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Poland's aid to Ukraine if Russia invades - part 12


jon357 75 | 22,638
2 days ago #61
Hitting a plane with a drone while its parked is not shooting it out of the sky.

Did anyone claim it was? The important thing is that it's one less orc plane, not a mid air explosion.

A tug boat is not a battleship.

This was neither. It was the orcs' biggest landing craft.

No one has reported

Why would they?

But Ukraine is not moving Russia back at all,

Nor is r*SSia moving forward. They use to be the second best army in the world after China. Now they're the second best army in Ukraine.
Tacitus 2 | 1,394
2 days ago #62
@Ironside

It was, not only tanks when there but also other weapons. Including top-notch modern ones.

Great, but that was 2 years ago. Plenty of time to produce new weapons and send them to Ukraine. Ukraine needs a steady flow of new weapons, and Poland needs to do its' part here.

likes to take credit for what you promised not for what you delivered.

Aside from the fact that the actual deliveries so far are quite enough to be proud off - this war will take most likely several more years. And Germany is one of the few countries that is actively working on supporting Ukraine for years on. Which means ordering and paying for systems whose production may take years, investing into new factories and so on. If Poland announced that it would produce and finance the production of 200 tanks, I'd happily give Poland credit for these even if those would only be ready for delivery in 2 or 3 years. Because chances are, that Ukraine'd still need them by then. And it would help to send a signal to Putin that he can not simply outlast Western support.
Ironside 50 | 12,461
1 day ago #63
Plenty of time to produce new weapons

lol! Poland cannot do that. no industry up to par -. Instead of building up industry money is being spent on green energy technologies and paying for the air we use. Courtesy of the EU. Now seems we are gonna spend on the African migrants courtesy of Germany.

In such circumstances, Isane German and the EU elite seem to be wiser to do about-turn and join Russia.
In fact if not for the US it would be the only curse of action since the only thing the EU is doing is sabotaging the only country that stands between them and Russia.

---

f Poland

I see you haven't heard but Poland has already joined that program with a few modern weapons we make.
What I take umbrage about is Germany's attitude, you had been sitting on your hands for almost two years doing absolutely nothing while others like Poland were spilling their guts to send Help and now when you finally got around into doing something, out of the blue you are started lecturing others and taking charge and acting all mighty.

Get a grip, an ego is not a way to go.
Same with the AfD suddenly they are supported with Putin money, what about all parties in Germany haven't they been working cozily with Russia, counting on Russia and ignoring others when they had been warned? Hell, Putin corrupted openly some major German politicians. Now from Monday to Tuesday, they are the most garden anti-Putin politicians they ever walked that Earth, and always were but Afd is bad. lol!

If Afd takes Piutin money it makes it the same as other German parties. uff Now I feel better. lol
Bratwurst Boy 9 | 11,834
1 day ago #64
Hell, Putin corrupted openly some major German politicians. Now from Monday to Tuesday, they are the most garden anti-Putin politicians

....I believe our prez Steinmeier is till now still the ONLY one openly apologizing for their overlong loyalty to Putin....abit at least.....the others still prefer to ignore that mainly...

I'm not sure if you can call them corrupted in the main sense of the word (bribed or blackmailed and the like)....more like laziness, dependency, naivite, ignorance....and a total unwillingness to imagine what Putin could be, would be up to...denying all warnings and signs!
Ironside 50 | 12,461
1 day ago #65
them corrupted in the main sense

I used corrupted because it hints at other meanings of the word:
contaminate, morally depraved, and for some it was money.
--

The most garden

should be the most ardent/.
Tacitus 2 | 1,394
1 day ago #66
@Ironside

almost two years doing absolutely nothing

What are you talking about? In 2022 started the deliveries of heavy weapons via the Ring exchange program within weeks and the delivery of our own heavy weapons and modern anti-air systems within months. Germany spent more on weapons for Ukraine in 2023 than any other European country. As it stands now it will spend more on weapons for Ukraine in 2024 than the UK, France, Italy, Poland and Spain put together.

out of the blue you are started lecturing others

Poland has not been making any significant weapon pledges for close to a year now. That is hardly out of the clue.

EU is doing is sabotaging

The only actor sabotaging Poland was the previous Polish government. Who thought that undermining its' own judiciary, senselessly antagonizing other EU members and provoking the withholding of EU funds was somehow in Poland's interest.
Ironside 50 | 12,461
1 day ago #67
The only actor sabotaging Poland was the previous Polish government.

We won't agree on this, so let's drop it. I know what I know and what facts are if you prefer your vision of what had happened well, keep your delusions intact/

---

In 2022

I don't have data on hand and I don't want to rely only on my memory in this regard, It is not THAT important anyways.

My stance is that Poland has done enough for Ukraine and nobody is going to tell us it is not the case. Simple.

---

As it stands now it will spend more on weapons for Ukraine in 2024 than the UK, France, Italy, Poland, and Spain put together.

Wow! IF that HAPPENS I will personally give you a medal (or send it to the address you provide).
jon357 75 | 22,638
1 day ago #68
spend more

Certainly every penny that went into their economy from cheap r*SSian gas needs to go to Ukraine. With compound interest.
gumishu 15 | 6,271
1 day ago #69
I'm not sure if you can call them corrupted

chancellor Gerhard Schroeder very much looks like he was corrupted by Putin (unless he is not in the board of Gazprom anymore - he had been for a long time)
Bratwurst Boy 9 | 11,834
1 day ago #70
chancellor Gerhard Schroeder very much looks like he was corrupted by Putin

....yeah....now that looks definitely that way!

But then? I have no idea if there is proof to find....I hope not! And if Putin had also been already in that mindset back then as Schröder was in power.
Tacitus 2 | 1,394
1 day ago #71
@Ironside

My stance is that Poland has done enough for Ukraine

If the war ended in 2022 you'd be right. But imagine the war goes on until 2027. Do you really think that the Polish contribution would be considered sufficient as it is now?

IF that HAPPENS

Unless any of those countries increases its' contribution, than this is going to happen.

@jon357

Certainly every penny that went into their economy from cheap r*SSian

If other countries did the same, sure. And as you probably remember from a previous conversation, the UK could contribute massively from the Russian money it received in the last 20 years.
Novichok 3 | 7,883
1 day ago #72
Do you really think that the Polish contribution would be considered sufficient as it is now?

Let's see if you can "think"...What if the war lasted as long as the US invasion of Afghanistan...

Place the upper limit on:

1. Dead Ukrainians
2. US "contribution"
3. Polish "contribution"

Since you are German and a weasel, treat these questions as rhetorical and answerable by that idiotic "whatever it takes".

There... you are off the hook...Am I nice or what...

" its" does not need an apostrophe You are welcome...
pawian 223 | 24,571
1 day ago #73
What if

Nothing at all. Satisfied??? :):):)
Novichok 3 | 7,883
1 day ago #74
Now they're the second best army in Ukraine.

And over a million Ukraine casualties are still wondering about how many must join them for the Russia-hating azholes to finally STFU.
mafketis 37 | 10,916
1 day ago #75
Gerhard Schroeder very much looks like he was corrupted by Putin

What about Merkel? It's recently been disclosed that she deliberately withheld information about russian energy blackmail (honestly my opinion of her keeps getting worse and worse).
gumishu 15 | 6,271
1 day ago #76
What about Merkel?

don't you find it strange that a East German minor politician became the leader of the CDU and a chancellor (earlier she was part of the FDJ - an East German communist youth organisation) - she was presumably hand picked by the late Helmuth Kohl as his successor
Alien 20 | 5,227
1 day ago #77
she was presumably hand picked by the late Helmuth Kohl as his successor

That's exactly what happened.
Bratwurst Boy 9 | 11,834
1 day ago #78
honestly my opinion of her keeps getting worse and worse

You are not alone in that....

Lotsa Germans too see heir reign (and especially the consequences for the country) more and more differently!

But to be fair, she couldn't had done this alone....her party, the CDU, paid the price willingly and gladly for the provided 16 years in power, SIXTEEN YEARS!
jon357 75 | 22,638
1 day ago #79
the UK could contribute massively from the Russian money it received in the last 20 years.

Except much of that has been individual purchases of real estate and fee payments to private schools and universities which are all either charitable or not-for-profit. Not an entire industrial economy getting cheap oil and gas from them. And the U.K. walked away from all oil/gas joint ventures.

Nor is there any oil or gas from r*SSia going there now...
Miloslaw 21 | 4,790
1 day ago #80
What about Merkel?

A complete disgrace for Germany!

You are not alone in that....

Good!

Lotsa Germans too see heir reign (and especially the consequences for the country) more and more differently!

I am glad to hear it!She was a Communist sympathiser and ruined Germany!
mafketis 37 | 10,916
1 day ago #81
16 years in power, SIXTEEN YEARS!

My ten year rule is proven right again! No head of state can do a good job for longer than 10 years (give or take two depending on other factors). After that time they become too.... insulated and/or alienated from the public they're meant to serve.

Show me a non-figurehead head of state in office longer than 10 years straight and I'll show you a crook or a bumbler or psychopath....

No exceptions.
Novichok 3 | 7,883
1 day ago #82
Memo to PF military experts...

Please place limits on:

1. Dead Ukrainians
2. US "contribution"
3. Polish "contribution"

...or should this war continue until the last Ukrainian and the last dollar...

Don't forget that we still don't know how to print people.
Alien 20 | 5,227
1 day ago #83
until the last Ukrainian

To the last russian on Ukrainian soil, I think this is what Ukrainians are fighting for.
mafketis 37 | 10,916
1 day ago #84
To the last russian on Ukrainian soil

Dont' answer him. He's a narcissist who doesn't even necessarily believe what he writes... he just craves attention. Don't give it to him.
Novichok 3 | 7,883
1 day ago #85
Dont' answer him

...because numbers and poetry don't go together very well. It's hard to bullshit with numbers. It's easy to talk shyt when sprinkled with metaphors and adjectives...

So go ahead, little boys, have fun sending others to die for "freedom and democracy"...A keyboard is a very powerful weapon...

What a bunch of repulsive morons...
gumishu 15 | 6,271
1 day ago #86
What a bunch of repulsive morons...

until recently Ukrainians were more often than not willing to fight for their independence - but it's true indeed that many now are trying to avoid conscription - I may be cynical thinking that Ukrainians are fighting a war that could spare Poland a war if Russians are stopped there - and American leadership may well consider this war part of the power game with China - however I'm all for ending this war as soon as possible even it means Ukraine ceding most of the land that Russians occupy now (with some military guarantees to Ukraine from the West including Poland if not an offer of NATO membership for Ukraine) - the thing is Ukrainians have to want it too, and don't forget about the Russians
Alien 20 | 5,227
1 day ago #87
She was a Communist sympathiser and ruined Germany

What?
mafketis 37 | 10,916
1 day ago #88
when russians tell you who they are... believe them.

propaganda tool Sergei Mardan said: "Russia is a military empire, it always expends and subjugates her neighbours" adding that China is a neighbor that needs to be subjugated...

Little did he realize his comments were heard by Chinese who then translated it and put it on weibo (chinese social media platform)

x.com/sumlenny/status/1800429117051191663
Alien 20 | 5,227
1 day ago #89
Dont' answer him

But he likes to answer me, that's what this forum is for.
mafketis 37 | 10,916
1 day ago #90
But he likes to answer me

He'll engage with anyone who shows him some attention....


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