GERMANS WANT TO GERMANIZE KOPERNIK (COPERNICUS)! OUTRAGE!

As it happens Lyzko, she chose marrying her husband over being Polish. It wasn't what she did to please her husband, it's what she did because she wanted him to be her husband.

You also overlook the fact that being born in Poland does not make a person Polish.

Maybe by your standards Harry, but bare in mind that the majority of the forum will disagree with you on this one ;)

No, goofy, by the standards of Poland. I'll trust the word of the state of Poland as to who is and is not Polish, you clearly think you know better than Poland does.

I clearly know better than a Brit in his 60s who doesn even speak in Polish mate, I was born in Poland, I am polish you are not thats the difference ;)

You are a Pole if your parent/s are Polish, if you were born in Poland, and if you want to be Polish, Chopin or Copernicus are all of the following so how about you be quiet since you have literally no idea what you are talking about.

Goofy, read Polish citizenship law: being born here doesn't even give the right to live here, let alone the right to be Polish. Jus sanguinis applies here, not jus solo.

Oh, and neither of Chopin's parents were Polish. Copernicus might have had a Polish father but we don't really know.

I am not talking of citizenship here, I am talking about being a Pole, if you think that being one is justa piece of paper than we dont have anything to discuss.

Goofy, Polish people have Polish citizenship. Otherwise they're Polish-American or Polish-British or Polish-Australian. The Polish passport is proof a person is Polish, that's why my home gives them out.

;)
instead of trolling you'd better go to sleep old man, its past your bed time already :D
on a serious note, as I said citizenship can be revoked, passport can be destroyed, theres a difference between being a citizen of Poland.. and having this nationality. You are British national of a Polish citizenship these terms are not mutually exclusive. I am a polish national and a holder of a Polish passport, I do not have a British citizenship for an example.

Papers dont matter, what matters is who you are, you are Brit, I am a Pole, I know that a senile brain may find it hard to understand but thats the honest truth.

Again you showed us your lack of knowledge. Chopin's mother was Tekla Justyna Krzyżanowska.


Zgadzam się z Tobą. Having a citizenship doesn't make one a true Polish.

Don't worry goofy, I don't have to get up tomorrow for school, my first meeting is at eleven.

You might want to find time to read the constitution of Poland: it is crystal clear that the Polish state cannot revoke anybody's citizenship. And of course damaged passports can be replaced.

You may be Polish, but your knowledge of Poland is shockingly bad. Chopin knew lots about Poland and he wasn't even a Polish citizen and didn't have Polish parents.

Haylel: she had a Polish name but stopped being Polish when she married a Frenchman, then she became Polish-French.

@Harry,

Poland then is similar to Germany in this respect vs. the US, where by being born in America, one is automatically an American!

Yes, Lyzko, that's exactly right. There's a kid who lives near me (my Mrs taught his aunt) who was born in Poland and has never left Poland. Both his parents were born in Poland and have never left. All his grandparents were born in Poland. That kid doesn't qualify for a Polish passport.

Rubbish. If I married a German, I wouldn't stop being Polish and wouldn't change into Polish-German.

I am pretty sure that your stupidity would offend even Chopin himself.

Haylel, if you speak about today, you're correct. But back then a woman lost her citizenship and became that of her husband. She chose to be French.

Yeah, certainly.
She chose to be French yet she kept living legally in Poland with her French husband (who fought alongside Poles in Insurekcja Kościuszkowska) and children and preserved Polish traditions at home.

Harry, you know it better than Polish historians. You know it better than all of the Polish people.

You want to prove so badly that having a citizenship makes one a true Polish (for example) that it makes me sick.

You cannot choose to be French, you are born French, citizenship is bollocks, having a Polish citizenship does not make you a Polish national, in a way that you change your nationality...

Obywatel polski, narodowosci Brytyjskiej, do you get it???
Polish citizen of the British nationality..

Nope. Women has very little choices at that time or rights under the law. Europe had to wait for liberal democracy until that happened.


I'll quote you on that.


Actually it does, however Copernicus was neither since neither the concepts of citizenship nor nationality existed in that time and place. Loyalties were different then. You're trying to impose later values and concepts to an earlier time.


No such legal category.

A black female acquaintance of mine stopped being black when she married a white man..................oh wait......
Seems like Harry still likes to twist himself into a pretzel.

Interesting how some people question Kopernik`s Polish ethnicity, considering him to be German, when we all know, very well, that one can write relevant scientific elaboration on the fact that are most of Eastern Germans and Germans in general of Slavic origin. Originally Slavs that were forcible germanized or/and with time assimilated in the process. So, what is this about Kopernik being German? Wasn`t it enough that back in past alive Slavs were lured into germanization? Is it necessary that in our time, some people, feel necessity to germanize even long dead Slavs. See, i am terrified how things develop in EU.

I could read that some Polish people write that Copernicus has fought against the Germans and so that he was a Polish man. This is completely wrong. It was at this time not to nationality, but religion. German Catholics fought together with Polish Catholics against German Protestants. And Polish Protestants have fought together with German Protestants against Polish Catholics. In the area of today's Germany there was the time of the Reformation with great religious wars. German fought against Germans, but they ware still German and not Polish, right? On the Polish territory it was exactly the same situation: The most important was religion and not if somebody was German or Polish. Polish catholics hated also Polish Protestants very much, please do not forget this, so they went to Prussia or other german areas.

The fact is that Copernicus had mainly (but not 100%) a German family background and that he spoke German, there is no doubt about this. We even do not know how good his Polish langage was because the most impotant language at that time was Latin, the church and scientifc language. But he lived on Catholic Polish territory (near the Protestant Prussia). That does not make him a Polish man. Example: if a Polish man live in Germany, it does not mean that he is a German, even if he work 50 yeras in Germany. Otherwise Germany would be full of Polish Germans now, hahahaha

At that time there were no German/Polish people, as we know it today. Germany and Poland had completly different borders and an other Mentality as today. Times were very different, and the people were much more distributed and intermarried, so it did not matter where someone descended. Many people had german and polish (and jewish) familiy members, that was normal at that time and this is the reason of the surname-mix of many persons.

Nationalism ruins everything! Copernicus is dead and why should we argue and have hatred? He never wanted that Polish and German people are fighting about his bones and books.

Why are we talking about nationality in the past? Let us live in peace. Copernicus was a European and a scientist, all of us benefit, Polish, German and English people. Let us live in peace and not in nationalism, please.

Dude check your notebook you are writing an utter tosh.

Quite, Ironside! Obviously, Butterfly 5 has either been mixing his drinks some, or remains blessedly ignorant of historical fact:-)

See, everything against Poland is possible within EU.

Kopernik belongs to Poland and Gottfried Leibnitz (had polish roots and considered himself Slav) belongs to Poland and Friedrich Nietzsche belongs to Poland (considered
himself Pole)

About Copernicus the jury is very much out. Hard to see how Nietzsche etc 'belong' somewhere simply because they had some (and in Nietzsche' case only some) roots in a different country.

wikitree.com/genealogy/Nietzsche-Family-Tree-5

Nietzsche hatte keine polnischen Wurzeln, das ist ein Mythos, den Nietzsche zwar selbst in die Welt setzte, den aber auf der Welt niemand mehr glaubt, außer in Polen... only English please

Nietzsche didnt have any polish roots, as all his biographers, not only german, but also british, italian and so on, know. see the english wikipedia-page.

His polish roots are a myth he introduced by himself, but is nevertheless understood as pure myth all over the world, except in Poland.
Leibnitz didnt have any polish roots, he just once in his life pretended to be a polish nobleman because he wanted to become the german candidate for the polish crown.

Kopernikus on the other hand was of course at least half german, because of his mother. Additionally, he seems to have grown up in a german city and spoken german as mothertongue.