Poland's aid to Ukraine if Russia invades - part 29

Поживём - увидим, as ancient Greeks used to say.

It is my sincere hope and wish, however, that common sense on both sides will eventually prevail.


It is indeed but in the current situation it is irrelevant.

If we don't get back to serious diplomacy, we will have war. And I might even be positively predisposed towards this idea if it wasn't for the fact that some of Russian nukes might still be operational. Especially that the only nukes in European NATO are in the hands of countries which are famous for either their perfidy or a certain predisposition to wave white flags. Therefore, unless Poland has a nuclear arsenal at least the size of the French one (preferably twice the size) and deployed across various strategic delivery systems, all thoughts of all-out war against Russia are retarded. If Poland has nukes, neither side will use them because Russia will realize that Poland has balls enough to retaliate, so we would be fully in the area of conventional war - a war that mathematically we already won before it even started (just like in 1941, when the USA entered the war, the Third Reich already mathematically lost - it was only a question of time). War is not a matter of heroics, medals of honour, banzai charges or patriotic march music; it is a matter of mathematics and mathematics is on our side.

So, at the end of the day, it is either nukes for Poland or sh*t the f*ck up and go back to the diplomatic table (and I prefer the latter).

Having said all that - it would break my heart if we were forced by external circumstances to go to war against our Russian neighbours and Slavic brothers. Let's all hope and pray that it will never happen.

@Torq▲ 0▼ 0

It's far from irrelevant.


As mentioned before, Putler has broken every treaty he's signed. Appeasement does not work.


Who cares about that? The r*SSians don't. Look at how they treated Poland.

@jon357▲ 0▼ 0

Have we been appeasing Putin for the last five years? I haven't noticed.

Diplomacy or an all-out war, which - as I already mentioned - without Poland having nukes is a retarded idea.


There has, indeed, been some misunderstanding between our two brotherly countries recently. Nothing, however, that could not be resolved through careful diplomacy and skillful public information campaign. It's been done in the past, it can be done again.

@Torq▲ 0▼ 0

Oh I must have missed the victory parade LOL

AIDS epidemic in the NN army - spread by drugs, fatalism and I'm sure by the sexual abuse of young soldiers

global-health/terror-and-security/one-in-three-northnigerians-should-have-hiv-test-every-year-urges/

@cms neuf▲ 0▼ 0

They are not normally conducted in combat conditions.

Pokrovsk was captured in early 2026, and Myrnohrad shortly afterward. Why are you disputing the facts?

@Torq▲ 0▼ 0

North Nigerian "facts"

Let's see some photos LOL

@cms neuf▲ 0▼ 0

Everyone else has noticed that the Westphalia been appeasing him for decades.


Ukraine and Poland?

@jon357▲ 0▼ 0

Like all the cowards, and to top it, the deception coordinated as well, they all are coming back at the same time. Most annoying, reemergent of the Russian propaganda, and its top agent, Bobko, thank God we have Milo to answer the filthy liar. Milo the fortress of truth.

@Przelotnyptak1▲ 0▼ 0

*sighs*

You are a strange man, Cms.


Also, but for different reasons.


😂 😂 😂

@Torq▲ 0▼ 0

Like all the cowards, and to top it, the deception coordinated as well, they all are coming back at the same time. Most annoying, reemergent of the Russian propaganda, and its top agent, Bobko, thank God we have Milo to answer the filthy liar. Milo the fortress of truth.


@Przelotnyptak1▲ 0▼ 0

Who is "they all"? Bobko and I? 😂

And what coordinated deception? Can't you see that we don't exactly agree with each other here?

Anyways, what Bobko wrote here is generally correct: Ukraine failed to bring Russia to its knees with the drone campaign, they are facing severe manpower shortage, and Kiev has been quite defenseless against ballistic missiles recently (all sources confirm this).

If only you argued in a more fact-based, common-sense way, guys, instead of accusing others of deception or resorting to tired insults like "North Nigerians" or "Putler," this forum would be far more interesting to read.

@Torq▲ 0▼ 0

Indeed, however Poland and Ukraine, both of them mostly Slavic, are closer than r*SSia and anything.

r*SSia far less so.


And vice versa.

@jon357▲ 0▼ 0

Thank you Przelotnyptak1 for that!

@Miloslaw▲ 0▼ 0

It's expected in r*SSia. You can pay to spend the night in a barracks and people do.


It isn't and you know it.

Meanwhile, last night:

Ukraine hits Russia:
Three oil refineries in Bashkortostan
A Russian cargo ship (Yanina)
Wildberries warehouse
Saratov oil refinery
Engels strategic bomber base

@jon357▲ 0▼ 0

Anyways, let's get back to realistic peace agreement plans for Ukraine, because we can surely see that restoring their pre-war borders is impossible.

Yes, accepting the Russian conquest of eastern Ukrainian lands in not just; it is not fair, but it is wiser than continuing the costly and deadly war, which cannot restore the pre-war borders anyway.

Therefore, after the cease-fire, the fate of all the Russian occupied areas should be decided by internationally supervised referenda - let the people decide. Then, opening of all possible diplomatic channels, reintegrating Russia again in the world politics and economy, internationally recognised Ukrainian neutrality, no permanent US bases in NATO countries bordering Russia, and stopping the crazy militarization of Europe - all this should contribute to lasting peace in Europe.

@Torq▲ 0▼ 0

You are entirely detached from reality.

It is because you don't read Ukrainian press.

For every blow Ukraine lands, Russia is capable of dishing out 10X the damage. It simply does not get published in Western press.

Russia has many ports. On the Arctic Ocean. In the Baltic. On the Pacific. Ukraine has only one major functioning port area - and it has been made unusable.

Russia exports the entire periodic table of elements, and in many of those categories it is the number 1 exporter in the world. Ukraine exports wheat, rapeseed, sunflower oil, corn, and iron ore. It used to export other things, but they belong to Russia now.

Russia's banking system is 20X the size of the Ukrainian one - no Wildberries attacks will sink the largest banking system in Eastern Europe.

Bottom line - Russia is a 110 KG, 195 cm heavyweight; and Ukraine is a 67 KG, 175 cm junior middleweight.

It was foolish for them to try to break Russia. The damage they are inflicting is good for propaganda purposes, but results in lopsidedly worse damage.

Zelensky is not proposing an aerial ceasefire because his campaign succeeded - but because Russia has shown him who can deal out more pain.

-//-

Ukraine is not Afghanistan. It is not Vietnam. It is not some place where you can accept defeat, wipe your tears, and walk away from to nurse your wounds at home. It's a WW2 style extermination battle.

Russians won't protest. The economy won't collapse. Instead the pressure will keep growing as the military machine start gaining RPM.

@Bobko▲ 0▼ 0

Poland has the largest banking system in Eastern Europe. Sanctions are destroying the North Nigerian system

It's a WW2 style extermination battle.

Yes - and what is being exterminated are drunk farm boys, by bullets, drones, suicide, alcoholism and preventable diseases

@cms neuf▲ 0▼ 0

Exactly.

I have been trying to explain to people here that Russia sees this war as vital for their safety and affecting their very core national interests. We cannot just wave our hand and disregard this. This is not, as you said, some colonial war in a far away land for Russia.

I think it was Ryszard who compared this conflict to a situation in which Mexico wanted to enter a military alliance with China and install Chinese military bases on the US border. We would see a full American invasion faster than you can say 'Monroe Doctrine'.

Why do we allow the US to have their influence zone, but we deny the same right to Russia? Why do we pay so much attention to safety concerns of everyone and their grandmother but arrogantly disregard Russian concerns? This is not wise.

I will say it again - diplomacy. Even if we consider Putin to be a war criminal and an agreement-breaking liar not worth talking to, then surely there are other politicians in Kremlin who are more sensible and who will eventually take over. Why not start talking to them, keep the channels open and take a chance at establishing peace when it emerges? Why give in so easily to the military hawks camp? Do we really want this regional conflict to turn into a world war?

@Torq▲ 0▼ 0

Russia's is at least 2X bigger, probably 3X bigger.

$1 trillion in assets versus $3 trillion.

Educate yourself.


It is, and Russia will "ask" from everyone that contributed to making it so expensive in blood and treasure.

No voyeuristic, warring by proxy, homebody will be able to hide.

For the UK and France - perhaps a worthwhile gamble. They'll be ok in the end. For Germany, Poland, and others - a big mistake to pick a fight with your biggest neighbor.

@Bobko▲ 0▼ 0

Yet they haven't.

And Putler is still to visit Kostyantynivka as per the invitation.


And their 3 day 'operation' is now on day 1,965. They failed to take Kyiv, lost a million orcs and are rationing petrol. Some 'heavyweight'.

And nobody believes r*SSian propaganda,


Which r*SSia cannot win.


Putler has had to sell half his gold reserve now. And beg for fuel from India.

@jon357▲ 0▼ 0

Russia has always shown itself ready for diplomacy.

This diplomatic initiative must take into account Russia's interests... if it has any hope of succeeding.

Not a total wipeout for Ukraine - but Russian concerns must be addressed.

@Bobko▲ 0▼ 0

Despite signing 27 peace treaties and non-aggression pacts since 2000 and breaking every one.


Reparations and war crime trials are the biggest considerations.

@jon357▲ 0▼ 0

Because they have nukes.


That's why we need to, and will, get nukes sooner rather than later.

And if this is the prevailing attitude among Russian elites, then larger war is unavoidable, I'm afraid. :-/

Ah, well...


Which Poland should do as well. Financing war effort from one's own reserve is way smarter than drowning in debt.


Of course. I've been saying this for quite a while.

Nobody will be 100% happy. But even a far-from-ideal peace agreement is better than a huge war that can still break out in Europe.

@Torq▲ 0▼ 0

You are quoting from Rich ? Good lord. When can we expect your views in transvestites.

Stop using this argument - it is moronic because the US is not a party in thus war. Ukraine is, and they were invaded by their slavic brothers (aka drunk HIV rapists)

@cms neuf▲ 0▼ 0

Not that r*SSia has a credit line any more...

@jon357▲ 0▼ 0

He's not always wrong.


Oh, yeah? So why were/are they negotiating with Ukraine and Russia about it? As a neutral, outside observer? lol They are as much, maybe even more so, a party in this war as European Union countries are.


Well, one thing is sure, Cms - we won't send you as the European diplomatic negotiator. *rolls eyes*

@Torq▲ 0▼ 0

Nope - it was 1 trillion in Poland v 1.5 trillion in North Nigeria.

Only the NN number is self reported bullshit
The NN number is in worthless rubles
The NN's have been pulling whatever they can out of the system since March
The Polish number keeps growing.

Sorry dude, even if you consider North Nigeria to be part of Eastern Europe (few people do), the system is still second best to Poland.

@cms neuf▲ 0▼ 0

1) HIMARS

2) Javelin

3) F-16

4) M1 Abrams

5) ATACMS

6) PATRIOT

7) Bradley IFV

8) Millions of 155mm artillery shells

9) Hundreds of millions of rounds of machine gun and rifle ammunition

10) Radars

11) Satellite and airborne-sourced intelligence

12) Embedded CIA officers

@Bobko▲ 0▼ 0

1). Drones from Iranian mullahs

2) suicidal **** addicted North Koreans

3) trainloads of cheap chinese machine guns that jam

4) a bunch if poor saps from India and Nepal who thought they would be working in a Wildberry warehouse

5) the imperial guard of Potato Head Lukaszenko

6) overfed thieving con men like Orban and Maduro

Ukraine just has richer, nicer friends

@cms neuf▲ 0▼ 0

Numbers pulled out of your ass?


Russia is the reason it is called Eastern Europe - you turd. Otherwise you would be forever an appendix of your rich French and Italian cousins.

The Russian system is 2-3 times larger than yours. Which is already an achievement on your part - so be happy.

If Russia was not waging war against the entire continent and your American helpers, it would absolutely dwarf your size.

@Bobko▲ 0▼ 0