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Where is 'the first contact with the ground' of the Polish Airforce One


TIT 5 | 211
13 Apr 2010 #1
as you can see, the place where Tu 154 had 'the first contact with the ground' is down below main road. It was an airport aerial.

why they flew so low?
convex 20 | 3,978
13 Apr 2010 #2
Either they were following the radar altimeter and got caught by the slope, or they they mixed up QFE and QNH and ignored the GPWS.
OP TIT 5 | 211
13 Apr 2010 #3
the finest pilots? messing around with the systems???
Wroclaw 44 | 5,384
13 Apr 2010 #4
i know the plane flipped, but it looks like they were heading for a taxiway.

It was an airport aerial.

mast, possibly. VHF aerial i doubt.
OP TIT 5 | 211
13 Apr 2010 #5
if you hit something then you probably have no chance to keep direction
how low they were flying -10/15 meters?
WHY?
convex 20 | 3,978
13 Apr 2010 #6
the finest pilots? messing around with the systems???

Just confusion. It can get hectic up front. We'll see soon enough, but accidents happen. Even to the best of them.

mast, possibly. VHF aerial i doubt.

It would make sense, the NDBs in former soviet countries are usually lined up with the runway.
Wroclaw 44 | 5,384
13 Apr 2010 #7
It would make sense, the NDBs in former soviet countries are usually lined up with the runway.

is it possible the pilot got a false reading due to atmospherics and the fog ?

or is that just wishful thinking ?
convex 20 | 3,978
13 Apr 2010 #8
is it possible the pilot got a false reading due to atmospherics and the fog ?

QNH = height above sea level

QFE = height above point of measurement

So say Smolensk for instance. It's 720ft above sea level.

If the plane is on the ground, and the altimeter has the QNH pressure, it would read 720

If it is QFE it would read 0
OP TIT 5 | 211
13 Apr 2010 #9
QFE is just an ordinary measure in aircrafts, if you fly too low you will get a warning message
convex 20 | 3,978
13 Apr 2010 #10
GPWS would have alerted them. You would hear it on the CVR.

or they they mixed up QFE and QNH and ignored the GPWS.

OP TIT 5 | 211
13 Apr 2010 #11
or they they mixed up QFE and QNH and ignored the GPWS.

the finest pilots???
convex 20 | 3,978
13 Apr 2010 #12
Yea, we'll see when they release the CVR transcripts... I still think it might be get-there-itis.
Wroclaw 44 | 5,384
13 Apr 2010 #13
Convex,

My theory: the pilot was under pressure/stress to land on time. he misread his instruments. hitting the mast (if he did) makes no difference as all had gone wrong moments before. he had already ditched fuel on one of his circuits and gave himself no other chance.

lack of fire damage in photos makes me think he ditched fuel.

Result: pilot error... possibly relying on sight rather than instruments.
convex 20 | 3,978
13 Apr 2010 #14
the pilot was under pressure/stress to land on time. he misread his instruments. hitting the mast (if he did) makes no difference as all had gone wrong moments before. he had already ditched fuel on one of his circuits and gave himself no other chance.

GPWS would have alerted him that he was low. The plane isn't capable of dumping fuel.
OP TIT 5 | 211
13 Apr 2010 #15
he had already ditched fuel

not true
Wroclaw 44 | 5,384
13 Apr 2010 #16
GPWS would have alerted him that he was low. The plane isn't capable of dumping fuel.

OK.

Now i don't understand how he missed an audible warning. (had to check wiki)

i think i'll wait for the official report.

thanks for your explanations
convex 20 | 3,978
13 Apr 2010 #17
Now i don't understand how he missed an audible warning. (had to check wiki)

Yea, GPWS gives you the "woop woop, pull up" warning...

i think i'll wait for the official report.

One of the wisest things that have been said here :)


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