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Poland's post-election political scene


delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
21 Apr 2017 #2,581
Any theory is equally plausible until proven otherwise.

For that, you need to have a consistent theory to begin with. Why haven't they published their research for everyone to examine? Is it because every time they do, their 'science' gets torn apart by real experts?

Is it really so hard for you to believe that the military were simply incompetent? You aren't believing in conspiracy theories about Mirosławiec, even though the accident was almost identical.
Ironside 50 | 10,935
21 Apr 2017 #2,582
Is it really so hard for you to believe

Is not a question what I believe had happened. I don't know. I'm only saying the obvious that as long as the case won't be solved every theory goes.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
21 Apr 2017 #2,583
Well, there are lines to explore, but nonsense about explosions and so on should be ridiculed. Of course, it's much easier to brainwash people with OMG EXPLOSION!!!11 than to tell them boring details about navigational systems and qualifications and so on.

It's a huge pity that Błasik was on that flight, otherwise he would have had huge questions to answer about his leadership of the Air Force.
mafketis 24 | 9,361
21 Apr 2017 #2,584
I'm only saying the obvious that as long as the case won't be solved

You think JK or AM want to "solve" the case? That's hilarious!
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
21 Apr 2017 #2,585
That's exactly it. They have no interest in "solving" it, otherwise they'd get the very best investigators available. They want to keep the wound open as long as possible, which means a constant circus.

Why is a sub-committee on Smoleńsk and not a real committee? Wouldn't be anything to do with the fact that a committee requires members to have relevant expertise and knowledge, would it?
Ironside 50 | 10,935
21 Apr 2017 #2,586
but nonsense about explosions and so on should be ridiculed

Why? What difference does it make?

It's a huge pity that Błasik was on that flight

You're missing the point and PiS is missing the point as well. What had happened to the presidential flight is secondary to what had happened around that flight and especially after it crashed. That is a pretty straight story of criminal negligence, incompetence, dereliction of duty and a huge mismanaged on an unpreceded scale by the all top brass of PO and their government. Tusk as a person in charge is to be hold accountable for most of it. .

Seems that in this story slowly unfolding there is even an element of a classic treason.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
21 Apr 2017 #2,587
BEST EVER PRIME MINSTER DONALD TUSK EASILY DEFEATS DUDA IN POLL

The latest polls are in, and this one is a revelation. If the second round of the Presidential election were to be held today, President Tusk would defeat Duda by 49-39%. Duda will soon be condemned to the bin of history, and President Tusk will lead Poland to a new, PiS-free era in which the menace will finally be vanquished once and for all.

Supporters of the opposition are growing in strength and number, as people get fed up of Duda's false promises, fake smile and general inability to bring dignity and respect to the country.

PiS, the party of fraudsters and wife-beaters will soon be gone, and Poland will be delighted to get rid this cancer that feeds on the Polish Nation. There's a reason why people add an S to PiS, because they really do have the taste of urine.
gregy741 4 | 1,204
22 Apr 2017 #2,588
PiS, the party of fraudsters and wife-beaters will soon be gone, and Poland will be delighted to get rid this cancer that feeds on the Polish Nation.

there are hughe % of voters that would never vote for PO ,Nowoczesna and such,due to their stance on immigration.80% of poles strongly oppose Islamic immigration.this is red line for many poles.PO learned that when they signed mandatory resettlement program of immigrants,they were smashed in election few weeks later.

if PIS sink,people will start voting on Kukiz or even Korvin- like parties.
gregy741 4 | 1,204
22 Apr 2017 #2,589
GDP of Poland for first quarter almost 4% grow,production 11% grow,construction 17%,consumption 10%
eat that pathetic PO biatches
all it takes to get rid of PO thieves ,and Poland can finally grow
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
22 Apr 2017 #2,590
Rather than relying on headlines, better to look at the actual data.

msn.com/pl-pl/finanse/gospodarka/gus-zrewidowa%C5%82-dane-o-polskim-pkb-w-2016-r-nie-by%C5%82o-wzrostu-nawet-28-proc-t%C4%85pni%C4%99cie-w-inwestycjach-te%C5%BC-by%C5%82o-znacznie-g%C5%82%C4%99bsze/ar-BBA7JYh?li=BBr5MK7&ocid=wispr

Poland grew by only 2.7% in 2016, decline in investment by 7.9%. Quarterly, it translated as 2.9% in Q1, 3% in Q2, 2.4% in Q3 and 2.5% in Q4.

In comparison, Poland grew by 3.8% in 2015.

Eat that, pathetic PiS-supporting clowns. The figures don't lie.

all it takes to get rid of PO thieves ,and Poland can finally grow

Seems to me as if the hard statistical data (rather than the rubbish posted on thenews.pl) tells the real story.
gregy741 4 | 1,204
22 Apr 2017 #2,591
Rather than relying on headlines, better to look at the actual data.

you provided old data from 2016.poor grown 2016 were results of long thievery by PO,it took time to clean up state from crooks and now we see positive results

in 2017

Seems to me as if the hard statistical data (rather than the rubbish posted on thenews.pl) tells the real story.

i spoke about data provided by minister of finance ,which is "official" and based on GUS stats.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
22 Apr 2017 #2,592
i spoke about data provided by minister of finance

The same one who predicted growth in 2016 of 3.6%? Hahaha.

poor grown 2016 were results of long thievery by PO

No Gregy, the poor results from 2016 were a result of PiS. PO achieved 3.8% in 2015, as corrected and verified by GUS.

Numbers don't lie - the bad results in 2016 were a direct result of bad governance. You can repeat your propaganda all you want, but 3.6% in 2015 vs 2.5% in 2016 says it all.

Where are the new road tenders, Gregy? Why did PiS only announce roughly 200km of new roads in 2016? What's going on?
gregy741 4 | 1,204
22 Apr 2017 #2,593
The same one who predicted growth in 2016 of 3.6%? Hahaha.

you seem not to be able to understand that minister of finance might predict whatever he wants but official data he give ,are base on information from GUS and GUS only.the very same agency you quoted.while giving some 2016 thingies

Where are the new road tenders, Gregy? Why did PiS only announce roughly 200km of new roads in 2016? What's going on?

i dont like PIS,cant stand many ppl from that sect.but as long as libtards are not in power am cool.
am Kukiz supporter. PIS in not right wing enough for me and too pro EU.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
22 Apr 2017 #2,594
minister of finance might predict whatever he wants but official data he give ,are base on information from GUS and GUS only

The same Minister of Finance has been performing some nice financial tricks to boost numbers in the short term. You need to look at these things as a whole - talking about a strong Q1 means nothing if we see a huge slowdown in Q4.

Morawiecki is all about smoke and mirrors - that strong Q1 could simply be because of huge VAT refunds at the end of the year. We won't know until about this time next year.

am Kukiz supporter.

natemat.pl/205959,jak-kukiz-przejal-nieruchomosc-za-10-proc-jej-wartosci-mamy-dokumenty

Kukiz, the man who appears to have carried out a rather interesting scam in order to buy a flat for 10% of the value, right?
gregy741 4 | 1,204
22 Apr 2017 #2,595
You need to look at these things as a whole - talking about a strong Q1 means nothing if we see a huge slowdown in Q4.

maybe you right,nevertheless data for 1Q are very good.all economical aspects are positive beyond expectations.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
22 Apr 2017 #2,596
all economical aspects are positive beyond expectations.

That's what 8 years of solid, stable rule did for Poland. People had the confidence to invest in Poland, as the country was the heart of Europe and was integrating very quickly. 18 months of PiS acting like idiots won't change that, especially as they seem to be focused on war against Poles rather than against international companies. Morawiecki is also continuing the previous policy of offering large financial concessions to attract companies here.
gregy741 4 | 1,204
22 Apr 2017 #2,597
That's what 8 years of solid, stable rule did for Poland.

never hear or read any expertise crediting PO rule for this Morawieckis success.most experts seems to credit 500+ program for this.even opposition dont argue that 500+ was economical success.

dunno,how much true is in that,am not socialist ,so 500+ for me seems a waste of money.

18 months of PiS acting like idiots won't change that, especially as they seem to be focused on war against Poles

thats 2 idiots only ,doing all this idiocy,Macierewicz and Waszczykowski.. am not pro PIS but if thay remove them 2,it would be solid goverment.
am surprised how much damage them two are doing and nobody in PIS seem to care.
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
22 Apr 2017 #2,598
[quote=delphiandomine]Duda only has the trust of 34% of Poles, while Szydło has a mere 27.5%.

Too bad you are using outdated or fallacious data. The latest CBOS poll in April showed support for the following as:
Duda 63%
Szydło 52%
Kukiz 50%
Ziobro 43%
Morawiecki 40%.
Macierewicz has fared far worse with 25%. That is even less support than the highly unpopular opposition figures Schetyna and Petru, backed by a mere 30% and 26% respectively.

malydziennik.pl/polacy-coraz-bardziej-ufaja-andrzejowi-dudzie-jest-on-samotnym-liderem-sondazu,4358.html
gregy741 4 | 1,204
22 Apr 2017 #2,599
Ziobro 43%
Morawiecki 40%.

yea,those 2 are best ministers in Szydlo cabinet.

Macierewicz has fared far worse with 25%.

i gobsmacked,why they keep him..this guy is doing alot of damage to PIS and Poland
Ironside 50 | 10,935
22 Apr 2017 #2,600
idiocy,Macierewi

He anything but an idiot. One of the strongest points of PiS. Remember WSI? He sorted them out. Now, he is cleansing Polish Army - good!
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
22 Apr 2017 #2,601
Now, he is cleansing Polish Army - good!

I can only wonder why you think that purging the Polish army of experienced generals is "good".

CBOS poll

Who is CBOS controlled by? Oh, the Polish government. Who is out of favour at the minute? Oh, Macierewicz.

i gobsmacked,why they keep him..this guy is doing alot of damage to PIS and Poland

Easy enough. Macierewicz can and will cause carnage if he is thrown out. He's not a weak, pathetic figure like Szydło.
Ironside 50 | 10,935
22 Apr 2017 #2,602
why you think that purging the Polish army of experienced generals is "good".

Every general is 'experienced' comes with age - doesn't mean it is the right kind of 'experience'. Goes without saying that people who joined army during marital law in the Soviet Poland are not a good material for general officers in the independent Poland. Away with Soviet officers!
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
22 Apr 2017 #2,603
Goes without saying that people who joined army during marital law in the Soviet Poland are not a good material for general officers in the independent Poland.

So you're willing to disregard 26 years of service for independent Poland on the basis of when they joined the army? More importantly, if you're going to discredit them, where's your criticism of General Błasik?

More to the point, anyone with a brain can see that the real intention is to remove officers who have significant experience within NATO. The three generals who led the NATO exercises in 2016 have all resigned - don't you see something very wrong with this?

There are plenty of reports out there making it clear that NATO allies no longer trust the Polish armed forces. Is this a good thing for Poland and Polish defence?

Macierewicz's aim all along has been to purge the armed forces and replace the leadership with people that will work for him. He's politicised the army and transformed it into a weak institution with inexperienced leadership. That's a good thing, in your mind?
mafketis 24 | 9,361
22 Apr 2017 #2,604
Macierewicz's aim all along has been to purge the armed forces and replace the leadership with people that will work for him.

It's people like Macierewicz who have always weakened Poland enough so that Russia could get their hooks in. He'd sell the country in a heartbeat for the security of eternal victimhood.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
22 Apr 2017 #2,605
The sad thing is that even if he goes today, the damage will have been done and will take easily 6-10 years to recover from, if not more.

Where are the helicopters, Macierewicz? Where are they? We need heavy lift capacity to transport troops quickly to flashpoints, and we don't have them. Why?
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,446
22 Apr 2017 #2,606
experienced generals

Experiecned Soviet-trained generals that served the thankfully now defunct Soviet-imposed regime may be experienced, but it's the wrong type of experience for a free country. They took their cues from the Soviet-imposed PZPR, won their stripes persecuting Solidarity durign martial law and were actually rewarded for their crimes with promotions and disitnctions by the snitcher-presidents you admire so much -- Kwaśniewski (TW Olek) and Komorowski (TW Litwin).
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
22 Apr 2017 #2,607
and were actually rewarded for their crimes with promotions and disitnctions by the snitcher-presidents you admire so much

That's a very curious way to talk about some generals that were promoted by Lech Kaczyński as President. Is there something you're alluding to, Polonius?

Either way, I wonder why Polly would be so keen to get rid of NATO-trained and integrated generals.
Ironside 50 | 10,935
22 Apr 2017 #2,608
So you're willing to disregard 26 years of service for independent Poland on the basis of when they joined the army?

Oh please Delphin you clearly have no clue. There is no shortage of general officers some redundant soviet officers are non issue.

There are plenty of reports out there making it clear that NATO allies no longer trust the Polish armed forces.

Actually there is none of serious report. Beside typical whinging of PO stooges and their German allies.

He's politicised the army and transformed it into a weak institution with inexperienced leadership.

Nonsense. He is rebuilding capability of the Polish Armed Forces to defend Poland. A Few pen pushers corroborating with KGB are not a los but a gain.

Clearing a lot of dead wood.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,858
22 Apr 2017 #2,609
Oh please Delphin you clearly have no clue. There is no shortage of general officers some redundant soviet officers are non issue.

There is a shortage when a huge amount of them were purged from the army. Promoting inexperienced, unqualified officers in their place is not the way to organise an army.

Actually there is none of serious report. Beside typical whinging of PO stooges and their German allies.

There are plenty of serious reports out there about it. Haven't you seen the reports about the British regarding Macierewicz as a potential threat to security?

Nonsense. He is rebuilding capability of the Polish Armed Forces to defend Poland. A Few pen pushers corroborating with KGB are not a los but a gain.

You don't defend a country by removing large amounts of generals and colonels from active service, especially those that commanded large scale NATO exercises. Of course, if your intention is to create an army that has no experience in NATO, then you do.

I suppose those with communist connections will always, always favour pro-Russia actions over pro-Western actions, won't they?
Ironside 50 | 10,935
22 Apr 2017 #2,610
There is a shortage when a huge amount of them were purged from the army

Not really. There has been too many officers and not enough soldiers. There enough of officers with experience in the filed that graduated from west point rather than from Moscow for example. Your info is not factual. That bit about promoting unqualified and inexperienced officers is clearly baloney.

Haven't you seen the reports about the British regarding Macierewicz as a potential threat to security

As related by some obscure German bureaucrat in the EU allegedly security expressed or some such. Really?

Of course, if your intention is to create an army that has no experience in NATO, then

Grasping at straws delphian. Yes Maciarewicz is Putin's mole and you're scouting on behalf of the invasion forces from Mars.

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