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Goodbye Sunday Shopping in Poland - Hello Electoral Reform


Dirk diggler 7 | 3,864    
13 Mar 2018  #121
Actually polands classification from emerging to developed market changed sometime around 2017.

And even with 2% inflation, which isnt a healthy number as it shows stagnation and should be closer to between 3% amd 4%, that means germany grew .2% after 2% inflation is subtracted. So basically growth was nonexistent. And growth is measured by percentage, not increased/decreased nominal/real gdp.

Of course some retail businesses will have slightly smaller reveneus. People will adjust and shop during the other 6 days of thr week. The reason why this was passed is so people could enjoy a day off. Most shops are closed on holidays. Also switzerland Norway and austria also have limitations on sunday shopping with austria having a total ban. Its high time for people to spend sundays with family and friends - not enriching corporations. Hopefully this law is adjusted to only allow small businesses to remain open and foreign corporations must remain closed to give polish small biz a leg up while promoting sunday as a day for family and rest.

I am somewhat against this in its current form though as itll disproportionately affects students who work on weekends.
Dougpol1 26 | 2,146    
13 Mar 2018  #122
The reason why this was passed is

So that PIS could make one of their childish points more like. And it wont stand as it will likely damage growth in many analysts' views. We shall see.
Tacitus 1 | 764    
13 Mar 2018  #123
Er..don't you mean over a shorter period of time?

I meant to say that if shops have longer opened, people will roughly spend the same amount of money, during the longer buisness hours.

nd even with 2% inflatio

a) Germany had less than 2% inflation, and few economists would argue that even 2% are "too high". What is worrysome though it Poland's growing debt, given its' future demographic problems and overall economic outlook. If a government still records a high deficte even in times of economic growth, that does bode poorly for the future.
Dirk diggler 7 | 3,864    
13 Mar 2018  #124
No ones saying 2% inflation is too high. But yes youre right inflation was a tad bit below 2%, not 2%. Hence theyre stagnant as low inflation means no borrowing and cheap credit while low gdp rate means no additional economic growth from last year. The inflation is too low as it falls outside the ideal 3 to 4% for a developed nation. Germany has not only stagnant growth but no demand for credit to spur growth. Not good

And what deficit are you talking about? Polamd has no budget deficit, public debt to gdp is right around 50%. Keep in mind if the eu requirement for debt was enforced as written in the treaties a bunch of countries would be kicked out. But eu only enforces laws it wants.

Germany is 68% debt to gdp polands is a lot lower. Poland is growing faster than just about anyome in europe. Double nomimal gdp simce 1990 amd we even took care of our high unemployment which is super low even by eu standards. Wages are rising too as are property values. Theres so many jobs with continually increasing wages that poland had to import ukranians to take the low wage entry level ones

Ah here it is countries cannot have higher than 60% debt to gdp. Germany must be sanctioned for having 68%. Time to trigger article 1738264 against them.

consilium.europa.eu/en/policies/joining-the-euro-area/convergence-criteria

Can we dissolve the eu now already if this is going to keep pushing agendas which countless european citizens reject? No ones really meeting all their supposed commitment to the eu and germanys clearly not committed to the eus strict requirements for financial stability
Tacitus 1 | 764    
14 Mar 2018  #125
I am not going to bother to correct all your false assumptions about inflation et al. since it is obvious that you have no idea of what you are talking about and simply use this to further your agenda. Though I give you credits for being inventive enough to create the assumption that Germany had economically stagnated last year.

Polamd has no budget deficit,

It has actually a rather high annual budget deficite:

tradingeconomics.com/poland/government-budget

But eu only enforces laws it wants.

It only enforces laws that if can enforce, since the member states were (and still are) able to veto any sanctions, which they did in the past. Obviously that is detrimental to the whole process, and thus greater fiscal supervision will be granted to Bruessels with the next planned reforms.

enforced as written in the treaties a bunch of countries would be kicked out

The treaties to not include the possibility of forcing countries to leave the eurozone.

Germany is 68% debt to gdp polands is a lot lower.

Yes, but Germany has been reducing its' deficite, while Poland is continuing to borrow money.

Poland is growing faster than just about anyome in europe.

Poland is doing well, but it will take a lot more effort to catch up to Western Europe, and along the way, it will have to decide how to let all Polish people benefit from growth.
cms neuf - | 580    
14 Mar 2018  #126
This will not give small business a leg up - in Hungary it had the precise opposite effect as customers switched to doing a huge shop on Saturday - only foreign owned hypers had the number of tills, staff and parking space to cope.

Not everyone has a family - why cant people who are single do what they want on Sunday ?

Also stop spamming every thread. What have migrants and thd EU got to dio with this ?
shockedInpoland    
14 Mar 2018  #127
So basically growth was nonexistent.

Sorry, that is absolutely wrong.Growth is on top of inflation, you dont deduct inflation from the growth figure.

And inflation targets are 2- 2.5% 4% is very bad for an economy,

We learnt our lesson - which is, let the free market decide.

Arn't you aware that the UK restricts Sunday shopping? 6 hours only for large stores.

Nobody's complaining about it.
Dougpol1 26 | 2,146    
14 Mar 2018  #128
Arn't you aware that the UK restricts Sunday shopping?

Yes thanks:) 12 - 6? But like I said, not being a catholic country, we decided to (finally) modernise and revitalise our retail experience. Better late than never. Poland chooses to go backwards. You really couldn't make it up, and young people are even more likely to get the hell out if they have the quals to do so as Poland continues on its' catholic conservative course. Those why choose to stay are welcome to it.

Anyway, the food hypermarkets in the UK were open Sundays 8-6 or something like that last time I checked (4 weeks ago). That's deffo not 6 hours. Nice try SP:) :)
polishinvestor 1 | 362    
14 Mar 2018  #129
Sorry, that is absolutely wrong.

Yes where to start. The relationship between wage growth and inflation is more important. As long as wages are rising faster than inflation, real income is rising and you can expect to see growth. But its a balancing act since higher wages feeds back into higher inflation, hence the need to cool the economy before inflation breaks away ahead of wages.
Dirk diggler 7 | 3,864    
14 Mar 2018  #130
Nice now the baltics are backing pl.against eu
SigSauer 2 | 443    
14 Mar 2018  #131
Can we agree on this thread to ignore any and all posts from 'shockedinpoland' since he's not a member of this board, is a coward, and only comes on here to quip snide remarks while never returning to engage in conversation. Blacklist him, when he posts, pretend he doesn't exist. Bye.
cms neuf - | 580    
14 Mar 2018  #132
Well we could do - but so long as we also agree that this thread is about the effect of Sunday trading laws on customers, workers, retailers, churchgoers and it is not about migrants, muslims, cucks, ducks, the EU or Hillary.
Dirk diggler 7 | 3,864    
14 Mar 2018  #133
Lock her up.

Sunday shopping ban asserts our break from the western material consumerist mindless world. As polish catholics sunday we ought to know sundayss for family and a lot of older ppl go.to church. Plus it gives loe wage workers a day off and people who rly need money will find work n e way

Inflation and growth will cancel each other out if theyre equal. Same as with wages if inflation outpaces your income growth your making less monkey
SigSauer 2 | 443    
14 Mar 2018  #134
@cms neuf

Sure, and since we were on the topic of Ireland I'll say..............fair play to ya
johnny reb 16 | 3,461    
14 Mar 2018  #135
Hang her !

- why cant people who are single do what they want on Sunday ?

Why can't 'anybody' do what they want to on Sunday ?

Arn't you aware that the UK restricts Sunday shopping? 6 hours only for large stores.

Retailers will be able to do business on Sundays as long as they serve customers themselves.
The ban does not apply to outlets such as online stores, gas stations, airports, bakeries, pharmacies, etc.
So what is the big whoop to have the big box stores closed for six hours ?
Once the government adds up all the sales taxes they are losing they might change their minds.

since we were on the topic of Ireland

Use to be a lot worse............
Sparks11 - | 338    
14 Mar 2018  #136
considering that the majority of poles are against the ban I figure pis is just doing it to give the mom and pop stores a chance to earn on sundays. this seems to be reflected in reality so far. chuch membership down, people still buying.
Dirk diggler 7 | 3,864    
14 Mar 2018  #137
Yeah a lot of my family members and friends are against it. To me it has good intentions, but isn't being implemented well and is somewhat impractical. It'd be better to encourage other ways of making Sunday a day of rest.

It has actually a rather high annual budget deficite:

Compared to other EU nations, its nothing. Most the countries would be kicked out of EU if they actually enforced the debt to gdp requirements. Not Poland though as we're below 60% Perhaps we should kick Germany, Greece, and all the other countries drowning in liabilities and leverage out of the EU.
Tacitus 1 | 764    
14 Mar 2018  #138
Compared to other EU nations, its nothing

Poland can't be compared to other EU countries (at least not Western European countries) since it is not as developed as them. The fact that Poland is racking up a high deficite despite great economic growth is worrying, especially since the demographic outlook of Poland is particulary bleak. Western Europeans have acquired more personal wealth, and are thus more capable to bear the consequences of the demographic decline, but this is not yet the case in Poland. Either the current or next government will have to reduce the budget deficite.

EU if they actually enforced the debt to gdp requirements.

Said debt requirement only affects the Euro members, not the EU.

Perhaps we should kick Germany, Greece,

Again, there is mechanism to kich out any Euro member, nor is it possible to kick a country out of the EU. A country can only voluntarily leave the EU, it can not be forced out.

bbc.com/news/business-15575751
Dirk diggler 7 | 3,864    
14 Mar 2018  #139
Said debt requirement only affects the Euro members, not the EU.

WRONG - Germany, Greece, France (almost 100% debt to gdp), Spain, Italy (132% ddebt to gdp), Portugal (130%) etc should all be penalized then as all have higher debt to GDP than 60% and use euro. Sshouldn't people who aren't meeting the standards of the EU be fined and punished? Shouldn't corrective actions, sanctions, etc be taken against these countries who are not meeting their 'obligations'? Afterall they're not obeying EU rules and the 'spirit' of the union. They're showing lack of solidarity and not confirming to the EU's requirements. Isn't that what the lefitsts prattle about Poland, Hungary, etc all the time?

Seems to me the EU only enforces leftist agendas against countries, especially the conservative leaning ones who reject their political interference, but doesn't care about nations as long as they toe the EU's neo-Maxist, pseudo USSR line.
Tacitus 1 | 764    
14 Mar 2018  #140
Please just educate yourself about the applications of the Maastricht criterias before you continue to demonstrate your ignorance... .

Your attempts to link them to Polish own failures are as clumsy as they are wrong.

Not only are the Maastricht criterias more flexible in their application, they are something entirely different from the rules that Poland is breaking.
Dougpol1 26 | 2,146    
15 Mar 2018  #141
So to the latest retail experience.
I don't know if it's pay-day, but I couldn't get in Biedronka at 12 today. It was packed full of dodderers and families (no idea why they weren't at work). Finally found some space in Kaufland. They have automated tills so it wasn't too bad, but still packed.

And one can guess the shops will pass on their losses to the customer? Because they have no automation, one can expect Lidl and Biedronks to lose from the panic buying (long queues, not enough staff).

And what's all this with the extra Polish goods in the shops these days? Has anybody else noticed it's getting harder to but foreign sourced goods (almost back to Pewex style days) 75 percent of pasta is Polish produced for example. They're having a tin bath - who in their right mind would buy Polish pasta over Italian? All in all, it's a worse shop than before, unless you love being with the plebs for an hour or so of course.

Well done PIS! You little fokkers.
Dirk diggler 7 | 3,864    
15 Mar 2018  #142
@Tacitus

It clearly says (see link to eus website) that countries are to maintain 60% debt to gdp. Eu only enforces the parts of treaties and laws as it desires which only adds to more evidence of brushless clear political bias. Acyually it even tries to enforce rules and laws that were never agreed upon like the redistribution of migrants.

@doug

Be with the plebs for an hour huh? Sorry to break it to you doug but your also in the polish middle class
Ziemowit 12 | 3,100    
15 Mar 2018  #143
I don't know if it's pay-day

After so many years in Poland you don't know if Thursday is pay-day in Poland ...

I couldn't get in Biedronka at 12 today. It was packed full of dodderers and families (no idea why they weren't at work)

Any idea why you weren't at work at that hour?

who in their right mind would buy Polish pasta over Italian?

So why not move to Italia rather than dwell in Tri-city?
cms neuf - | 580    
15 Mar 2018  #144
Dirk are you able to buy a soda or pay a parking ticket without mentioning migrants ? - cant you keep your bigoted comments to one thread.

Doug you are in a perfect storm - most supermarkets go live with their promo offers on Thursday- knowing this is a weekend when sunday is open there will be many good food offers. Might also be the day when 500 plus is paid - it is on 12th in my town.

In tricity most people are probably paid last friday of the month but a good portion of hourly paud workers on the 10th
Dougpol1 26 | 2,146    
15 Mar 2018  #145
most supermarkets

Thanks cms for a reasoned and informed reply - in sharp contrast to Ziemowits' weird post. I just feel that food shopping has been made more painful, whereas the idea in life is generally to make things easier by degrees?

Or I must be plain stupid to believe in that notion.
Dougpol1 26 | 2,146    
15 Mar 2018  #146
More and more people I ask are getting annoyed by this ****. Hopefully they will start class action soon, if they have any balls.
Ironside 47 | 9,250    
15 Mar 2018  #147
he effect of Sunday trading laws on customers

Makes little difference. People shouldn't be forced to work Sundays. That is on a positive side.

we decided to (finally) modernise and revitalise our retail experience.

Aren't you for working class and all that? Well Lenin you must be a 'champagne socialist' or in your case vodka.
delphiandomine 87 | 16,884    
15 Mar 2018  #148
People shouldn't be forced to work Sundays.

They aren't. If they don't want to work on Sundays, get a job where you don't have to work on them.
Ironside 47 | 9,250    
15 Mar 2018  #149
They aren't.

Well, it is not what they say.
Hey, but you know that - hence your contradictory post here.
kaprys 1 | 1,355    
15 Mar 2018  #150
It's been just one Sunday so far. Armaggedon for some obviously. Lol.
I buy Polish pasta, why would I pay twice as much for Italian pasta?



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