such as JW Grom, JW Komandosów, JW Formoza and JW Nil.

So far only some detached military units of regular land forces have been used in this role, but - as our own and other countries' experience shows - the dedicated kinetic support units are preferable for such tasks. The closest example of similar existing units are the British Special Forces Support Group (SFSG) (battalion size, formed in 2006) and the American 75th Ranger Regiment. It is thought that in the future the new Agat unit will be the most intensively exploited formation of special forces; it will be present in all operations and it will be equipped with heavy machine guns and antitank weapons.

Future soldiers of all Polish Special Forces will be receiving their first basic training in JW Agat, in Gliwice. The unit will be well saturated with privates and noncommissioned officers - providing drills and other training. After the basic training, volunteers will be subjected to more specialized selection and then passed on other special units.

At the same time, as of 1 July 1st, 2011 the existing special units have had their names simplified: JW GROM, JW Komandosów (former: the 1st Special Commando Regiment, Pułk Specjalny Komandosów), JW Formosa (former: the Naval Special Operations Unit Formoza, Morska Jednostka Działań Specjalnych Formoza) and JW Nil (*) (former: the Support Unit of Command and Security of Special Forces "Nil", Jednostka Wsparcia Dowodzenia i Zabezpieczenia Wojsk Specjalnych "Nila").

(*) In anticipation of possible silly jokes I hurry to report that the unit name "Nil" (English "Nile" not "nil") was a nome de guerre of Brig. Gen. August Emil Fieldorf, war time commander of KEDYW (sabotage and destruction).
dontesk - | 2
8 Jul 2011  #2
Nobody cares. They have been the laughing stock of many elite forces throughout the decades.
skysoulmate 14 | 1,297
8 Jul 2011  #3
That's a bunch of hogwash. I've personally talked with our (US) special ops guys in Afghanistan and they had a very high opinion of the Polish special ops forces.
wildrover 98 | 4,452
8 Jul 2011  #4
Nobody cares.

You cared enough to make a comment on the matter....

Try not to do it again....
David_18 68 | 982
8 Jul 2011  #5
Nobody cares. They have been the laughing stock of many elite forces throughout the decades.

Can someone get rid of this troll?

First when i saw his thread about some Polish guy that got beaten to death i just thought he wanted to discuss the matter. But now i realize that he is just a troll that want to trash talk Poland on the internet.

Maybe the admin can check if he is an sub acc to another member on this forum?
MediaWatch 10 | 945
8 Jul 2011  #6
Nobody cares. They have been the laughing stock of many elite forces throughout the decades.

That's a bunch of baloney. I've seen American generals on TV speak highly of the Polish GROM special forces.

That's a bunch of hogwash. I've personally talked with our (US) special ops guys in Afghanistan and they had a very high opinion of the Polish special ops forces.

This is true.

Not only that, American military and American special forces have spoken highly of the Polish GROM special forces in securing Iraqi ports in the beginning of the 2003 Iraq operation. They also did well in securing other Iraqi positions they were assigned to. As far as special forces go, they are a world class organization.
skysoulmate 14 | 1,297
8 Jul 2011  #7
Can someone get rid of this troll?

Maybe his real screen name is Donetsk? Either the Ukrainian or the Russian version?
OP boletus 30 | 1,366
8 Jul 2011  #8
Far from being overly enthusiastic about the role and the contribution of Poles to ISAF effort in Afghanistan I think credit needs to be given where credit is due. The current, 9th, rotation of Polish Military Contingent (PKW) seems to be quite busy on many fronts.

Bases are empty most of the time; anything on wheels rolls out daily. Intelligence (SWW) and counterespionage (SKW) services are effective again (after dissolution of WSI in 2006 several first PKW rotations were left completely blind) and provide very useful information to the troops, especially to special operation forces JW Grom and JW Komandosów. Rumors of favoritism and of unhealthy ambitions seem to be thing of the past, and both formations are simply too busy doing what they suppose to do. Equipment is much better and surveillance "eye on the sky" quite effective. The core of the troops, 17th Wielkopolska Brigade, is a well trained modern unit. And last but not least - their commander, Brig. Gen. Sławomir Wojciechowski deserves good credit too.

Early this spring a commander of TF-50, made up of the soldiers from JW Komandosów and JW Formoza (I think), was awarded the American Meritorious Service Medal. They do not give medals for nothing. TF-50 participated in numerous combat operations during their deployment, including several catches from the Joint Prioritized Effects List.

Just an old random note I found somewhere:

A couple of your operations over the past couple of weeks were complimented directly by COM ISAF, Gen Petraeus.

Yesterday morning when we reported your vehicle check point of 2 days ago (10 Jan) that resulted in detention of a jackpot and weapons recovery, he asked me to pass on to you he thought that was a great Op for your PRC.

Second, I reported your partnered operation from last week where you recovered several prepared IEDs as weil as other IED components in my weekly personal report to COMISAF. He again replied back to that report that it was an excellent operation and undoubtedly saved lives by preventing those IEDs from being emplaced.
(...)

Thanks again. Please pass this on to your Polish Chain of Command.

COL XXXXXXXXX
DCOM ISAF SOF

legend 3 | 664
8 Jun 2013  #9
Merged: Poland urgently needs strong deterrence forces

During his visit this week to the aircraft base F-16 in Lask near Lodz, Polish Prime Minister Donald Tusk said that Poland needed a deterrent force so that potential enemies do not even think about attacking Poland. Air Force is one of the most important elements of the new military-political doctrine of the country.

Quietly, without public debate, and despite the deteriorating economic situation in Poland and throughout Europe, the Polish government decided that under the doctrine framework in the next 10 years the country would spend a record amount on weapons - over $45 billion.


Full article @ english.pravda.ru/world/europe/07-06-2013/124777-poland_forces-0/
Zibi - | 336
8 Jun 2013  #10
That's a good decision taken by Tusk government!
legend 3 | 664
8 Jun 2013  #11
Personally I think Poland should try to strengthen its air force. Its much more important than navy and ground in this age.
Should try to improve relations with Russia and get some Su-30 (short term) and for the "near future" get some Sukhoi PAK FA.

Currently upgraded F16s are the main jets in the airforce. Having a few extra jets from another country would be nice mix in the military.

Some countries are planning to get newer jets too.
F35 have some problems and too expensive.
F22 are nice but again too expensive.
(both American planes).
Polsyr 6 | 769
8 Jun 2013  #12
F22 are nice but again too expensive.

As far as I know: F22 production ended already, and the platform was designed exclusively for the US Air Force. It was not sold to any other country and they don't plan on selling it. Perhaps they might pass them onto an ally once they have newer alternatives, however, the US is currently in a phase of cutting down on military spending, so I doubt this will happen anytime soon.

Also, I don't know what is the point of spending a fortune on defense when other areas are badly in need of funding, like infrastructure and health care for example. Improve the road and transportation network and the economy will improve, in my opinion, enough to offset the investment in infrastructure and even pay for future defense plans. Invest in the energy sector and the industry will boom. Invest in education, and Poland will locally develop the technology needed to build her own strategic and tactical defenses instead of handing over wads of tax payers' money to America or Russia, which only serves to widen the gap both technologically and economically.

The next time Poland will be directly involved in a military conflict will probably be at least 20 years away. By then, any weapons purchased now will become obsolete or near obsolete anyway. Until then, the focus should be on developing technology and on quality instead of quantity. One well trained pilot in an older but will maintained and modernized aircraft is more effective than 3 under-trained pilots in brand new models.
Zibi - | 336
8 Jun 2013  #13
The next time Poland will be directly involved in a military conflict will probably be at least 20 years away.

Clairvoyant, are you?
legend 3 | 664
8 Jun 2013  #14
Also, I don't know what is the point of spending a fortune on defense when other areas are badly in need of funding, like infrastructure and health care for example.

I can agree to most of this. I am NOT suggesting Poland needs lots of these planes.
Infrastructure and health are very important.
However, every nation deserves to have a military force just in case. Im not saying get 100 brand new top of the line planes today, but if Poland could get say 24 of them that would be nice.
Polsyr 6 | 769
8 Jun 2013  #15
Clairvoyant, are you?

Nope, but conflicts need reasons to happen (where there is smoke, there is a fire).

I believe the next direct confrontation Poland will get into is going to be with Turkey, when Turkey attempts to spread her influence in Europe and ultimately clashes with Poland's interests.

My belief is based on history having the habit of repeating itself. It is also based on the current pattern of behavior of both nations.
delphiandomine 83 | 17,625
8 Jun 2013  #16
I believe the next direct confrontation Poland will get into is going to be with Turkey, when Turkey attempts to spread her influence in Europe and ultimately clashes with Poland's interests.

Wouldn't NATO put a stop to such behaviour? NATO almost expects Turkey to have a strong presence in that region - but with Bulgaria and Greece also as NATO members, Turkey can't really look West.
Polsyr 6 | 769
8 Jun 2013  #17
I don't know whether NATO has a mechanism for conflict resolution between its members or not.

In the big picture, NATO enforces the will of the US. I doubt the US would want to get involved in this (directly or explicitly) but at the same time, I doubt they would side with Turkey (or any "Eastern" country) against traditional (European) allies.

By the way, neither Greece nor Bulgaria is powerful enough (in an economical, political, military and geopolitical sense) to stop Turkey if Turkey decided to look west. The first country that CAN challenge Turkey to the west is Poland, but without a clear technological advantage (which is what I believe Poland should invest into), Poland cannot win such a conflict without help - help that others may or may not be willing to give.

Regardless of how you look at it, the people at the Kremlin will be having a very good day when that conflict starts (if and when it starts).
delphiandomine 83 | 17,625
8 Jun 2013  #18
I don't know whether NATO has a mechanism for conflict resolution between its members or not.

I'm sure it does - the Cypriot situation is a great example of how Greece and Turkey avoided going to war.

The US has too many interests to let anyone behave badly in that region - Turkey knows it.

Poland cannot win such a conflict without help - help that others may or may not be willing to give.

Turkey wouldn't get anywhere near Poland without triggering whole scale conflict. The Greeks would have no problem with taking the fight to the Turks, as would the Bulgarians - and as both are NATO members, Turkey would end up having to take on the alliance before getting any further. Then you've got other countries in the way who would not tolerate it - even from a logistical point of view, having to get across Hungary and Slovakia would pose a problem.

Turkey is far more likely to take advantage of instability in the Middle East - what would be the point in coming West if there's plenty of oil to be had in the East?
Polsyr 6 | 769
8 Jun 2013  #19
Turkey is far more likely to take advantage of instability in the Middle East - what would be the point in coming West if there's plenty of oil to be had in the East?

Turkey is already moving in on the Middle East. But, look back at history. When was that alone enough for them?


Home / News / Reorganization of Polish special forces. Strong deterrence forces needed in Poland?
BoldItalic [quote]
 
To post as Guest, enter a temporary username or login and post as a member.