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Mieszkania Plus programme - PiS fulfills yet another campaign promise


Polonius3 1,000 | 12,448
3 Jun 2016  #1
The PiS government have launched their Mieszkania Plus programme, fulfilling yet another campaign promise. It will get under way in 2017 starting with major metropolitan areas where inexpensive rental housing will be built on unused state-owned land. Rent should be about half the normal market price. But after 20 or 30 years of regular rent payment the flat can become the family's property. Families with children will be at the top of the waitng list for such flats, so in effect this programme nicely complements Rodzina 500+. So while the vicious, frustrated oppositon can only chant, rant and snitch, PiS are doing their job and fulfilling the commitments they made to the Polish nation.
jon357 63 | 14,122
3 Jun 2016  #2
t will get under way in 2017

So in fact not fullfilled. Judging by their disastrous attempts before I think we know how this will turn out.
Harry
3 Jun 2016  #3
So in fact not fullfilled.

Not fulfilled and not funded, so typical PIS election bribes then.

Families with children will be at the top of the waitng list for such flats

Are families where both parents are loyal Party members at the very top of the list?
delphiandomine 83 | 17,625
3 Jun 2016  #4
Are families where both parents are loyal Party members at the very top of the list?

But of course. Like in the PRL, Party membership will come with the ability to be mysteriously placed at the top of the list.

It will get under way in 2017 starting with major metropolitan areas where inexpensive rental housing will be built on unused state-owned land.

Except there's one slight problem : the plan relies on investments from private sources. We'll see what happens.
Sparks11 - | 335
3 Jun 2016  #5
Could this cause another credit-rating downgrade?
delphiandomine 83 | 17,625
3 Jun 2016  #6
Unlikely, because they won't build if there's no money to build them. They've made it clear that the programme is budget-neutral, meaning that the plan is to mortgage the future rent payments to pay for the building of the apartments.

Of course, what people's expectations are (nice flats in nice locations) vs reality (PRL-esque blocks) is also interesting.
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,448
3 Jun 2016  #7
loyal Party

More Hairy Bollocks! Ugggh! Barf!

disastrous attempts

Disastrous attempts were the closure of half of Poland's police stations, the purchase of costly military gear allowed to rust away for lack of proper ammunition, and the heist in broad daylight of 150 billion zł of people's retirement funds. Ostensibly that was to shore up the PO's cash-strapped state budget, but knowing what made that scamster regime tick it is not inconceivable that a lot went to feather the nests of loyal Platformer operatives and other reps of th post-Magdalenka mafia. Somehow the Rzepliński clique did not intervene or even take notice.
Ziemowit 12 | 3,470
3 Jun 2016  #8
Hairy

I believe this is a collective name for a certain group of posters who deny all the prospective good that may arise from deeds attempted by PiS to fullfil their electorate promises.

Ugggh! Barf!

I believe this reflects your outrage at the behaviour of the aforementioned group. If this is the case, I believe you will be exempted from charges of 'passive aggression' or being a 'devil's advocate'.
jon357 63 | 14,122
3 Jun 2016  #9
They've made it clear that the programme is budget-neutral, meaning that the plan is to mortgage the future rent payments to pay for the building of the apartments.

Sounds like a Ponzi scheme and ultimately this looks like another mess; if it starts at all...
Harry
3 Jun 2016  #10
Unlikely, because they won't build if there's no money to build them.

Yes, but it's entirely possible that once it becomes clear that the private sector has no interest in this at all that state-controlled companies such as PZU and PKO will be told to get involved, with predictable results.
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,448
3 Jun 2016  #11
collective name for a certain group of posters

Indeed, when soemone cannot say anything good nor find a single redeeming element of someone else's behaviour, we're dealing with a horse-blinkered fool and "Hairy Bollocks" is as good a descriptive as any. Even Hitler gave the world the VWs and the Autobahn to drive them on.

In my view, PiS are doing a fiarly decent job so far, but I don't like the idea of giving all MPs a 2000 rise. And I do not rule out that as many politicians really settled in there won't be those succumbing to Platformesque skim & scam temptations. Takie jest życie.
delphiandomine 83 | 17,625
3 Jun 2016  #12
Yes, but it's entirely possible that once it becomes clear that the private sector has no interest in this at all that state-controlled companies such as PZU and PKO will be told to get involved, with predictable results.

Exactly, or worse still, the government will guarantee the debts. Part of the plan apparently allows people to simply stop paying rent, with payments simply coming from the money that they've already paid.
Dougpol1 30 | 2,935
3 Jun 2016  #13
I lived in a Katowice version of Dougpol Towers when I first came here. A few years ago, when it was worth 250 thousand zl, the old PIS mob had a similar scheme.

My physiotherapist wasn't very well paid, poor chap, and had 2 young daughters. His wife also was a physio.

The government awarded them a flat - identical in every shape and form, and of course size, to mine.

The price? 7,500 zl.

So don't achieve too much and PIS might just reward you.
It's called socialism folks - and although Blair 1997 was a Godsend to the UK, Poland can't afford handouts. Study, get qualified, and there will be plenty for everyone in the future market economy of Poland - but not with populist hand-out schemes, that are not properly budgeted, ruling the roost.

If the government really want to act to solve the housing situation, the first thing to do would be to dismantle the old Housing Committees, the spoldzielnie, but they will never do that because they are jobs for the boys, for life:(

I don't like the idea of giving all MPs a 2000 rise

A 2000 zl rise? Derisory. They should get more than that - IF they are performing, but some seem hell bent on self-promotion
smurf 39 | 1,982
3 Jun 2016  #14
So in fact not fullfilled

Indeed

Y'know though, if it works then fair play to them.
Maybe something good will come of this incompetent government.
The 500+ is a great thing, if you have 2 kids, it's a bit stupid thougth that the likes of a family with 2 parent Doctors with 2 kids get the 500, but a single mother struggling in some sh!thole hovel in Bytom gets nothing, but hopefully that'll change over the coming years.
Dougpol1 30 | 2,935
3 Jun 2016  #15
But Smurf it is not a good thing. Remove any requirement for a family and 2 kids under 21 to pay any tax under a sensible threshold, say 25,000 zl a year, as Blair did (with adjustment for different GDP) - and there you have it.

Instead, you can earn peanuts here and still pay taxes, as Adrian, if he were still here, would gleefully remind me. And with this 500 + you still have the inequality, and the percentage who are drunks, who will steal from their children. Just terrible.
smurf 39 | 1,982
3 Jun 2016  #16
Remove any requirement for a family and 2 kids under 21 to pay any tax under a sensible threshold, say 25,000 zl a year, as Blair did (with adjustment for different GDP) - and there you have it.

that's a better idea, still though back at home we'd a similar 500+ thing, that money was put into a savings account until I was 18 and it was mine.

I'm sure loads of people are doing the same here, which is a good thing

And with this 500 + you still have the inequality, and the percentage who are drunks, who will steal from their children. Just terrible.

I agree, but it's better than nothing y'know. All other EU countries have a child benefit program, so it was about time PL did the same.

It's not the best system, but it's the first one for Poland, hopefully when this shower of clowns are long gone it'll imrpove over the coming years
delphiandomine 83 | 17,625
3 Jun 2016  #17
and the percentage who are drunks, who will steal from their children. Just terrible.

They've already reported that social services here have encountered situations where the people got their 500zł and immediately spent it on some booze up - the kids got nothing. Entirely predictable, and it was completely irresponsible to let people spend the money freely.

it's a bit stupid thougth that the likes of a family with 2 parent Doctors with 2 kids get the 500, but a single mother struggling in some sh!thole hovel in Bytom gets nothing

It's even worse than you first think. If the woman is getting (in theory) 1000zł a month in wages and 300zł a month child maintenance, she gets nothing - even if the father isn't actually paying up.
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,448
3 Jun 2016  #18
Nice job of work! Keep on nitpicking and fault finding which you somehow never applied to the really awful scamster Tusk regime. The Tusk family, local PO operatives, the mayor of Gdańsk and the Ambergold schemers were all part of one big Baltic mafia. Where were the TK? Where were you when their hand-washes-hand coterie were robbing the country blind?
Dougpol1 30 | 2,935
3 Jun 2016  #19
Where were you

Contributing. And I don't like socialism. There's only one sure-fire way to obtain money and that is to work for it.
gumishu 11 | 5,012
3 Jun 2016  #20
. There's only one sure-fire way to obtain money and that is to work for it.

well there are people who don't think that way and they have extracted over 80 billion PLN in undue VAT refunds from the sate last year

or maybe you think they worked for all that money, do you?
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,448
3 Jun 2016  #21
Contributing

So you prefer gangster caetels and coteries in the Tusk manner? I guess even hitmen "work" for a living in a manner of speaking.
Dougpol1 30 | 2,935
3 Jun 2016  #22
Tusk

Pol - I take a great interest in Polish politics. Until the restaurant tapes et al the biggest Tusk scandal in 8 years was when he promised uninsured people living in beautiful houses by the then flooded Wisla that they would get help from the taxpayer in the form of a 10,000 zl handout.

I would quite like to live in a nice house with a river view myself, but wouldn't expect a handout if I was too stupid to insure..

Apart from that populist nonsense, I never,ever heard anything of supposed Tusk shenanighans. In fact, from month to month we never heard anything of note. The government was busy governing, leaving the rest of us to get on with what we were doing.

On the other hand, malpractice follows PIS around like a rabid dog.
gumishu 11 | 5,012
3 Jun 2016  #23
The government was busy governing

hmm you never heard of the PO scandals and affairs - interesting

btw I am not sure what the government was doing if it allowed for billions of zlotys to be snapped away from the state by VAT scammers - for years

80 billion zlotys is around 1/5 of the Polish budget
Dougpol1 30 | 2,935
3 Jun 2016  #24
VAT scammers

Well - shall we take person A. He needs a new laptop. Person B has a VAT registered company, and doesn't need a new laptop,. Person A buys it from B and saves 22 percent. The government still gets in on the deal, so that's how it goes, and why person B is never checked to see if he is possession of said laptop:)

All this is nothing to do with the price of fish (the real world)
gumishu 11 | 5,012
3 Jun 2016  #25
sorry it does not explain 80 billion PLN extracted from the state - I think you haven't got a faintest idea how real and dangerous scammers operate
delphiandomine 83 | 17,625
3 Jun 2016  #26
btw I am not sure what the government was doing if it allowed for billions of zlotys to be snapped away from the state by VAT scammers - for years

That number that you're quoting seems to change according to the source. It was claimed at nearly 50 billion, now you're saying 80 billon - the real number expected by the Ministry of Finance when they 'seal' the VAT system (which was planned by PO and is merely only being finished off by PiS) is about 15 billion.

VAT is a very badly implemented tax on the European level - all because stupid Europeans couldn't agree on a single pan-European rate. A lot of complexity and nonsense would be solved if there was a single VAT rate (say 20%) and a single EU tax office to collect it. Every single country has huge problems with VAT because the implemention of it is absolutely idiotic.
gumishu 11 | 5,012
3 Jun 2016  #27
That number that you're quoting seems to change according to the source. It was claimed at nearly 50 billion, now you're saying 80 billon

rmf24.pl/ekonomia/news-rzeczpospolita-morze-fikcyjnych-faktur-oszusci-wyludzili-82-,nId,2147153
delphiandomine 83 | 17,625
3 Jun 2016  #28
Seen it, but the changes that will come into force in July will only bring 15 billion in revenue according to the forecasts.

It is exactly why the EU VAT system is completely broken though. One rate, one tax office, job done.
gumishu 11 | 5,012
3 Jun 2016  #29
Seen it, but the changes that will come into force in July will only bring 15 billion in revenue according to the forecasts.

I believe it is just a first step - there will be more savings to the budget when restrictive law is enforced calling for taking over of all possessions of the scammers - I believe PiS wait for having control over the Constitutional tribunal to pass such laws - it's not that long only half a year to go
OP Polonius3 1,000 | 12,448
4 Jun 2016  #30
I never,ever heard anything of supposed Tusk shenanighans

One can agree with that...only a fraction of those shady goings-on ever saw the light of day, PO were good at covering their tracks. But a tax inspector I spoke with recently told me the inspectors of the Urząd Skarbowy were bereft of any power to deal with high-level financial abuses. On orders from above (during the PO years) probes were dropped and the biggies belonging to the "arrangement", when caught red-handed and reproted by the media, were allowed to repay debts or unpaid taxes without any interest. In similar situations the little guy got hounded down to the last grosz. One has to hand it to the Platformers, they were slick, glib, slippery and very good at PR. PiS on the other hand are committed, determined and sincere but rather clumsy in the PR and image-building department.


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