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Polish & other children legally stolen from their parents in Germany


Sokrates 8 | 3,346
13 Dec 2009 #31
Actually thats the bit that puzzles me, once upon a time i did some research and indeed they violate every right and law of non-German parents on the regular basis, in the end most such people like Erica Steinbach have links to Nazis when you dig deep enough but they did not, they're not linked to or representing any particularly nationalistic views so it seems your institution simply attracted an unusually high amount of nasty fvckers.

I replied to TheOther that they're nationalistic but thats my personal theory, i have no idea why they're doing that but its happening to all non-German parents including Western Europe, its done with violation of every possible German law and German courts if not outright encourage it are lenient towards it.
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,837
13 Dec 2009 #32
Hey...at least not something especially anti-polish about it, right? :)
TheOther 5 | 3,831
13 Dec 2009 #33
most probably because the lady was the mother and not because she was an American

What's the difference between the German Jugendamt and an American judge who decides against you because you are a foreigner? The latter is hard to prove, I admit, but I know two cases where a married American parent was living abroad, separated from the spouse, and just took off with the kids to the USA. Even though it was against the will of the children, the American judge decided that they have to stay with their mum.

Sokrates

What do you think would happen if a Polish mother takes her kids and runs back home, and her German ex takes her to a Polish court over the children? I'm pretty sure it's the same outcome as described above. Poland or other countries might not have this strange Jugendamt, but IMHO that doesn't mean that they treat foreign parents better than Germany.
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,837
13 Dec 2009 #34
Uh...now it get's difficult because I lack the english expressions.

But I know that Germany has agreements and treaties with several countries to support each other in such cases where children get "abducted" by one parent into another country.

It would be interesting to know if Poland has such a treaty with Germany too.

Poland or other countries might not have this strange Jugendamt, but IMHO that doesn't mean that they treat foreign parents better than Germany.

kidnapped2poland.org

This site is a support place for victimized parents affected by international parental child abduction to Poland.
The government of Poland has been a silent participant to this crime by not complying with the Hague Convention treaty laws. Statistics speak volume. Since 1995, the time when Poland signed the Hague Convention treaty, no American or Canadian child has returned to his/her home as a result of the actions by the Polish authorities.
On some occasions, desperate parents chose to use self-help to recover their abducted children. Poland is one of the top offenders of the Hague Convention treaty. It is time to change this horrific situation. We hope that you can help us in our struggle. To learn more about the reasons why ... exists

"nasty, nationalist fvckers" all of them!
TheOther 5 | 3,831
13 Dec 2009 #35
kidnapped2poland.org/

That link proves my point, BB.
time means 5 | 1,310
13 Dec 2009 #36
bringing her child home

Another "immaculate conception" or should that read their child?

More feminist clap trap from PFs resident "Mille Tant"
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,837
13 Dec 2009 #37
That link proves my point, BB.

Only short googling was needed....I really think most countries act the same in this regard and there is more to find.
The children are always the victims when parents fight, but bi-national ones suffer doubly!
TheOther 5 | 3,831
13 Dec 2009 #38
The children are always the victims when parents fight, but bi-national ones suffer doubly!

Very true!

I really think most countries act the same in this regard and there is more to find

That's why I find the kind of finger-pointing at Germany in this thread hypocritical and way over the top.
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,837
13 Dec 2009 #39
That's why I find the kind of finger-pointing at Germany in this thread way over the top.

It's a "Crow"-thread...Do I need to say more?
TheOther 5 | 3,831
13 Dec 2009 #40
Do I need to say more

No... ;)
Nika 2 | 507
13 Dec 2009 #41
That's why I find the kind of finger-pointing at Germany in this thread hypocritical and way over the top.

then why we've never heard that it's forbidden in the UK to talk to your kids in Polish, while it was widely commented in PL press that German Jugendamts forbid the Polish parents to speak Polish to their children???? Now that's over the top!!!!!
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,837
13 Dec 2009 #42
That might be the clue:

....PL press that German Jugendamts....

Polish press just loves Germany! ;)
...the same news in the UK is only half as interesting!
TheOther 5 | 3,831
13 Dec 2009 #43
while it was widely commented in PL press that German Jugendamts forbid the Polish parents to speak Polish to their children

Emphasis on 'PL press' - that says it all... ;)
And I seriously doubt that the Jugendamt could forbid someone to speak Polish to their children. How would you enforce that?

PS: What do you think about the link BB posted, by the way? None of our Polish friends here have responded to that yet.
Nika 2 | 507
13 Dec 2009 #44
Emphasis on 'PL press' - that says it all... ;)

and Sueddeutsche Zeitung as well - that's not PL is it?
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,837
13 Dec 2009 #45
A link?
I would really love to hear the other side in this curious story for once....
TheOther 5 | 3,831
13 Dec 2009 #46
Nika
Would you mind to answer my question? I'm curious as to what you say about the link BB posted.
Nika 2 | 507
13 Dec 2009 #47
You will find a lot of stories here:

jugendamt-wesel.com/CEED_eng.htm

take your time as will need a lot of it to through it!

Germany: Poles are the kidnappers of children

Germany found a simple explanation for the Jugendamt unlawful practices that prohibit children of Poles speak Polish with parents.

As we mentioned, the action of the German authorities for Children and Youth (Jugendamt) raises the parents indignation and the European institutions. The principle that a child taken from one of the parents (or both) spoke only German is a violation of human rights. But our Western neighbors do not care about the accusations.

Polish-German divorced couples in Germany are thousands. Child abduction occurred in a minority of cases, and yet all Poles are treated as potential criminals. Officials do not care that such rules deprives children of contact with the native language and actually lead to their Germanization.

pardon.pl/artykul/6923/niemcy_polacy_to_porywacze_dzieci

and this is for those who read Polish.
joepilsudski 26 | 1,389
13 Dec 2009 #48
How is this possible in modern time? Somebody can tell me?

I tell you how...Because this is an INTERNATIONAL syndicate behind this.

It can start at a local level...Certain judges and corrupt bureaucrats make rulings, children are passed into foster car or orphanages...There they can be exposed to either abusive 'foster parents' or shipped to orphanages were you have paedophile elements...Now, this is local level.

Are you not familiar with the Detroux case in Belgium where children where taken into paedophile rings, and imprisoned and murdered like animals?...The police there covered it all up because they were involved...And in the case of Mark Detroux, when the pressure became too much and the police were forced to arrest him, he was ALLOWED TO ESCAPE IN BROAD DAYLIGHT while being transported by police...There were protests of more than 100000 Belgians when all the dirt on this horror began to be exposed...Finally, some convictions were obtained...It was rumoured that certain 'big wig' NATO officials and other elite scum were involved, even implications that members of European 'royal houses' were part of the ring.

Now, we look at the case of Bosmia and Kosovo...Thre were human trafficking rings run out of these places, through NATO/UN bases...The US corporation DynCorp (Security company servicing US military) were heavily implicated...Along with various Balkan mafia elements, including Albanians, Serbs, Croats...DynCorp was never punished, although the case was publicized in the US...This ring involved mostly young women, but children also....DynCorp has also been implicated in human slavery rings in Iraq.

Finally we have Israel...Recently, a prominent Ukrainian scholar has stated that 20000 young Ukrainian children have been trafficked/diappeared by an Israeli ring, using some of the children for organ harvesting...Of course, we hear the outrage, cries of 'anti-semitism' from Israeli press, but no investigation, or even denial...Israel is also a hub for human slavery/prostituyion using victims from the Ukraine, Belarus, Moldova and Eastern Europe.

Peadophilia is rampant among certain 'connected' elements and political factions in Europe.

Why?...WHY???...WHY????

Because the perpetrators of this are the children of the devil.

And the children are the sons and daughters of the poor.

Luke 17: 2

"It were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he cast into the sea, than that he should offend one of these little ones."

Words of Jesus Christ

Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,837
13 Dec 2009 #49
You will find a lot of stories here:

No, I meant the "other side", something from the german media or better even from the Jugendamt or such...frankly I don't believe these headlines!

Not something what starts with:

The modern JUGENDAMT is a national-socialist-like state organisation.

....gimme a break!

The only thing I know for sure is that these kids were taken by the Jugendamt from their polish parents because they were unable to care for them properly.

That's one of the functions of the Jugendamt and they do this independently from the nationality of the family (and save alot of those poor little sods during their work).

The rest of the accusations sounds just fishy if you ask me....
TheOther 5 | 3,831
13 Dec 2009 #50
That's one of the functions of the Jugendamt

Exactly the same as the Department of Social Services in the USA. This whole thread paints reality in black and white - as always... :(
Nika 2 | 507
13 Dec 2009 #51
No, I meant the "other side", something from the german media or better even from the Jugendamt or such...frankly I don't believe these headlines!

you call it headlines???!!!! It's CEED - Conseil Européen des Enfants du Divorce / European Council for Parents, children and grandparents victims of international and administrative child abductions.

here is some headlines:

culturedviews.com/the-worst-excesses-of-the-thrid-reich-still-hold-place-in-germany-today/2009/06/05/view.htm

and here something for those who read French:

ceed-europa.eu/CEED/enlevement.htm
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,837
13 Dec 2009 #52
you call it headlines???!!!! It's CEED - Conseil Européen des Enfants du Divorce / European Council for Parents, children and grandparents victims of international and administrative child abductions.

Where do you think I get this headline from?

The modern JUGENDAMT is a national-socialist-like state organisation.

No, just a headline, nothing official...sorry.

They linked to that article:
michael-hickman.org/eng/eng_docs/hickman_jugendamt.html

Interesting case, isn't it?
Here it's about complaining that the Jugendamt DOES NOT help to take the children away from their mother!

They just can't do anything right, can't they....;)

Oh and what do you say to the accusations of polish misbehaviour in case of abducted children?

Here some link from the UK the polish press is not interested in (no Nazi headlines):
guardian.co.uk/world/2009/aug/09/children-abduction-kidnapping-uk-data
TheOther 5 | 3,831
13 Dec 2009 #53
Oh and what do you say to the accusations of polish misbehaviour in case of abducted children?

Give it up, BB, you won't get a answer. Because it's much more convenient to point ones finger at someone else than having a closer look at ones own backyard.
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,837
13 Dec 2009 #54
Oh I have nothing to give up! ;)

I'm just posting some links and infos for the really interested lurker who will visit this board in the future.
I don't have a missionary streak! :)
Nika 2 | 507
13 Dec 2009 #55
No, just a headline, nothing official...sorry.

it is on their official webiste and there are numerous publications on Jugendamt, among others:
- European Parliament working documents,
- Open Letter to Honorary Professor Dr . Hans-Gert Pöttering Member of the European Parliament,
- Open Letter to President Nicolas Sarkozy, Petition of 10 parents to the european Parliament,
- Note to the Euro commissioner Fratini,
- Invitation to a press conference to the topic : "The German Jugendamt, a child robbering administration?"

Is it official enough for you BB or do you still maintain that it's only headlines and you don't believe them?
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,837
13 Dec 2009 #56
Is it official enough for you BB or do you still maintain that it's only headlines and you don't believe them?

Nika? Do you know what "official" means?
How does an open letter to some politician make a website official???

"The German Jugendamt, a child robbering administration?"

And that statement is a dead giveaway that this site is anything but serious!
Oh and another funny quote from your "official" site!

[quote]...Germans have not wanted to have children for a long time. In order to compensate a demographic catastrophe, German authorities use dishonest

(especially in the face of the fact that millions of immigrants can't wait to get in and bring their brood with them to get more welfare....really no need to "steal" them. Quite to the contrary....we can do what we want they just don't want to get back again!)
Nika 2 | 507
13 Dec 2009 #57
How does an open letter to some politician make a website official???

European Parliament working document - is it an official document or not? Also, an open letter is a document and as such is official or would you rather consider it a headline.

The link that I published comes from the website of Conseil Européen des Enfants du Divorce / European Council for Parents, children and grandparents victims of international and administrative child abductions. If such an organisation publishes these documents on their website or organises such conferences then I guess that it's because they have a reason for it.

Polish press just loves Germany! ;)

Polish press loves Germany just as much as German Jugendamts love Polish parents (and Italian, French and American parents as well)
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,837
13 Dec 2009 #58
Now THAT is an official site:

auswaertiges-amt.de/diplo/en/Laenderinformationen/01-Laender/Konsularisches/Kindesentziehung.html

European Parliament working document - is it an official document or not?

Manno Nika....look beyond the european flag and the funny name!
You can't be that stupid in reality, can't you?

Polish press loves Germany just as much as German Jugendamts love Polish parents (and Italian, French and American parents as well)

Well...I wonder why we then don't hear more about the abuse of the hundreds of thousands polish kids growing up quite peacefully in Germany (with their polish/mixed parents).

Where did you leave your sense girl?
Nika 2 | 507
13 Dec 2009 #59
here you can see some videos about Jugendamt in action:

jugendamt-wesel.com/Video_liste.htm

mostly in German, unfortunatelly.

And the organisation that I quoted is nothing less offiacial than the one that you did BB.

And by the way, I am not insulting you and calling you stupid.
Bratwurst Boy 5 | 9,837
13 Dec 2009 #60
And the organisation that I quoted is nothing less offiacial than the one that you did BB.

That's what I meant!
Both websites are from and for groups of people who have grievances, one against german law and the other against polish....
Doubtless there are lot's of more groups and even websites concerning many other countries too.
The whole soddy case of child abduction by one parent is an ugly business world wide and not limited to Poland/Germany!

But "official" they are not!

Another funny quote...Didn't it get any more dramatic???

And by the way, I am not insulting you and calling you stupid.

Well....I am not (stupid that is)!
But when you really believe all that stuff and these headlines I can't help you...


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