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WHY DOES POLAND BUY GAS FROM RUSSIA?


Velund 1 | 537
8 May 2010 #61
When did America say that all Mexicans are in fact Americans and they should all belong to the USA?

Hm... They say nothing... They just cut the pair of most valuable and conveniently located slices from Mexico in the past and now trying to build wall to avoid new mexican illegal migrants. ;)
1jola 14 | 1,879
8 May 2010 #62
Just so we are on the same page. From the link above:

Polish Prime Minister Donald Tusk is set to seal a key gas deal with Russia’s Gazprom days after the death of opponents to the contract — including Polish President Lech Kaczynski — in a mysterious plane crash in Smolensk, Russia, reports Polskaweb.

Under the contract worth an estimated 100 billion dollars – the biggest business deal in the history of Poland – Poland is to increase its imports of Russian gas.

The contract to buy gas from Gazprom until 2037 will make Poland 100% dependent on Russian gas for the next 28 years in spite of the announcement of the discovery of huge gas reserves in Poland in April just before the memorial service in Katyn, Smolensk.

convex 20 | 3,930
8 May 2010 #63
So they should have waited until after the elections?

Polish shale gas reserves are enough to supply Poland for nearly a century...or the EU for nearly 2 years. Doubt much is going the export route.
1jola 14 | 1,879
8 May 2010 #64
Polish shale gas reserves are enough to supply Poland for nearly a century...or the EU for nearly 2 years. Doubt much is going the export route.

EU negotiated the Baltic route with Russia bypassing Poland.

So they should have waited until after the elections?

Pawlak, on the Polish side, agreed to what the Russians wanted him to agree to. He walked into the negotiations with a pen in his hand. His and this government's(PO) loyalty is seriously questioned.
convex 20 | 3,930
10 May 2010 #65
EU negotiated the Baltic route with Russia bypassing Poland.

Uh no. The point is to make money. E.ON, Gazprom, and BASF aren't building Nord Stream so that they can donate transit fees to Poland. If the Polish government were to have offered to provide land, security, and waive transit fees for the next 100 years, I'm sure the pipeline would have made landfall on Polish shores. It would be idiotic to do so out of the kindness of their commercial hearts.

Pawlak, on the Polish side, agreed to what the Russians wanted him to agree to. He walked into the negotiations with a pen in his hand. His and this government's(PO) loyalty is seriously questioned.

Wasn't Sikorski one of the most outspoken critics of Nord Stream? I think there was a comment about Nazis and Soviets that came up...
delphiandomine 88 | 18,163
10 May 2010 #66
EU negotiated the Baltic route with Russia bypassing Poland.

And?

I wouldn't trust the Polish under a Kaczynski-esque government not to pull a Ukranian style stunt.
cladd - | 3
15 May 2010 #67
Those interested in learning more about the opportunities for Shale Gas in Poland and its potential impact on energy independence from Russian sources should visit the website shalegaspoland.com
David_18 66 | 969
28 Jun 2010 #68
"Russia warned Poland" Could end up with no gas in October.

Poland agreed with Russia to buy 10 billion cubic meters of gas per year through 2037, but the final agreement has not been signed. Earlier a representative of the Russian Economy Ministry warned Poland that if the country did not sign the agreement soon, it could end up with no gas in October.

oilandgaseurasia.com/news/p/0/news/7804

Seems like the russians want Poland to sign the deal before Poland finds some shale gas.
DannyJ - | 129
28 Jun 2010 #69
Good job we get ours from Norway then
Torq
28 Jun 2010 #70
And we will set up the LNG terminal on the Baltic coast, speed-up the shale gas thingy
and there's like a dozen of possible diversification projects...

rynekgazu.pl/index.html?id=88

representative of the Russian Economy Ministry warned Poland that if the country did not sign the agreement soon, it could end up with no gas in October.

Warned Poland? Warned Poland??? That's funny - they think they can threaten us?
Fcuk 'em. Let's buy from Norway for the time being, even if it's more expensive.
nott 3 | 594
28 Jun 2010 #71
Warned Poland? Warned Poland??? That's funny - they think they can threaten us?
Fcuk 'em. Let's buy from Norway for the time being, even if it's more expensive.

I'd love to react just like you did, only I am not sure about our masters...
polishmeknob 5 | 154
28 Jun 2010 #72
Oh, those Ruskies, they wave their fingers at everyone over gas. One day, it's going to come around and bite them right in the ass.

Yeah, shale gas might be a boon for Poland, but it'll be years before there are enough wells up and running. (Plus they need to verify that there's enough to heat Polish homes.)
Torq
28 Jun 2010 #73
I'd love to react just like you did, only I am not sure about our masters...

Vox populi, vox Dei! Russia is asking for such reaction and they will get what they ask for.

One day, it's going to come around and bite them right in the ass.

And it's going to happen sooner than they think.
Seanus 15 | 19,674
28 Jun 2010 #74
I don't think it is a serious ultimatum as the new-found partnership needs to be seen to be working. Poland will just look for a new partner.
plk123 8 | 4,142
28 Jun 2010 #75
Warned Poland? Warned Poland??? That's funny - they think they can threaten us?

of course they can and guess what.. Tusk will jump at it.. didn't he already forgive them what they owed PL?

Russia is asking for such reaction and they will get what they ask for.

PL will budge..

And it's going to happen sooner than they think.

but definitely not by October and not next October.. etc.
Seanus 15 | 19,674
28 Jun 2010 #76
Plk123 is right here, Tusk is a soft touch. Yes Mr Putin, OK Mr Putin, clean your shoes, Mr Putin? :)

However, Russia had better understand the principles of independence and alternative sources.
PlasticPole 7 | 2,648
28 Jun 2010 #77
I live in Canada and wonder why Poland get their gas imports from Russia- their biggest enemy since, oh I dunno, the beginning of time! I remember a couple of years ago the Ruski's turned off the supply for a while (which affected Germany too). What is Poland doing to diversify it's supply?

Most the time places buy gas, coal, or oil from wherever they can get it at a good price. Even if Poland and Russia remain tense, Poland still needs natural gas to heat water, homes and businesses, so they will buy from wherever is cheap and easy. It's got nothing to do with politics, more to do with supply and demand.
David_18 66 | 969
28 Jun 2010 #78
Admin you closed 1 thread i made today, and now your merging my thread into this one...

Even though my threads might be similar to some others, i still don't think it's fair to do like that.

A very sad member...
Sasha 2 | 1,083
28 Jun 2010 #79
only I am not sure about our masters...

Please tell them not to buy Russian gas so that we can remove the burden of raw-exports role. That will be win-win position. We would overthrow the government which is incapable of doing any good for people and develop our industry, more Poles would be coming to Königsberg seeing there a better alternative for the expensive Norwegian one.
nott 3 | 594
29 Jun 2010 #80
Please tell them not to buy Russian gas

I could try, actually... My accent is getting less and less Polish...
delphiandomine 88 | 18,163
29 Jun 2010 #81
Warned Poland? Warned Poland??? That's funny - they think they can threaten us?

Yes, sadly. Poland really doesn't have a good alternative supplier when it comes to gas - can Norway really supply all of Poland's needs?

It makes sense to sign a long term contract, and work towards alternative fuel supply by 2038. Either that, or the old people freeze.
Seanus 15 | 19,674
29 Jun 2010 #82
Norway and Scotland could, Delph. I worked in the industry for a bit and am aware of capabilities. As you know, some big-hitters work in Altens and Dyce.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,163
29 Jun 2010 #83
Norway and Scotland could, Delph.

I wonder what the actual economics are?

The problem is, PO or PiS, or even SLD - you just know that they will dither on alternative fuels :(
Nathan 18 | 1,349
29 Jun 2010 #84
And we will set up the LNG terminal on the Baltic coast, speed-up the shale gas thingy
and there's like a dozen of possible diversification projects...

The only sane solution. Be as independent and diversified as possible. These 2089 or 3011 year contracts are nothing short of Russian KGB crapping the pants of new energy sources development. Soon this pseudo-federation of independent states called Russian Federation is gone. Feast is coming :)
szkotja2007 27 | 1,498
29 Jun 2010 #85
As much as 300 million barrels of oil found in the Catcher field this week ( North Sea )
delphiandomine 88 | 18,163
29 Jun 2010 #86
The only sane solution. Be as independent and diversified as possible. These 2089 or 3011 year contracts are nothing short of Russian KGB crapping the pants of new energy sources development. Soon this pseudo-federation of independent states called Russian Federation is gone. Feast is coming :)

What, you don't think that signing a long term deal to secure future energy supplies is sensible? You prefer the instability of not knowing if your old people will be warm every year? You prefer the way that your country stole gas intended for the EU?

The sane, sensible thing to do is to sign a 20 year agreement now, and use those 20 years to build alternative sources of fuel. That way, there's no nasty shocks and everyone is happy.
Nathan 18 | 1,349
29 Jun 2010 #87
My country haven't stole the gas intended for EU, at least it wasn't proven. But have you read what I said? I didn't say Poland should rely on gas supplies from Russia, no matter what country it goes through - just fcuking diversify as soon as possible! If you have no one else to buy your gas from, then, of course, you have no choice. But again, bargaining can be made to reduce the length of the contract to at least 10 years. I wish Poland does better than sick corrupted fcuks in Ukrainian parliament and our retarded "president". That's all.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,163
29 Jun 2010 #88
But again, bargaining can be made to reduce the length of the contract to at least 10 years.

But why only 10 years? It's not long enough to get the proposed nuclear power station online, nor is it long enough to make any serious investment into renewable energy. 20 years is actually about the right time - it means Poland will have long enough to actually diversify without having to worry about another contract renewal coming up.

Ukraine - well - tough situation. The country is highly unlikely to have the cash to use alternative sources, and really, what else could she do?
Mr Grunwald 33 | 2,158
29 Jun 2010 #89
Good job we get ours from Norway then

*cheer*

Norway is deeply trustworthy :)
THe only thing they will use it for as a political tool will maybe be, that the ban on Nazi's and Communism symbols will be gone (propagating it) in the name of free speech or that homosexuals have the right to make a homosexual political organization which will be accepted by the government or something.

Was reading a story once that Norwegian ambassador in Poland has secret meetings with homosexuals to support them politically I really didn't like that.

Poland is an ally Grrr ;/

Idk about Feminist issues but about that they usely just criticize. They never do anything really.
plk123 8 | 4,142
29 Jun 2010 #90
What, you don't think that signing a long term deal to secure future energy supplies is sensible? You prefer the instability of not knowing if your old people will be warm every year?

with the damned russians it's always going to be a crap shoot.. they'll pull some other shyt in a few years.. don't trust them..

The sane, sensible thing to do is to sign a 20 year agreement now, and use those 20 years to build alternative sources of fuel. That way, there's no nasty shocks and everyone is happy.

yup but russia is not stable enough to trust them on a long term contract..


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