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Poland`s aid to Ukraine if Russia invades - part 9


jon357 74 | 21,939
16 Jan 2024 #31
I just wonder that the rest of Europe, even Germany, stopped all this game of thrones invasion stuff decades ago yet russia is still behaving as if it's 1750. Surely the land of Tolstoy and Borodin can do better than that.

If they were doing it in, say, the russian far east or Central Asia it wouldn't be so personal. When people very close to you either lose their lives or become weeping widows, geopolitics ceases to be as abstract.
mafketis 36 | 10,864
16 Jan 2024 #33
wonder that the rest of Europe, even Germany, stopped .... yet russia is still behaving as if it's 175

The theory (not one I came up with but it does seem to have some explanatory power) is that the mongols retarded russian development and by the time they were gone russia was about 300 years behind Europe in terms of socio-cultural development.

Despite massive efforts to modernize (often involving killing large swathes of the population) they've only made up about half of that so far so they're still stuck in 19th century ideas of imperial expansion and have no idea just how unimportant that is in the modern world.....
Bratwurst Boy 11 | 11,844
16 Jan 2024 #34
....I have another one (theory) and that has nothing to do with culture or mentality:

Russia still has never gotten over Stalin in the first place! "The victor will always be the judge", a fact! So Russia never has truly gone through the painful process to really re-process it's history, it's failings and what that meant for country and society (and its neighbours). Never in a way a loser has to!

Even today Stalin's empire looms as some ideal over everything....there was a short time after the fall of the Iron Curtain and the official end of the Sovietunion, but that got lost very soon, as this time of often brutal change was perceived to horrible for many.

And I don't blame the Russians for that....Germans probably wouldn't had done either if they hadn't lost. It seems you have to lose big first before the voices for change become loud enough....which in itself is only human.
jon357 74 | 21,939
16 Jan 2024 #35
the mongols retarded russian development and by the time they were gone

I was listening to Prince Igor at the weekend and that moved me to read about some of the Turkic tribes they were in conflict with. Interesting how geopolitics might have differed now if the Turk/Mongol Khanates has won rather than russia.

I'd also read quite a good book about the Crimean War and there are so many parallels with today's invasion. It's as if they never learn.
Torq 5 | 667
16 Jan 2024 #36
russians just take it

Up to a certain point when they no longer do.

there is no way to love liberty and russian 'culture' at the same time

... and yet here I am. And yet there are whole circles of Poles, a really wide spectrum from left to right e.g.: Myśl Polska, Konfederacja, Bezpieczna Polska, considerable parts of PSL and Lewica, Polski Ruch Antywojenny, Pro Fide Rege et Lege, Formacja Front, Rodacy Kamraci or hooligans of many football clubs - people whose views and political alignments couldn't be more different from one another, who still don't see any fundamental contradiction between their Polish patriotism and decisively or moderately pro-Russian stance. Go figure.
amiga500 4 | 1,542
16 Jan 2024 #37
When people very close to you either lose their lives or become weeping widows, geopolitics ceases to be as abstract.

yep. 100 percent agree. but how far you wanna go back? let's just blame khrushchev who gifted crimea to autonomous republic of Ukraine without even Politburo or Supreme Soviet of the Soviet Union approval.
Velund 1 | 582
16 Jan 2024 #38
I am merely sick and tired




Torq 5 | 667
16 Jan 2024 #39
@Velund

:)

*rolls eyes*
mafketis 36 | 10,864
16 Jan 2024 #40
khrushchev who gifted crimea to autonomous republic of Ukraine without

There were good reasons for that including the water supply and a policy of trying to increase agricultural production (Ukrainians are, on the whole, better farmers than russians).
Velund 1 | 582
16 Jan 2024 #41
Ukrainians are, on the whole, better farmers than russians

And Russians is better farmers than Yakuts...

And Yakuts is better farmers than polar bears on Northern Ocean ice.

Ukraine by their climate and soils (now mostly sold to BlackSh&t, not for long, though) is better for agriculture as most of territory of Russia.
Ironside 53 | 12,493
16 Jan 2024 #42
pro-Russian stance.

what is the pro-Russian stance? Konfedracja doesn't have such a stance. It has a pro-Polish stance.
----

Up to a certain point when they no longer do.

Russia has only one way of running a country - centralization. They won't understand anything else. If you think about it that system hasn't changed that much from the system the Mongol Empire introduced.

The only way for change would be the destruction of what it is today. A total breakdown of the Russian state and building it up from scratch.

Expectations that somehow all those 'liberal' nice-sounding Russians will make that change is a pipe dream.
If they are liberal they won't get enough support in Russia and if they are not they will do what is feasible in given circumstances and that means they will do what other Russian rules were doing before them as Russians are used to it.

---

who still don't see any fundamental contradiction between their Polish patriotism and decisively or moderately pro-Russian stance. Go figure.

Hmn... I don't see it! In what way that would be feasible for Poland?
Russia has no serious offer for Poland and never had. One of the problems is that don't understand compromise or self-restraint. They are much like J Kaczynski and his party-building ways.

The closest they came to understanding somewhat those concepts or rather applying them in practice was when they were in the Soviet Union phase.
I'm afraid you are much delusional like many people before you.
Look at all those 'white' Russian 'liberals' after WWI, they were against Blishevics, even fought against them but ultimately most of them decided to support them. They saw a monarchy as the root of evil but ultimately created something that was 100 times more evil than even the worst Tsar in modern times.

Torq cold shower for you twice a day and some reading daily a few pages from St. Augustin ether from the City of God or the Confessions.

If that doesn't work try - Архипелаг ГУЛАГ by Александр Исаевич Солженицын.
Ironside 53 | 12,493
16 Jan 2024 #43
.Germans probably

First of all, tell us what is going on in Germany now. Don't be nasty BB.
---
Second of all Germans as a nation are like a psychopath. They have some brilliant ideas but they have a lot of terrible ideas and what is worse they pursue those ideas once they decide they wnat to pursue them without sober evaluation like obsessive maniacs.

Never stopped to ask if that was a good thing or a feasible thing, no- a decision had been made so we pursued it till the end. But can you see that wall ahead? Oh shut up! Full speed ahead! I wouldn't call that sane!

Of course, it is a simplification but still...
Velund 1 | 582
16 Jan 2024 #44
A total breakdown of the Russian state

How many spare White Houses you have?
Bratwurst Boy 11 | 11,844
16 Jan 2024 #45
Of course, it is a simplification but still...

...what I always wonder, where do you put the opposition in your "the Germans"?

On the other hand if there would be all of one mind Germany probably wouldn't right now look as it does....it would function definitely better!
Ironside 53 | 12,493
16 Jan 2024 #46
How many spare White Houses you have?

You have nothing else but this. A real Russian poverty.
----

what I always wonder, where do you put the opposition in your "the Germans"?

I would think that you know how generalization works. I guess you don't like my take but you do not argue to the contrary, for the lack of arguments.

Also, I take this opportunity to implore you to shed some light on what is going on in Germany with all those farmers protesting. Is that insane 'green' policy perused by the German state hand in hand with big firms producing 'green' junk finally coming to its inevitable conclusion? BUST!?
Bratwurst Boy 11 | 11,844
16 Jan 2024 #47
I guess you don't like my take but you do not argue to the contrary, for the lack of arguments.

A lack of arguments against what? That my people is psychotic???

That is no base for a real discussion, sorry....
PolAmKrakow 2 | 1,024
16 Jan 2024 #48
Dont look now, but Trump not only won the Idaho republican caucus, but he got 51% of the vote. No republican has ever gotten 50% of the vote before. Interesting news out of the exit polls too. Almost 75% of the people believe Biden is using the prosecution power to politically influence the election. When the people dont trust the government, the government will be changed. Along with that info, Trump once again said he will end the Ukraine and Israel wars quickly.

Meanwhile Z is in Switzerland sucking WEF c0cks of the globalist socialist elites asking for more money. And Russia declared a state of emergency over one of their cities due to a Ukraine drone attack. This is probably Ukraines best and at the same time possibly worst strategy. While scaring some Russian civilians, killing and wounding them, it is likely going to make them support little Vlad that much more. Couldnt those resources be better used on actual targets on the front lines and in Crimea? A lot of this "strategy" being used by Ukraine makes little sense in the big picture.
Torq 5 | 667
16 Jan 2024 #49
Torq cold shower for you twice a day and some reading daily a few pages from St. Augustin ether from the City of God or the Confessions.

Cold showers are healthy for the body - I already take them, but thanks for the advice.
St. Augustine is healthy for the soul - I already read him, but thanks for the advice.

Russia has no serious offer for Poland and never had.

Poland has never been seriously open for any such offers, has she?

And anyways, my recent posts weren't about alliances or political offers; they were about common human decency. Anything else is pretty much secondary for me at the moment. It's just a small internet board - we are not politicians, we don't have any power to decide anything. We can, however, be a bit more gentle and civil.

That my people is psychotic???

Iron is another man of strong opinions who uses strong language to express them. I kinda envy him. With passing time I find myself a man of ever weaker opinions.
Ironside 53 | 12,493
16 Jan 2024 #50
That my people are psychotic???

I didn't say it. I guess some of the subtlety of the English language goes over your head. I said that the way Germans act as a nation reminds me a lot of the way a psychopath would act. I would say that is a crucial difference from what you understood.
Bratwurst Boy 11 | 11,844
16 Jan 2024 #51
....that must be it!

BUST!?

I would say so....green topics don't win any elections here anymore....especially in East Germany....but the newest surveys are just embarrassing for the current mainly left/green (SPD, the GREENS, FDP) gov in the whole of Germany...never has a gov been more unpopular, never has a chancellor (SPD) been more despised....but we have to go two more years....the horror!

Iron is another man of strong opinions

....and we love him for it! :)
Velund 1 | 582
16 Jan 2024 #52
Meanwhile in the real world...

The school program of Belarusians will include training in interrogation of English-speaking prisoners, as well as identification of insignia of the American and British military.

The optional course for high school students is called "military translation" and is designed for 69 hours for 10th and 11th grades.

Pupils will be able to "use the acquired knowledge (the optional course is approved by the Ministry of Education of the Republic of Belarus) in various situations of foreign language communication, extract information from the text on military topics, read the content of military documents and convey their essence in Russian, translate military and military-technical texts from English into Russian, carry out bilateral translation of a conversation or interrogation of a prisoner of war, as well as determine the insignia of the American and British military, their belonging to ranks and categories," reports @Sputnikby.

t.me/sputniklive/74391
OP Crnogorac3 4 | 820
16 Jan 2024 #53
Coach Red Pill was Murdered by the US Government

dailystormer.in/coach-red-pill-was-murdered-by-the-us-government/
OP Crnogorac3 4 | 820
16 Jan 2024 #54
Coach Red Pill Finally Dies in the Ukraine

dailystormer.in/coach-red-pill-finally-dies-in-the-ukraine/

Sad to hear about Gonzalo Lira. The State Department could have interceded for his release, despite many requests to do so from his father and others. But he was an "enemy of the state" of both jewSA and jewkraine, so they let him die. 😡
jon357 74 | 21,939
16 Jan 2024 #55
I would say so....green topics don't win any elections here anymore....especially in East Germany

We're the same in the U.K., especially the industrial north.

They want us all to have heat exchangers rather than boilers; a daft idea in a country where a lot of the houses are over 100 years old and which has a cold and wet maritime climate,

Looking at the news, it seems Russia's not having a great week.

@Bratwurst Boy
Many people say that Putin is behind much of what's going on in Palestine/Israel and also the current Houthi trouble. My feeling is that he probably is. Are people in Germany saying the same thing?
Bratwurst Boy 11 | 11,844
16 Jan 2024 #56
.....sure....but those who do are losing steadily votes and sympathy to the opposition, so it could also be a case of a blame-game...

Seriously, should Putin really be THAT powerful and influential??? It's hard to believe...I guess if he were THAT kind of a puppeteer he would already reside in Kiew!
mafketis 36 | 10,864
16 Jan 2024 #57
A lot of this "strategy" being used by Ukraine

Who knows russia better, you or Ukraine?

Putin is behind much of what's going on in Palestine/Israel and also the current Houthi troubl

the oct 7 attacks had wagner written all over them (after which the palestinians reverted to their clueless lack of tactics) and the houthis are funded by Iran (russian ally).

Do the math
Ironside 53 | 12,493
16 Jan 2024 #58
Poland has never been seriously open for any such offers, has she?

Look, are you serious? What kind of argument is that? Why would we voluntarily join the Russian Federation? As that is the only offer that would be accepted and honored.

---

Green topics don't win any elections here anymore...

Green policies do nothing for the people, just make the cost of living skyrocketing, it is good for some fat cats to get even richer - but that's about it.

and convey their essence in Russian

why would Belarusians in Belarus speak Russian? That silly.
Ironside 53 | 12,493
16 Jan 2024 #59
Meanwhile in the real world...

Can you afford to eat eggs for breakfast, every day?
gumishu 13 | 6,134
16 Jan 2024 #60
why would Belarusians in Belarus speak Russian? That silly.

most people in Belarus speak Russian instead of Belarussian


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