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The right to own guns: would you support such legislation in Poland?


Lenka 3 | 2,353
25 Feb 2020 #1,441
can be done with a knife that is one inch long.

Wouldn't be very comfortable in use not to mention that it would require changing tools in a process that only needs one.

So shooting genius-what other use did you find for the guns? I'm all ears (or eyes if we are being literal
johnny reb 28 | 4,574
25 Feb 2020 #1,442
what other use did you find for the guns?

I use mine for home protection, traveling in bad areas for protection in my truck, exercising my constitutional right, hunting, collecting dust, memorabilia, target practicing, shooting unwanted varmints.......should I go on ?

We have posted repeatedly here of a responsible gun owner who have neutralized a life threatening situation because they had a gun and knew how to use it.

Now a question for you.
Just because you don't want to own a gun what gives you the right to tell your law abiding neighbor that they are not allowed to own one ?
Joker 2 | 1,285
25 Feb 2020 #1,443
All perfectly acceptable reasons to possess a firearm. I only use mine for home defense and occasionally go to the shooting range, but not often. I was thinking about taking the CCP class ( carry conceal permit) sometimes my business takes me into a ratty neighborhood.

We have posted repeatedly here

You can post facts until you're blue in the face around here

"Why we do need eight-inch or 10-inch kitchen knives with points?

Lets give them all our plastic picnic fork and knives sets...lol

Seriously, its not the knifes fault either. The quicker they admit the problem is Kebabs and not the knife. Deport the Kabob and watch the attacks cease.

Quite simple actually, but you have to recognize there is a problem first, instead of deflecting the real issue.
johnny reb 28 | 4,574
26 Feb 2020 #1,444
All perfectly acceptable reasons to possess a firearm.

Just wait until Lenka wakes up.
Wait and see what she will have to say about them. lol

You can post facts until you're blue in the face around here.

That in itself is a fact Joker.
We have repeatedly used the words "responsible gun owners" which they refuse to acknowledge, we have posted how the majority of gun violence is in Democratic run cities, we have posted the most all of the gun violence is done by gang members, we have posted that most of the gun violence is done by people of color, we have pointed out that illegal drugs are a factor, we have pointed out that every mass shooting has been done by a mentally ill person or terrorist, we have pointed out fact after fact that they just refuse to deal with the facts.

Then when Europe has a mass shooting they down play it and ignore it if all possible.
Rich Mazur 4 | 3,185
26 Feb 2020 #1,445
We have repeatedly used the words "responsible gun owners" which they refuse to acknowledge,

In the last twenty or so years, the number of cases where a responsible CC-licensed gun owner used it criminally is 5 or less. And that's millions of people and millions of guns.
Lenka 3 | 2,353
26 Feb 2020 #1,446
should I go on ?

No, it's quite enough showing the difference between a knife and a gun. Thank you for making my case for me.
Btw- I wasn't the one who brought up the guns into this conversation

what gives you the right to tell your law abiding neighbor

I don't stop them. They are free to apply for a permit according to the rules of the country they live in. As to what those laws are (for example in Poland) is decided by the society. If gun lovers manage to get enough people on their side and change the law I will have to accept it and live with it.

The funny thing is that while I believe US gun laws are stupid I leave you to it. It effects me only in the way that I know I would never move there. Yet Americans on this board seem obssesed about changing the minds of citizens and the laws in countries the never even visited...It's not like Poles started campain 'let's take the guns away from Americans' it's just that we have no desire to follow your, quite scary, example.
Miloslaw 8 | 2,418
26 Feb 2020 #1,447
Its not the gun laws that cause the disaster in the usa - its black people

Percentage of Americans that are black - 14%
Percentage of Brits that are black - 3%

Gun homicides as a percentage of all homicides in USA - 73%
Gun homicides as a percentage of all homicides in UK - 3%

If your comment above were true then if the UK had the same percentage of blacks as the USA then we would have the same homicide rate.

But 3 x 4.66 = 14%.

It ain't the blacks............ it's those dumb gun laws.........
Joker 2 | 1,285
26 Feb 2020 #1,448
Percentage of Brits that are black - 3%

What is the percentage of Muslims in the UK and knife attacks? How many more years before the UK is an Islamic nation, perhaps 20?

4% are Muzzies, means you have more of them than blacks!

it's those dumb gun laws......

We have guns to protect ourselves from an invasion. Unlike the Brits who turn yellow belly at every chance and have lost their country without a shot ever being fired.

If anyone needs guns, its the Brits!



Miloslaw 8 | 2,418
26 Feb 2020 #1,449
@Joker

Homicide rate in USA per 100,000 is 5.3.

In UK it is 1.2 and I think Poland is 0.8.

And you need to fact check that poster as I just did.
It is not accurate.
Rich Mazur 4 | 3,185
26 Feb 2020 #1,450
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_by_homicide_rate

2017 Murder rates from the above:

Sweden - 1.1
Finland - 1.2
UK - 1.2
France - 1.3
Belgium - 1.7
Latvia - 4.2
Lithuania - 4.5
--------------
New Hampshire - 1.0
North Dakota - 1.3
Main - 1.7
White US - 2.0
White US combined with the African and Latino scum - 5.0

Conclusions:
1. Euros are dishonest morons.
2. Guns have nothing to do with murder rates.
Joker 2 | 1,285
26 Feb 2020 #1,451
Homicide rate in USA per 100,000 is 5.3.

Our population and land mass is much larger than yours. Brits always omit this fact coz it blows your theory away. I can drive across your tiny entire county in a matter of hours.

Where can you go to get away from them? You cant, youre trapped on an Island and your losing ground, just like Londionstan:(:(
Miloslaw 8 | 2,418
26 Feb 2020 #1,452
UK - 1.2

Thats what I said.
Now instead of quoting some figures from some "Safe States", why not look up the figure for the whole USA.
Not dishonest.
johnny reb 28 | 4,574
26 Feb 2020 #1,453
Lenka you asked, "So shooting genius-what other use did you find for the guns?"
My reply was:
home protection, traveling in bad areas for protection in my truck, exercising my constitutional right, hunting, collecting dust, memorabilia, target practicing, shooting unwanted varmints...should I go on ?

No, it's quite enough showing the difference between a knife and a gun. Thank you for making my case for me.

Please explain just what your case was as you had no case.
It was more like educating you that guns have as many uses as knives.
Both can be used for weapons and both are harmless in Law Abiding Citizens hands.
Do you agree to that ?
Miloslaw 8 | 2,418
26 Feb 2020 #1,454
Our population and land mass is much larger than yours.

That has nothing to do with the fact that your homicide rate is more than 4 times ours per 100,000 people.
And more than 6 times Polands.
I have already proved that it can't be the blacks.
What's left?
johnny reb 28 | 4,574
26 Feb 2020 #1,455
Did you add the Latino' in with the Blacks ?
Miloslaw 8 | 2,418
26 Feb 2020 #1,456
@Johnny Reb

No, because Dirk said;"Its not the gun laws that cause the disaster in the usa - its black people"

I proved that it could not be black people.

So, what's left?
johnny reb 28 | 4,574
26 Feb 2020 #1,457
He meant all the minorities lumped into Blacks since the are the majority in minorities.
I guess you have to live here to get it.
I get tired of explaining that Americans talk in generalities sometimes which gets you Europeans lost.
I knew exactly what Dirk meant.
Miloslaw 8 | 2,418
26 Feb 2020 #1,458
He meant all the minorities lumped into Blacks since the are the majority in minorities

I don't think he did because he has repeatedly stated on this forum that he does not have a problem with Latinos and even employs them as they are hard workers.

He meant blacks.
But he was wrong anyway.
johnny reb 28 | 4,574
26 Feb 2020 #1,459
No he said that if he had to choose between Blacks and Latino's that he would rather hire Latino's.
I have an idea Milo, let's keep pushing your frivolous Off-Topic point until we both get a warning for it.
Uneducated, mentally ill, druggies, welfare, alcoholics, obviously should not be allowed to own guns.
That is a given.
Now, let's get back to the topic of Law Abiding Citizens that would support owning a gun in Poland.
Miloslaw 8 | 2,418
26 Feb 2020 #1,460
Law Abiding Citizens that would support owning a gun in Poland.

You won't find many of them.
Just not needed.
The crime rate in Poland is very low.
johnny reb 28 | 4,574
26 Feb 2020 #1,461
Just not needed.

In your humble opinion that is.
Whenever a community, city, state, or country has imposed a ban on guns, regardless if it was all guns or simply handguns, it has experienced an increase in murder rates.

In 1997, Wales and England saw a nearly 50 percent increase in homicides immediately after implementing a ban on handguns.
Gun control advocates promote the idea that more gun policies and regulations make people safer, but it's naive to believe that any type of law will stop someone set on murder or other criminal activity.

The fact is, widespread gun ownership does reduce crime.
cms neuf - | 1,579
26 Feb 2020 #1,462
Those numbers are incorrect and by leaving out Scotland - scene of the only school shooting in uK history they are an obvious nonsense

The ban on handguns was inspired by revulsion at what had happened

1997 Uk homicides 88
1996 uk homicides 122 - including a bunch of 8 year old kids

Basically all the numbers given by you guys are either wrong or half truths the best - it is totally obvious that higher gun ownership leads to higher murder rates and that is why it has such low support in Europe

And in Europe it's not a left right politics issue because you will see people who vote for right wing parties and right wing politicians are also strongly opposed to looser gun laws.
Rich Mazur 4 | 3,185
26 Feb 2020 #1,463
Now instead of quoting some figures from some "Safe States"

"Safe states" are white states. I am not going to feel responsible for the illegal Latino scum and the Africans which are different species. In that sense, comparing "white" states with white Europe is fair and honest and shows that the single variable - the gun ownership - has ZERO to do with the murder rates. If it did, the white US murder rate should be proportional to the gun rate. It is not.

I proved that it could not be black people.

You proved no such thing. In the 17 to 25 age group, Africans commit 17 - that's SEVENTEEN - times as many murders per 100k as do the whites. That is why lumping both races to produce murder rates is dishonest.

Also, that

Gun homicides as a percentage of all homicides in USA - 73%

is beyond stupid. Based on such data, what is the conclusion? The higher the percentage, the less safe the place? So, a sleepy town of 1000 where some drive-by African a-hole shoots a store clerk now has 100% murder by gun rate?

Bottom line: you can stand on your head and you will not show that guns are a factor in the composite murder rates.
johnny reb 28 | 4,574
26 Feb 2020 #1,464
all the numbers given by you guys are either wrong or half truths the best -

You mean in your humble opinion.

it is totally obvious that higher gun ownership leads to higher murder rates

Not true, not true at all.
When it comes to protection, resisting a crime with a gun is the safest route for victims.
It's associated with lower rates of both victim injury and crime completion than any other victim action.
Criminals are also less likely to burglarize an occupied home due to fear of the homeowner being armed.
In England, where only around four percent of the general population legally own a handgun due to heavy restrictions, 59 percent of homes are occupied when the burglar breaks in, compared to approximately 28 percent in the U.S.

Even if the homeowner in England did own a gun, he or she would have to unlock it from its safe, then unlock another safe where the ammunition is kept, then load the weapon before self defense would be possible.

In 2009, 13 years after the country's handgun ban began, its handgun crime levels had nearly doubled in England.
Rich Mazur 4 | 3,185
26 Feb 2020 #1,465
JR, I could not state this any better.
It is the big picture what separates the Euro "subjects" from the American "citizens". They never had a chance to feel like citizens, because, as subjects, their freedom was what their parasite kings would allow. Our freedom is what we kept. And that is why the globalists hate the US and the US Constitution the most. Euros are like playdough - easy to form and squeeze as the globalist desire. My apologies to Poland and the few countries with balls next to it.

Their huge mistake was in not following Russia and decapitating their royalties - all of them - and copying the US Constitution. Had these weasels done that, we would not be having these idiotic discussions today.
cms neuf - | 1,579
26 Feb 2020 #1,466
And yet the troubled Europeans are richer, live longer, have more time off, healthier and more equal than Americans.

And don't even mention the trashy living standards and life expectancy in Russia (which by the way is an absolute monarchy right now)

I loved my time living in the US but many things are more free in Europe with consumers able to make their own decisions.

The US constitution is not some holy book - it's the product of a bunch of 18th century lawyers and tobacco growers and you can see right now the inequalities and poor governance that stems from some of its weaknesses
Rich Mazur 4 | 3,185
26 Feb 2020 #1,467
many things are more free in Europe

Like what?
cms neuf - | 1,579
26 Feb 2020 #1,468
Buying alcohol for starters.

though of course for you its a few kopecks to some headscarf woman on a corner for some rotgut homemade spirit that you can swig on the tram.
johnny reb 28 | 4,574
26 Feb 2020 #1,469
Not that CMS and Milo keep taking this thread Off-Topic constantly when they are losing the debate of the right to own guns in Poland BUT -

please explain your last post in Random Chat as you lost me here.
Rich Mazur 4 | 3,185
26 Feb 2020 #1,470
Back to guns...

With all things being the same, the US vs Euroland difference comes down to just one: when the perp makes it to the bedrooms upstairs, here he dies.

In the Euroland - the homeowner dies. The difference maker being that gun - not how many operas and museums you have.


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