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Charles Crawford on PiS just after the 2015 election


gumishu 11 | 5,012
22 Sep 2017  #1
Charles Crawford was a Brittish ambasador in Poland, he speaks very good Polish - no wonder he described PiS so well and predicted a lot of later developements

here's the article:
telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/poland/11954733/Who-are-Polands-victorious-Law-and-Justice-party-and-what-do-they-want.html
cms 9 | 1,272
22 Sep 2017  #2
Written two years ago so worth to consider some of his assertions

Do they really stand for robust and honest state institutions? Their MO is more TKM and treating the shareholders of state companies money as their own.

They are not religious zealots ? But they attend Radio Maryja functions, funnel millions of taxpayers money to religious institutions and tried a total ban on abortion.

A square deal for pensioners and state employees ? Yeah right - the daily stream of Dezubekizacja stories worth takes no into consideration
OP gumishu 11 | 5,012
22 Sep 2017  #3
Their MO is more TKM

more than what

treating the shareholders of state companies money as their own.

examples?

do you compare some tens of millions granted for whatever reason to Radio Maryja (Fakt managed to document less then 30 million of these here fakt.pl/wydarzenia/polityka/dotacje-dla-rydzyka-pieniadze-ojca-rydzyka/7xnh2j7 - with billions spent on pointless advertising campaigns in PO-friendly media by the previous government

the total ban on abortion project was not the initiative of the leadership of the party and it never made it past first reading in the parliament if I recall correctly - I doubt PiS would adopt it without alterations

what does have Dezubekizacja to do with a square deal for pensioners and state employees
Ziemowit 12 | 3,470
22 Sep 2017  #4
Their MO is more TKM

more than what

You really don't know this famous abbreviation?
OP gumishu 11 | 5,012
22 Sep 2017  #5
i surely know the abbreviation - I was asking cms what is using PiS more TKM than (is it proper English what I just wrote - I mean can you end a sentence with than? ) ;)

btw Ziemowit what are you views on the right to abort fetuses with a diagnosed Down syndrome
Harry
22 Sep 2017  #6
examples

PZU
OP gumishu 11 | 5,012
22 Sep 2017  #7
PZU what?
Harry
22 Sep 2017  #8
The former head of the Presidential Chancellery, despite being a law school graduate with zero business experience, has been made vice-president of PZU. Us taxpayers have to fork out 100,000zl a month for her and her company BMW and flat.
OP gumishu 11 | 5,012
22 Sep 2017  #9
maybe it's not the most decent thing to do - but how is that different to what PO and PSL did

and beware it is still not counting in billions - like the sound screens against empty fields along the A2 motorway erected during the time of PO just to mention one thing from the top of my head
Harry
22 Sep 2017  #10
how is that different to what PO and PSL did

For one thing the scale. But nice try using whataboutism to excuse the crimes of PIS.
Ironside 48 | 9,705
22 Sep 2017  #11
They are not religious zealots ? But they attend Radio Maryja functions,

You're either far gone regressive slash soviet s....(know what I mean) or you're not Polish to say something like that. Alternatively you're regressive that is far gone and not Polish.
G (undercover)
22 Sep 2017  #12
For one thing the scale.

Sure scale is the difference. PO is still holdings a damn share of the local admin and in Warsaw alone Gronkowiec employed more parasites than PiS in the whole gov and state owned companies.
Crnogorac3 1 | 357
23 Sep 2017  #13
It is the duty of every patriotic Pole to protect the democratically elected government of Prime Minister Beata Szydlo and the PiS ruling party under the wise leadership of president Jaroslaw Kaczynski and to prevent a possible Ukrainian scenario in Poland.
CasualObserver
23 Sep 2017  #14
Crnogorac3, if you substitute the words 'Pole' with 'Russian', 'Beata Szydlo' with 'Dimitry Medvedev' and 'Jaroslaw Kaczynski' with 'Vladimir Putin', and you can maybe see how creepy and inadvisable that sounds.
Crow 137 | 7,589
24 Sep 2017  #15
prevent a possible Ukrainian scenario in Poland

Yes, seams how is now Poland on menu. Just, I don`t believe in Ukrainian scenario in Poland. More probable are Catalonian or Kosovo scenarios.
cms 9 | 1,272
24 Sep 2017  #16
Ridiculous answers on here - only whataboutery and attacks on PO rather than addressing any of the issues.

I see a new lie being peddled that PiS was only joking when they vote unanimously to send the abortion bill to a second stage. Both Szydlo and Kaczynski supported it. The reason for this is that they are religious zealots.
OP gumishu 11 | 5,012
24 Sep 2017  #17
. Both Szydlo and Kaczynski supported it.

as far as I know Kaczyński doesn't support a ban on abortion when the pregnancy is a result of a rape or when the pregnancy endangers the life or health of the mother - but you may think otherwise - it doesn't hurt instantly to be brainwashed you know

and I guess you are a supporter of abortion being legal in all instances as if it is somehow women's right - sorry to disappoint according to the polls most Poles don't share your view
cms 9 | 1,272
24 Sep 2017  #18
Kaczynski position was that even if the foetus would die it should be carried to term and then they could have a little baptism and a little coffin. Shows the empathy of a person with no kids basically.

My own poisition is that shared by about 35 percent or the Polish population - I am pro life but for healthy births. However I am not sure of the governments need to legislate on an issue with personal ramifications. I.e. I need some convincing that the state owns the womb and the unborn child.

The PiS position of total ban is an extreme one - held by only 11 percent of the population.
Ironside 48 | 9,705
24 Sep 2017  #19
Kaczynski position

I don't know what was Kaczynski position on the issue and neither do you. I'm sure your are ignorant of the fact tat it was pro-life organization with hundred of thousand signatures of ordinary people that carried that project of the bill to the Sejm. It didn't pass so stop your yapping.

Personally I don't see anything wrong with that notion provided majority of the voters would support it.

However I am not sure of the governments need to legislate on an issue with personal ramifications. I.e.

As long as there is a state founded health service - there is plenty of need. I personally would be in favor of a private health insurance. Still I would support a notion that killing children is not a good thing. I think that killing children sanctioned by the law is bad for the people.

Anti-conception in all forms and shapes, sterilization that is all a sphere of a personal choice and freedom. There must be some moral standard applied if a life of the another is at stake. A no sane person would agree that amidst a Christian country killing children is a question of a personal choice - that is dumb.
cms 9 | 1,272
24 Sep 2017  #20
That was a quote from Kaczynski made last October to PAP.

He seems to have changed his mind in an April interview.


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