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Poland: The land of -isms


MorTan
17 Oct 2013 #31
Sorry to hear your experience but this could have happened pretty much everywhere.

A girl friend of mine got attacked in London by some random black girls because she was white. She was 2 weeks in the hospital for being white. And instead of white power they were screming, "white ******".
Paulina 13 | 3,459
17 Oct 2013 #32
Yes, on several occasions. His "I married a white woman and then ate her" comment about a black contestant on X-Factor. His statement that there should be "a national register of negroes" (the person he aimed that comment at was actually Indian-Polish) and that his show was sponsored by "the Warsaw branch of the Ku Klux Klan".

I haven't heard those comments, so I don't know what was that all about. Probably taken out of context, at least those about "a national register of negroes" and Ku Klux Klan, just like with that "if his Ukrainian maid was at bit prettier he'd have raped her".

His outstanding funny comment the day after Ukraine beat Sweden in Euro 2012 that if his Ukrainian maid was at bit prettier he'd have raped her.

Ah, I see you don't know what was that all about.
It was a mock-conversation between him and Michał Figurski (who's half-Russian himself) on their radio show.
They were pretending to be some Polish, sexist bigots.
It was supposed to be a criticism of the attitude of some Poles to Ukrainians coming here to work and doing jobs like cleaning ladies, etc., in their mind.

After the sh1tstorm ensued they were saying "don't shoot the messenger", I guess.
But I agree it was over the line and there's no reason to humiliate people to make one's point.
And I'm glad they took down their show from the radio.
Btw, Wojewódzki in those shows also made fun of the Church, priests, Catholics. There were also mock-conversations in which he was pretending to be a priest speaking in a "prayerful" fashion, etc.

He's a racist arsehole.

I doubt Patricia Kazadi would come to his show if he was a racist.
I've watched quite a few episodes of his show on TV, I've listened to quite a few of his and Figurski's shows on radio and I can tell you that, yes, he is an arsehole, not a racist one, though.

If you think he's racist, I suspect you've never seen his TV show.
I would say he's even on some kind of a mission to criticize everything that is wrong in Polish society, including racism, xenophobia, homophobia (and Catholicism, it seems lol).

He's really very liberal.
I'm surprised that you don't know that, tbh.
He's a crude a$$hole, yes, and is seen by many as an arrogant clown and disliked and as much as I don't like some of his comments and behaviour I must say he isn't a racist. Quite the opposite, as far as I've noticed.

Harry, I must ask - do you own a TV set? Do you watch Polish TV? Because it's not the first time I have an impression that you don't.
Harry
17 Oct 2013 #33
I haven't heard those comments, so I don't know what was that all about. Probably taken out of context

Here you go, watch for yourself:

I do hope this isn't going to be another case of 'That foreigner is criticising my fellow Pole! I must defend my fellow Pole!'.
Paulina 13 | 3,459
17 Oct 2013 #34
Here you go, watch for yourself:

Yes, that's a typical Wojewódzki for you. "Była żylasta" ;P
I already wrote - yes, he's a crude a$$hole, he often goes over board with his jokes, offends people (all kinds of people, white Poles included) and I don't think it's OK, but I'm 99% sure he isn't a racist.

His role on the X-Factor was to be a clown, that's what he's known for.

I do hope this isn't going to be another case of 'That foreigner is criticising my fellow Pole! I must defend my fellow Pole!'.

*sigh*
No, Harry, it isn't. I actually found some of his radio shows offensive for me as a Catholic, but he isn't a racist.

You haven't seen any episode of his TV show, have you? Yes or no?
He always tries to make his guests feel uncomfortable and pretends to be an idiot, although he is intelligent.
He's a d1ck though.
And he often goes over board.
But if you think he's racist than he's also very anti-Catholic and anti-Polish.
And PiS and Kaczyński absolutely detest him after this one:



Many people found it very distasteful (also using the Polish national anthem in this) but many anti-PiS Poles were laughing their asses off too.

If he turned out to be a racist, then I'd be very, very, really very surprised. I'm 100% honest, Harry.

Harry, I must ask - do you own a TV set? Do you watch Polish TV?

Will I get an answer, btw?
Harry
17 Oct 2013 #35
But if you think he's racist than he's also very anti-Catholic and anti-Polish.

So are almost all members of the KKK, i.e. there's nothing stopping somebody from being racist and anti-Catholic and anti-Polish.

If he turned out to be a racist, then I'd be very, very, really very surprised. I'm 100% honest, Harry.

Multiple public racist outbursts are almost always a sign that somebody is a racist.

His role on the X-Factor was to be a clown, that's what he's known for.

Clowns don't usually racially abuse their guests: he did.

Paulina: Harry, I must ask - do you own a TV set? Do you watch Polish TV?
Will I get an answer, btw?

Legally speaking I don't have a TV, which is why I don't have a TV licence (I don't have a radio licence either and deliberately disabled my car's radio in order to not get one).
Paulina 13 | 3,459
17 Oct 2013 #36
So are almost all members of the KKK, i.e.

Don't be silly, Harry, I'm sure KKK are usually great patriots or nationalists.

Legally speaking I don't have a TV, which is why I don't have a TV licence (I don't have a radio licence either and deliberately disabled my car's radio in order to not get one).

Then you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about, Harry, I'm sorry.
I have an assignment for you :)
Buy a TV set and watch every episode of Kuba Wojewódzki show and then make a judgment.
And then talk to Bilguun Ariunbaatar, Patricia Kazadi and Mike Tyson (all of whom were his guests on his TV show) in 2013 (Patricia also in 2010) and ask them if they think he's a racist.

And then get back to me ;)

You know, it's kind of funny, Wojewódzki is so liberal and critical towards Polish society that you two probably would make great friends.
Harry
17 Oct 2013 #37
Then you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about, Harry, I'm sorry.

If anybody doesn't have a clue what she's talking about, it's the person who was unaware of Wojewodzki.

Buy a TV and watch every episode of Kuba Wojewódzki show

One doesn't need to buy a TV in order to watch TV programs. And one doesn't need to listen to every one of Hitler's speeches in order to know that the bloke was nuts.

Anybody who wants to can watch the clip of Wojewodzki racially abusing that bloke and draw their own conclusions as to whether Wojewodzki is a racist or not. And then they can draw their own conclusions as to why you're defending him.

Wojewódzki is so liberal and critical towards Polish society that you two probably would make great friends.

I've met him: he's an arsehole in person too.
Paulina 13 | 3,459
17 Oct 2013 #38
If anybody doesn't have a clue what she's talking about, it's the person who was unaware of Wojewodzki.

?

One doesn't need to buy a TV in order to watch TV programs. And one doesn't need to listen to every one of Hitler's speeches in order to know that the bloke was nuts.

Meaning - you haven't watched his TV show, have you?

Anybody who wants to can watch the clip of Wojewodzki racially abusing that bloke and draw their own conclusions as to whether Wojewodzki is a racist or not.

Harry, if he's such a racist then why people of different races come to his show?

And then they can draw their own conclusions as to why you're defending him.

I'm not defending him, I'm saying how it is.
I really think you're simply stubborn and clueless.

he's an arsehole in person too.

As I wrote - you two would make great friends :)
Harry
17 Oct 2013 #39
you haven't watched his TV show, have you?

I most certainly haven't watched all of them, no. I did watch a bit of the one which Tyson was on, largely because a tiny part of me thought that the racist arsehole just might be stupid enough to make some comment about eating white women and Tyson would give him the biblical scale arse kicking that he so richly deserves. Sadly II was disappointed.

Harry, if he's such a racist then why people of different races come to his show?

One would assume that, allegedly like you, they were unaware of his past form for racism. Alternatively perhaps they had heard of it but judged the publicity value of being on the show to outweigh that.

I'm not defending him, I'm saying how it is.

You are defending him: you are claiming that he is not a racist despite being presented with evidence that he racially abuses people. Now, I do understand that it is hard for some Poles to accept a foreigner saying anything even slightly negative about a fellow Pole, but just watch the clip and say what you see: do you see an arsehole racially abusing a black man in order to humiliate him? Yes? That's because he is a racist arsehole.

I really think you're simply stubborn and clueless.

I'm beginning to think that you're utterly pathetic, going out of your way to defend a blatantly racist man just because he's a fellow Pole and the person pointing out his failings is a foreigner.

As I wrote - you two would make great friends :)

If I wanted arseholes as friends I'd be nicer to you.
grubas 12 | 1,390
17 Oct 2013 #40
They were pretending to be some Polish,

They pretend to be Polish all the time but neither of them is.

It was supposed to be a criticism of the attitude of some Poles to Ukrainians coming here to work and doing jobs like cleaning ladies, etc., in their mind.
After the sh1tstorm ensued they were saying "don't shoot the messenger", I guess.

I bet you are "young,educated and from a large city" since you are buying this explanation.It was one of their Polonophobic rants as very few Poles can afford Ukrainian maid.

I do hope this isn't going to be another case of 'That foreigner is criticising my fellow Pole! I must defend my fellow Pole!'.

He is as much Polish as you are Harry.It is not any secret that Kupa Wojewódzki is a Jew.
Paulina 13 | 3,459
17 Oct 2013 #41
I most certainly haven't watched all of them, no. I did watch a bit of the one which Tyson was on, largely because a tiny part of me thought that the racist arsehole just might be stupid enough to make some comment about eating white women and Tyson would give him the biblical scale arse kicking that he so richly deserves. Sadly II was disappointed.

I've seen it too and if you watched more episodes I think you'd realise that he isn't a racist and you'd know how liberal he is and actually critical of racism, xenophobia, homophobia.

Btw, he did get a kicking from Tyson, but not for being a racist lol You should watch the whole thing if you dislike him so much ;)

Btw, at the beginning of the episode with Kazadi and Tyson Wojewódzki is introducing himself as the "Chief Racist of Poland".
Now, do you think he's:
a) serious,
b) ironical
?

One would assume that, allegedly like you, they were unaware of his past form for racism.

I really doubt that, both Kazadi and Ariunbaatar are media people.
Simply everyone knows in Poland what Wojewódzki is like.
He has no respect for anything, as far as I've noticed.
People in general are afraid to come to his show lol

Alternatively perhaps they had heard of it but judged the publicity value of being on the show to outweigh that.

Kazadi? I doubt it, that girl has attitude ;)

You are defending him: you are claiming that he is not a racist despite being presented with evidence that he racially abuses people.

I'm claiming that he isn't a racist because he's abusing people equally. So either he isn't a racist and he's simply an ******* with a crude sense of humour or he's anti-everything.

Now, I do understand that it is hard for some Poles to accept a foreigner saying anything even slightly negative about a fellow Pole,

Harry, I'm really tired of you accusing me of this.
You seem to often do this when I disagree with you.
Is it because I'm Polish?
You assume that every Pole who disagrees with you must be overly patriotic or defensive?
I know Wojewódzki's TV personality, and what views he presents on TV and that's why I think you're wrong.
If I didn't think you're wrong about him I wouldn't be disagreeing with you.

but just watch the clip and say what you see: do you see an arsehole racially abusing a black man in order to humiliate him? Yes? That's because he is a racist arsehole.

No, I don't think he wanted to humiliate him, I've heard so many of his low jokes about so many people, all kinds of people, that I think most people see it this way - him making a jackass of himself yet again and everybody knows what to expect from him.

Yes, if I would see only this clip I would most probably think that he's a racist idiot, but since I, as everyone in Poland who owns a TV set and have seen his show and radio show, know what's his game.

It's a bit like with Ali G and his Borat - is he being offensive to Kazakhstan and it's people or not?
Some comedians go over board.
But that doesn't make them necessarily racist. Even if they make a racist joke.
Although, I don't like his behaviour on that X Factor clip.
And many other things he did, anyway.

I'm beginning to think that you're utterly pathetic, going out of your way to defend a blatantly racist man just because he's a fellow Pole and the person pointing out his failings is a foreigner.

Well, Harry, it's not the first time you're being prejudiced and utterly clueless about me. Nothing new under the Sun.
No, I'm just being objective, Harry.
If I was petty I could call him racist for his attitude towards the Catholic Church and his sexist use of "Dominika Wodzianka" on his TV show but I'm more objective than that. He doesn't seem to be a racist, judging by his views and his criticism of Polish society, etc.

Maybe you have some personal grudge - was he not nice to you when you've met him in person?

If I wanted arseholes as friends I'd be nicer to you.

Ouch! lol
:)

They pretend to be Polish all the time but neither of them is.

Sure, sure.

I bet you are "young,educated and from a large city" since you are buying this explanation.It was one of their Polonophobic rants as very few Poles can afford Ukrainian maid.

:)

He is as much Polish as you are Harry.It is not any secret that Kupa Wojewódzki is a Jew.

Ah, there you go. (sarcasm*)

*in case someone thought I agree with grubas
McDouche 6 | 285
17 Oct 2013 #42
I feel sorry that you had to go through such experiences OP. In my opinion, many Poles are very friendly people open to multiculturalism. Unfortunately, if I mention the fact that Poland still needs to progress greatly considering the country is still filled with many racists and antisemites then I will be called anti-Polish.
Harry
17 Oct 2013 #43
Wojewódzki is introducing himself as the "Chief Racist of Poland".
Now, do you think he's:
a) serious,
b) ironical
?

c) A publicity hungry twat who is also a racist.

He doesn't seem to be a racist, judging by his views and his criticism of Polish society, etc.

His repeated racial abuse of people shows that he is a racist.

Maybe you have some personal grudge - was he not nice to you when you've met him in person?

He did seem somewhat put out that I had absolutely no idea who he was (this was back in about 2002).
grubas 12 | 1,390
17 Oct 2013 #44
if I mention the fact that Poland still needs to progress

What makes you think that you are the right person to tell "Poland" what she needs?Leave it to the Poles and mind your own business.
delphiandomine 88 | 18,454
17 Oct 2013 #45
Unfortunately, if I mention the fact that Poland still needs to progress greatly considering the country is still filled with many racists and antisemites then I will be called anti-Polish.

Because we live in Poland and can comment on what we see.

On the other hand, you've presented a consistent anti-Polish agenda on this site. A few compliments doesn't change the fact that you've criticised Poland constantly on here.
szczecinianin 4 | 345
17 Oct 2013 #46
What makes you think that you are the right person to tell "Poland" what she needs?

Because you and your ilk clearly aren't.
Paulina 13 | 3,459
17 Oct 2013 #47
c) A publicity hungry twat who is also a racist.

I think he was ironical and yes, he is a publicity hungry twat lol But I don't see anything that would convince me that he's racist. One joke isn't enough for me.

His repeated racial abuse of people shows that he is a racist.

You've shown me only one racist joke that doesn't really differ from his other idiotic jokes, rather sexist, a$$holish, provocative behaviour, etc.

What's that repeated racial abuse? You mean that about "a national register of negroes" and KKK? I'd have to see the context for this, I suspect it was one of his mock-conversations on his radio show. Do you have a link?

He did seem somewhat put out that I had absolutely no idea who he was (this was back in about 2002).

lol
Well, everybody in Poland knows who he is, how did you dare not to know! lol
He could be joking, though, he's very autoironic on his TV show, on the other hand he seems to have a big ego too.

Btw, here Meller is talking with him about his (Meller's) criticism of that radio show about Ukrainians I think, and sth about a black guy too - maybe the one from X Factor: kuba.tvn.pl/wideo,2331,v/co-wk-ia-mellera,934485.html

And here Wojewódzki is calling Meller " a little atheistic Jewish tin* ":

kuba.tvn.pl/wideo,2331,v/pojedynek-na-plaskacze,934482.html

Do you think Wojewódzki is an anti-Semite too? lol

*konserwa - someone with conservative views
grubas 12 | 1,390
17 Oct 2013 #48
Because we live in Poland and can comment on what we see.

You can comment,true,but you are not entitled (and never will be) to be telling us what we need or should do.

you've criticised Poland constantly on here.

I criticize (and will continue doing so) oppressive antiPolish regime which is currently governing Poland but never Poland herself.

Because you and your ilk clearly aren't.

Another one.Morda krótko przybłędo! or out!
delphiandomine 88 | 18,454
17 Oct 2013 #49
You can comment,true,but you are not entitled (and never will be) to be telling us what we need or should do.

Fortunately, I can - I can vote here and have no qualms about using it.

I criticize (and will continue doing so) oppressive antiPolish regime which is currently governing Poland but never Poland herself.

It's pretty obvious you have no idea what a regime is if you think that the Polish government is a "regime". It's a democratically elected government that won power in an election that was conducted to Western democratic standards.

Then again, regimes don't tend to hold influence in Canadian basements.
Paulina 13 | 3,459
17 Oct 2013 #50
I criticize (and will continue doing so) oppressive antiPolish regime which is currently governing Poland

LOL

Another one.Morda krótko przybłędo! or out!

You don't live in Poland, don't you? lol
McDouche 6 | 285
18 Oct 2013 #51
Because we live in Poland and can comment on what we see.

Cool dude. I'll continue commenting on Poland anyway.

It's hilarious how Europeans constantly comment about America when they don't live here but someone it's not ok for Americans to say anything about a European homogenous country that needs to progress in order to function better as a future multicultural nation.
50%Polish
18 Oct 2013 #52
The reason you aren't treated as an outsider in the UK is because the UK no longer has a heritage or culture. It's now a watered down version of many mixes. That's exactly what Poles are trying to avoid.

so true
grubas 12 | 1,390
18 Oct 2013 #53
European homogenous country that needs to progress in order to function better as a future multicultural nation.

As a past multicultural country we have learned that multiculturalism doesn't work. Assimilation yes,multiculturalism no.
pierogi2000 4 | 229
18 Oct 2013 #54
but 99% just want to work

Even if you counted dealing drugs, your number is laughable. Why are there so many more blacks on welfare than other races? Let me guess, the system holding them down? The same system that seems to be working just fine for every other group of immigrants. Overwhelming majority of blacks in the USA were born & raised in the country....generations of roots in the country. Why are they continually over stepped by immigrants without the English language? Chance occurs once the excuses stop and that is not happening any time soon in the Land of Political Correctness.

I really don't gei it, why people coming here expect Poland to be just like the West or the US.

The majority of this globe is homogeneous. The nations that roamed the globe raping and murdering are no longer homogeneous. Go figure......

And actually Poland has less racists than Americans because logically there are less race issues in Poland....because it's homogeneous. How can a Pole be racist at something they've never met or encountered.

European homogeneous country that needs to progress in order to function better as a future multicultural nation.

Insisting that Poland needs to change into a multicultural nation is no different than me stating the USA needs to genocide their non Whites and return to being a homogenous country. Both are extremes.

It's been said before and will continue being said. If you don't like it....stay out.
szczecinianin 4 | 345
18 Oct 2013 #55
So you weren't actually refused service, you were simply abused by two random guys. That's a slight difference, and casts doubt on the rest of your story.

No, it doesn't. If two guys had acted the same way towards you, would you have replied:

"Excuse me, Sir, do you happen to be the owner of this establishment?"

Actually, you seem to lack basic common sense and life experience, so you might possibly reply in such a manner.
pierogi2000 4 | 229
18 Oct 2013 #56
If I ran away from every uncomfortable situation here in the USA, I'd never leave my house.
szczecinianin 4 | 345
18 Oct 2013 #57
I don't get it. Why people make feeble excuses for racism. As if Poles were mentally disabled people who weren't capable of civilised behaviour.

It isn't.

No, it isn't. But that doesn't make racism acceptable.

It's not a "fairly" homogenous country - when we compare it to the West, it's a very homogenous country.
Of course there will be more racists than in the West.

How is homogenity an excuse for racism?

But from my experience, majority of people in Poland aren't racist.

If that's the case, why have you just been excusing their racism?

Delphi's been here about five years or so, but doesn't appear to know a great deal about Poland. However, I would think two and half years is sufficient to get the flavour of a country. You comment about the UK without ever having been there.

Well, John Godson seems to be enjoying it here ;)

I worked with John Godson for a year when he lived in Szczecin. During that time he got beaten up twice. He's what blacks in the UK and US would call an 'Uncle Tom'.

That's almost hard for me to believe, to be honest. But if it happened, you should report it.

I've known such places. You'd have to be very brave to report them. Would you do it?

And I'm really, really sorry that you had such unpleasant experiences, ET.

I'm glad you wrote that. If you genuinely want things to get better then stop making excuses for your people.
grubas 12 | 1,390
18 Oct 2013 #58
He is exactly the kind of person unpleasant stereotypes of Poles are derived from.

I am a very pleasant person but if you came to my home and kept telling me that I need to move my furniture around because you don't like the current setup i would lose my patience after maximum 2 hours and knocked you the **** down then throw out the door.Poland is the home for Poles so don't you tell us how do we need to set up our furniture because you are only a guest.
szczecinianin 4 | 345
18 Oct 2013 #59
You are not a particularly pleasant person.

Regarding your comments about 'guests' in other people's countries, please let me remind you that Poles far more often demand the hospitality of others than host guests themselves.
Polson 5 | 1,770
18 Oct 2013 #60
if you came to my home and kept telling me that I need to move my furniture around because you don't like the current setup

You're not talking about the OP, are you? Cuz she's not willing to move any furniture, she's just fearing for her life sometimes, that you can understand, can't you?

Poland is the home for Poles so don't you tell us how do we need to set up our furniture because you are only a guest.

Poland is actually one of the homes for Poles. Poles found lots of new homes during last centuries. How about you, Grubas, where do you live right now?


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