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"It's too late for Germany" (but not for Poland)


Rich Mazur 5 | 1,382    
3 Sep 2018  #271
before resentment against a government that cares so little about citizen safety really does explode...

The Stockholm syndrome in Europe is too embedded in the brains of the obedient for anything to explode.
Dirk diggler 7 | 3,399    
3 Sep 2018  #272
You know a country is totally cucked when an Abdul from Afghanistan only gets 8 years, 2 years less than the prosecutors wanted for murdering a native 15 year old german girl. Naturally the police were warned about Abdul behaving like a typical young Muslim migrant who's unable to handle rejection from a female but the police have to answer to a bunch of libtards who don't want to appear 'racist' and hence don't do sh1t when their own citizens are engendered by merkels burden.

In most us states itd be a life of getting stabbed and raped constantly in the big house or a quick shot to the arm.

If it were my daughter or sister, the first thing I would do is bail Abdul out or hire him the beat appeal attorney.

bbc.com/news/world-europe-45395066

Digusting what germany has become...
johnny reb 15 | 3,052    
3 Sep 2018  #273
It ain't over until the fat lady sings Dirk.
This piece of garbage has eight years to do in a German prison.
What do you think the odds are of him ever "walking" out of that asylum ?
Dirk diggler 7 | 3,399    
3 Sep 2018  #274
99% considering the German prisons are overflowing with other abduls and muhammeds like him. As are UK prisons, Swedish prisons, etc. Abdul will be fine. He'll even continue getting his halal meat and pray 5x a day, courtesy of german taxpayers. There's nothing even written if he'll be deported at the end of 8 years. Most of the German underworld and prisons are run by fellow Muslims granted mostly Kurds Lebanese Turks etc but stkll he'll be in Muslim company so he'll be fine.

That's modern germany for ya.... a cucked nation living under Stockholm syndrome and ww2 apology neurosis
Rich Mazur 5 | 1,382    
3 Sep 2018  #275
Glad you are back, Dirk.
I truly don't understand the mentality of the Western European "men". The first instinct - way before the first cop was hired and the first courthouse and the prison were built - was to defend and protect the females. When I see a typical pacifist ball-less Eurotard, I literally want to puke.
Crow 141 | 7,007    
3 Sep 2018  #276
Digusting what germany has become...

Its very soft to tell its disguising. I would pick more vibrant word such is `decayed`.
Tacitus 1 | 543    
3 Sep 2018  #277
@Dirk diggler

What are you even complaining about? The culprit will serve his time and then be deported. You are still not making any sense.
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 8,530    
3 Sep 2018  #278
The culprit will serve his time and then be deported.

Will he?
Tacitus 1 | 543    
4 Sep 2018  #279
Of course, why do you ask?
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 8,530    
4 Sep 2018  #280
...I dunno...maybe because to many criminals should have left the country already only to stay "tolerated"...that (alleged) murderer in Chemnitz for example...remember Anis Amri? The murdered woman in Freiburg?

(auch eine Nachteule? :)
Rich Mazur 5 | 1,382    
4 Sep 2018  #281
I love the USA. We have this funny custom of sentencing murderers to life-no-parole. Then, after they served their sentence, we deport them in a pine box to an unmarked hole in the ground.

USA -1, Eurotards - 0. Again.
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 8,530    
4 Sep 2018  #282
We have this funny custom of sentencing murderers to life-no-parole.

Sometimes I envy you for that.

I remember that one case where a drunk driver murdered a whole young family...papa, mama, baby...all because he decided to party, have fun, drink heavily and afterwards driving much to fast on the wrong lane home.

That man deserved the worst if you ask me, but he didn't even get jail time because...and now it really starts to hurt...the young man was drunk (used as an apology), there was no danger of repeating because he openly apologized aaaaaaaaaand that event shouldn't destroy all his life and leave him a chance (or some similiar worded crap).

Such ruling leaves you only dumbfounded and betrayed somehow, your blood boiling...that's just not fair. In such moment I wishs we had some real verdicts, not that cameos of justice.

And what's worse, in the long run it destroys your trust in this rule of law. After all you can go to jail when you don't pay your ticket or the GEZ tax (for TV)....and here the state is merciless!

Or latest example...this murderer from Kandel get's barely 8 years...but hey....if you dare to complain you must be a hater!
Tacitus 1 | 543    
4 Sep 2018  #283
...I dunno...maybe because to many criminals should have left the country

His lawyer expects him to at least.

remember Anis Amri

Not much you can do about this when their home countries refuse to give them papers. Our government has excerted some pressure already, but our tools are limited in those cases. Afghanistan and Iraq seem to cooperate by now, so the guy who killed the girl should be deported.

The murdered woman in Freiburg?

Her murderer was not due to leave the country though.

(auch eine Nachteule? :)

Berufsbedingt ;)

Sometimes I envy you for that.

I don't, because the US justice system is highly disfunctional. It doesn't provide more safety, produces additional costs because of its' many prisoners. It does somewhat satisfy a crude thirst for revenge, but that is no criteria for a modern justice system. Otherwise we would still be publically executing criminals.

this murderer from Kandel get's barely 8 years..

Perhaps he'll get more if the prosecution prevails, but I guess some would not be satisfied even if he got the full maximum penalty possible. There are good reasons why minors are not judged like adults, and he is to be judged like any German would be in his case.

Cut down on the number of quotes please.
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 8,530    
4 Sep 2018  #284
But...he wasn't a minor...he LIED about his age to suck out all the generosity this state hands out to young people in need. He lied and murdered!

He betrayed all what is good about Germany, abused it and perverted it!

To show now any kind of benignity is now a double betrayal to every really young one in need who doesn't lie and doesn't murder and also to all those people who opened their hearts and also their purses to these people.

There is nothing fair about this judgement, for nobody! Just maybe another percent for the rise of the AfD...
Rich Mazur 5 | 1,382    
4 Sep 2018  #285
...It does somewhat satisfy a crude thirst for revenge, but that is no criteria for a modern justice system.

Revenge is the sweetest of feelings. If humans were not meant to "thirst" for revenge, humans would not be capable of thirsting for revenge. Like never saying "f***". It's there for a reason.

I will take the US-style revenge over 8-years for premeditated murder every time. Our problem is too many druggies and too many illegals in our prisons. And the insanely long appeals that do not involve evidence, but crap like if it hurts to get a lethal injection. Personally, I hope it hurts like hell, but I know it does not.
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 8,530    
4 Sep 2018  #286
It's not only me or "nutters" who criticize the german court system.

Many experts also agree that to often the focus of their ruling lays on the criminal, how a judgement would affect HIM, not his victims. And yes, justice means also "satisfaction" for the victims, that a kind of compensation is metet out.

And that to often just doesn't happen anymore..

An for all side acceptable law system doesn't has to mean "an eye for an eye" but shouldn't also end in a mocking for the victims!
Tacitus 1 | 543    
4 Sep 2018  #287
But...he wasn't a minor...he LIED about his age to suck out all the generosity this state hands out to young people in need. He lied and murdered!

Who do you mean? The guy in Freiburg lied about his age, was judged as an adult and received the highest possible penalty. His crimes are despicable, but it is not a case that can be described as undue lenient.

The guy in Kendel was judged as a teenager, because that is what he is (unless proven otherwise). Again no undue leniency, but simply following the law. Would you be satisfied if he received ten years instead of eight?
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 8,530    
4 Sep 2018  #288
That murderer told everybody he was 15 years old. The latest official expertise says instead that he was at the point of the murder at least 17 + 6 month, but most probably about 20!

tagesschau.de/inland/kandel-urteil-105.html

He should be judged as a grown up...and then he could be jailed for 20 years! THAT would mean justice!

But now he profits again from his lies...as he isn't judged as the man he already was but the teenager he pretended to be.

Let's face it Tacitus....Germany has become a country where lying, cheating and betraying pays off!

And again...another judgement which doesn't do anything for justice...but makes the blood boil. Another chunk in the armor of our law system and the belief in the rule of law in Germany...

Here an interview with the Bürgermeister of Kandel:

FOCUS Online: Was sagen die Menschen?

Tielebörger: Die Leute sagen: 'Das ist nicht gerecht.' Diese Ansicht kann ich auch verstehen......

focus.de/politik/deutschland/mord-an-mia-buergermeister-von-kandel-ueber-mord-urteil-unzufriedenheit-mit-staat-wird-angeheizt_id_9522608.html

If you didn't know better you could think alot of people work hard on hollowing out this state and the trust of it's people in it....one chunk after the other...and the AfD grows and grows and grows...
Tacitus 1 | 543    
4 Sep 2018  #289
He should be judged as a grown up...

Only if the evidence justifies it, which in this case, it did not. The prosecution could not prove that he was definitely above 18 years old, so we have to accept this.

but makes the blood boil. Another chunk in the armor of our law system and the belief in the rule of law in Germany...

On the contrary, this judgement confirms that the rule of law is still uphold in Germany. Punishment and judgement are up to judges, not the mob in the street.

If you didn't know better you could think alot of people work hard on hollowing out this state and the trust of it's people in it

There are in fact many people trying to subvert the rule of law. Any AfD voter for example. Because what the AfD demands is in violation of every principle of the rule of law.

This is not the first the time the FRG experiences this kind of crisis. During the RAF terror campagn, many people called for more severe punishments, for the state to break its' own principles in order to deal with them. But sanity prevailed which is why the RAF was eventually defeated on every level. We are now experiencing a similar situation, and I hope that we can once again prevail the same way.
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 8,530    
4 Sep 2018  #290
Punishment and judgement are up to judges, not the mob in the street.

Are you really calling all people dissatisfied with this judgement "mob"?
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 8,530    
4 Sep 2018  #291
...you know what happened to Hillary Clinton as she called millions of USians "deplorables", don't you...this "pack" decided to show her the finger right back the next moment they could!
Tacitus 1 | 543    
4 Sep 2018  #292
all people dissatisfied with this judgement "mob"?

I am talking about judgements in general. It is up to an impartial judge who knows the whole story to pass judgement, not people on the streets who won't be satisfied either way.

Our law is guided by principles for very good reasons. Sometimes it can happen that because of them, culprits go unpunished or without serious punishment, ( e.g. the case of Lolita Brieger), but breaking those principles would detrimental to us all. I must say, I find it strange that many East Germans are so quick to disregard this. They of all people should treasure the ability in finally living under the rule of law.
Rich Mazur 5 | 1,382    
4 Sep 2018  #293
Are you really calling all people dissatisfied with this judgement "mob"?

"Mob" is what we see at Berkeley when Ann Coulter wants to speak. Mob is usually coffee-with-milk brown, breaks windows, and sets things on fire. Mob is just smart enough to know that they as stupid as those rocks mob throws in lieu of debating.

Based on the above, those people were not "mob".
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 8,530    
4 Sep 2018  #294
I must say, I find it strange that many East Germans are so quick to disregard this. They of all people should treasure the ability in finally living under the rule of law.

What makes you think East Germans did not live under the rule of law! :)

And what laws that were...all what the party did was lawful...totally founded in the law system of this country. Written down in big books and followed to the letter by lotsa studied people.

And critics back then got handed a similiar treatment btw...how dare they to criticize THE LAWS!!!
(Okay they weren't called mob, but "Volksverräter" and "Agenten des Westens" and what not...in the worst case they wandered into jail...totally in compliance with THE LAW of course)

But you know also what happened as the trust in this laws eroded over time till it vanished and "the mob" decided enough is enough, don't you?

Maybe that's the main difference today between Ossis and Wessis.

A law isn't automatically right only because someone says so....we have experienced that. You not!

Wessis seem to believe their ways are set in stone for the eternity. Someone who has seen it all break down once before doesn't.

This obedience to the rulers and their LAWS is much higher today with the Wessis than with the Ossis...that's why the AfD will take over the ex-GDR in a few years...if the West doesn't adapt...mark my words!
Tacitus 1 | 543    
4 Sep 2018  #295
did not live under the rule of law! :)

Because the GDR only respected those laws as long as it was convenient for the party.

all what the party did was lawful.

The party violated their own constitution and laws constantly.

A law isn't automatically right only because someone says so.

This is not about a specific law. This is about the principles without which you can not have proper rule of law.

Wessis seem to believe their ways are set in stone for the eternity

So far it has been proven to be resilient. It is certainly the best system we ever had in Germany, and no one has ever come with a better alternative.

This obedience to the rulers and their LAWS

Not their laws. Our laws. We are living in a democracy. The problem is that many East Germans have yet to fully understand its' principles.

See post 283 for some valuable information

that's why the AfD will take over the ex-GDR in a few years...

Perhaps, but there is nothing we can do about this. It is not like this is a new trend, East Germans tend to cast their votes on the fringe. Before the AfD, votes went to the successor party of the SED, or the NPD.

All we need to do is wait. The refugee crisis drop off the radar in the coming years, and once Merkel retires, the far right will lose the enemy that united them. Those who are still fundamentally decent voters will return to the fold, and those who don't are lost anyway.

However, it might be prudent to implement changes in how we select our civil servants. Anyone who is a member of a far-right- or left-wing organization or party, should not be allowed to enjoy the privileges as a civil servant. They are oath-bound to defent the constitution after all, and it is hardly credible if you deny the constitution.
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 8,530    
4 Sep 2018  #296
The problem is that many East Germans have yet to fully understand its' principles.

"Understanding" isn't the problem...accepting is!

It's hard if not possible to accept a law which handles foreign criminals with super soft gloves and supports them at every turn...at the cost of the natives.

I tell you, that will change. That has to change when the rulers ever want peace in this country again. Yes, some of these laws will be changed! If not in the coming three years, then afterwards.

It doesn't even need an AfD chancellor for that. Every town can decide to handle their foreign criminals more firmly. Right now it's openly discussed in Frankfurt/Oder, where the Bürgermeister is part of "die Linke", also hardly a Neo-Nazi

The moment the AfD takes over towns and villages and cities, or goes into coalitions with a soon-to-be-Merkelless CDU (in three years) these laws WILL be changed!

All we need to do is wait. The refugee crisis drop off the radar in the coming years,

I hope so, I really do.

But that hope clashes somewhat with the prediction for the next years of millions of young african males sitting on their bags getting ready to leave their contintent, dreaming of Europe. Overpopulation going hand in hand with war, destruction and mismanagment...

What about that dark vision of the future?

The only realistic answer (beside all that "Fluchtursachen bekämpfen") will be a shut down EU...with a highly secured outer border...

Those who are still fundamentally decent voters will return to the fold, and those who don't are lost anyway.

That depends on the CDU. When the party finds it's way back to the old ways, meaning much more conservative/rightist than now, then many of the old voters will think it over again.

The main reason people vote for the AfD is because it's the one party which has kept the the political stands of this old CDU, before Merkel. So, for the west german Left there will be no really a difference.

But that won't be easy...I rather predict that a merkellless CDU will drop down fast and deep. Their process to find a new direction will take time and will be very painful. I doubt that the CDU will stay intact over it, not to mention that the AfD won't just meekly dissolve itself.

They are oath-bound to defent the constitution after all, and it is hardly credible if you deny the constitution.

Agreed!

But that too would need a change of a law somewhere... ;)
mafketis 16 | 5,896    
4 Sep 2018  #297
The refugee crisis drop off the radar in the coming years

How?

...I rather predict that a merkellless CDU will drop down fast and deep

A Merkelless CDU that goes back to putting the interests of taxpaying German citizens over those of the EU technocrats and a bunch of randos from the Middle East and Africa yes, a Merkelless CDU that tries to carry on her "legacy" will likely go the way of the SPD
Crow 141 | 7,007    
4 Sep 2018  #298
It is too late for Germany.

I will remind auditorium here how long ago on this forum I said that Germany mistaken for sponsored dissolution of Yugoslavia, attack on Serbians and partition of Serbia. Venerable brat Prof. dr hab. Jerzy Robert Nowak, spoke about German role in the events, on Radio Maryja (2008-04-26) >>> Rola Niemiec w rozbiciu Jugosławii >>> video > youtube.com/watch?v=9V2EB9GuCvI

Now, many thing won`t be told openly in mass media but, we all see that Germany have many problems now. Somethings grinding it.

Now this, among else >

"US and Germany are at odds about Kosovo partition"
b92.net/eng/news/politics.php?yyyy=2018&mm=09&dd=02&nav_id=104982

Remind yourself people what stance `west` had on situation in the region (speaking of Kosovo case)? They had united stance- `disregard Serbian sovereignty` and `Kosovo is sovereign state`.

And now? Now US starting to protect Serbia. No more united `west`.

You know why is this the case? Because `Serbian question` marks turning point for balance among world powers in Europe and even world. But, crucially, Serbians are source of balance between Poles and Russians. Furthermore, among Serbs in the region is key to security for both- Poland and Russia. Attack on Serbs from the western Europe, movement against them, always indicate wider works against Poland or against Russia.

So grinding machine now works against Germany. Grinding, grinding and they even don`t know what befall them. Like that they provoked some divine power
Ziemowit 10 | 2,956    
4 Sep 2018  #299
The only realistic answer (beside all that "Fluchtursachen bekämpfen") will be a shut down EU...with a highly secured outer border...

Shut down of the EU? By building a wall perhaps? Should I remind you of the wall built by the Roman Empire to protect them against invading barbaric tribes, most of them Germanic ones? Eventually, Rome agreed to let some of those tribes to enter through the wall and then slowly and consequently the Germanic tribes took over the western part of the Empire eventually ..

Walls is not a solution and never will be (the same applies to any walls between the US and Mexico). What is needed is a new equillibrium between the North and the South. An equillibrium which would involve better economic prospects for the South eventually leading to the levelling of the standards of living on both sides.

But I am not optimistic about that. And what about the climate change which will be forcing more and more migration from the South? I think we are slowly heading towards a global catastrophe which is bound to happen sooner or later ..
mafketis 16 | 5,896    
4 Sep 2018  #300
An equillibrium which would involve better economic prospects for the South

Actually increased prosperity is a main driver of emigration.... people's expectations rise faster than economic conditions can leading to dissatisfaction and larger numbers of people moving. A high percentage of SubSahran African migrants are from Senegal, peaceful and prosperous (by local standards).

there's also the nuclear bomb of African fertility, population of the continent is forecast to increase four fold over the next 100 years... but as good as Africans are at reproducing they're not very good at setting up stable and prosperous societies...

Walls can work to some degree for some period of time but what would work better is a Europe that's more interested in survival than public relations which means the claws are going to come out sooner or later or European culture is finished to be replaced by middle eastern and african cultures (probably at eternal low grade warfare with each other).




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