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Poland economy is slowing down - how does it affect you?


Foreigner4 12 | 1,769
30 Sep 2012  #61
The last post is correct. The observations are acute and resonate with clarity.

And to the cheapskate on here, if you're going to brag about how much you pay someone then make sure it's brag-worthy.

That is all.
OP pawian 155 | 8,618
30 Sep 2012  #62
was a kid back then but not a 2 years old one, I saw what was going on then, private small businesses popping up on every corner...

I lived through 1980s and saw how everything was crumbling. Finally, communists decided to share power with opposition (then lost it) because the situation was so bad.

ok, I didn't make myself clear enough, what was going on in 89-91 was really fine (especially under under those complicated circumstances)

Yes. Total freedom for the market.

terrible was what happened later, increasing bureaucracy blocking development of domestic companies

Yes, they gradually introduced licenses for everything.

and at the same time blind love for "foreign investors" and "the west" without thinking if it is good for us or not.

I can`t agree. That love was a necessity. Without foreign capital we would be on today`s Ukraine level.

when state owned companies were sold to "foreign investors" in most cases the brand disappeared,

Most of these brands would have fallen anyway without the foreign capital.

You have problems with understanding one important thing - Polish post-communist economy was in such a bad condition that Poles would have never been able to restore it back to life on their own. We needed capital and we got it.

t's all organized the way that hardly any taxes are paid, people are expolited to the limits, investments in human capital are as small as it is possible.

Capital is relentless. :):):)
legend 3 | 664
30 Sep 2012  #63
increasing bureaucracy blocking development of domestic companies and at the same time blind love for "foreign investors" and "the west" without thinking if it is good for us or not.

So true.
milky 13 | 1,657
30 Sep 2012  #64
youtube.com/watch?v=cvG0gbvZ4tY
OP pawian 155 | 8,618
23 Dec 2012  #65
1500 workers of Fiat car manufacturer in Tychy, Sileisa are certainly going to be affected.

wbj.pl/article-61382-fiat-plans-to-lay-off-1500-at-tychy.html

Fiat Auto Poland (FAP) announced earlier this month that it plans to lay off 1,500 workers at its car plant in Tychy, in southern Poland. The process is due to start in January 2013 and will affect one-third of all employees, as well as Fiat parts suppliers.

FAP's management said low demand due to the economic crisis was behind the decision, as was the earlier decision made to cease production of the Fiat Panda Classic at Tychy.

A production forecast by FAP indicates a reduction in output from 300,000 cars this year to 250,000 in 2013. Management decided that this level of production requires fewer workers.


Pity because it is also going to, like domino effect, reduce demand for teachers of English and other services in the area.

The unemployment is expected to reach 13% at the end of the year.
kcharlie 2 | 165
24 Dec 2012  #66
I stand to gain from the slowdown if it causes a significant reduction in prices in the still overvalued property market. I'm still outpriced of the London market (i.e. I don't plan on slaving away for years to pay off a huge mortgage or buying-to-let and risking interest rates going up with my investment being repossessed due to the rent not covering the mortgage payment) so I intend on moving to Poland permanently and purchasing some property to rent it out to generate a low-risk passive income sufficient to live comfortably without working too hard.
OP pawian 155 | 8,618
24 Dec 2012  #67
I stand to gain from the slowdown if it causes a significant reduction in prices in the still overvalued property market.

Oh, yes, the slowdown has a positive aspect for you and thousands of people who might desire to buy their own property at last.

At the same time, people who managed to buy properties on credit a few years ago during boom times, must be desperate now seeing how much their value decreased.
Cali - | 56
24 Dec 2012  #68
The US rate is higher than that: it doesn't take into account those who fell out of official stats - say, they can't collect unemployment any logner - those who are working pt but are will to work more hrs, that is , ft (full time). So when you added up is much higher than that! But it looks for those are in office now - it's all politics. Keep in mind that if you're unemployed in Poland, you still have your medical, right? Sh..t I'd better be unemployed in Poland than in the "land of the free."
kcharlie 2 | 165
24 Dec 2012  #69
At the same time, people who managed to buy properties on credit a few years ago during boom times, must be desperate now seeing how much their value decreased.

Oh, of course. Naturally, downturns have more losers than winners.

Keep in mind that if you're unemployed in Poland, you still have your medical, right? Sh..t I'd better be unemployed in Poland than in the "land of the free."

That is so true. I can't imagine not being entitled to ordinary healthcare. The American healthcare system is ridiculously overpriced for what it is, and, worse, not everyone is entitled to it.
OP pawian 155 | 8,618
2 Jan 2013  #70
Despite slowdown and crisis looming, Poland is not bad in rankings, e.g., where to be born in 2013

s

But, making a living out of teaching English is becoming harder every month. Teachers of English are still going down with prices. I have come across ads where a teacher is ready to accept 15 zlotys per 60 min lesson. Native speakers are satisfied with 30 zlotys.
Cali - | 56
2 Jan 2013  #71
I think both sides of the political spectrum in Poland MUST recognize that Poland has made a HUGE leap forward in 20 yrs since the commies had relinquished their power! I looked at some pics of Warsaw (that's where my folks came from) n gotta tellya what was like then, say, in the 70s and now, it's a nite n day! It's hard to believe that Warsaw was sooooo gray n grim, I mean, you gotta get yourself on prozak or other anti-depressent sh..t if you wanna live like that! Most Poles are expecting to catch up to Hanz n Franz in a few years?! Sadly, that wont happen even in 15-20 yrs unless something big happens west of the border n Poland capitalizes on it. After WWII Germany kept developing n developing thanks to US money(loans), on the other hand, Poland was building the Palce of Culture n other useless (five-plan) nonsenses, which had to be abolished when it embraced free market. It's a zaro-sum outcome (game), i.e., some gained (Germans) and some lost (Polish) after WWII. Anyway, happy n prosperous 2013 to all Poles!
Grzegorz_ 51 | 6,163
2 Jan 2013  #72
Sadly, that wont happen even in 15-20 yrs

If current Polish strategy regarding economic development is not changed, It won't happen even in 50 years.

I think both sides of the political spectrum in Poland MUST recognize that Poland has made a HUGE leap forward in 20 yrs since the commies had relinquished their power! I looked at some pics of Warsaw

Imagine a 4 years old child, who just like most kids of that age, can't read, write or count... 20 years later it turns out that this person can read, write and count up to 100 ! Huge progress, isn't it ? However, would you tell that person, well done or rather more like "damn imbecile, you should have already graduated from university, stop wasting time and fix what you've messed up" ?
gumishu 11 | 4,953
2 Jan 2013  #73
Despite slowdown and crisis looming,

the real thing that is a true menace is not some still elusive crisis but very real inflation which is two digit for poor people - the whole method of calculating in Poland is screwed and does not reflect the true inflation (especially the food prices) - we are constantly paying more for lower quality products
Cali - | 56
3 Jan 2013  #74
does not reflect the true inflation (especially the food prices)

You’re right, but the true rate of inflation excludes food, gas, et cetera, items that are considered volatile. For example, a couple mths ago in Cali a gal of gas was running over five bucks! Now it dropped down to $3.5. That one buck and a half price swing wont be counted into the rate due to the commodity’s volatility.
OP pawian 155 | 8,618
3 Jan 2013  #75
the real thing that is a true menace is not some still elusive crisis but very real inflation which is two digit for poor people - the whole method of calculating in Poland is screwed and does not reflect the true inflation

Wow! I haven`t heard or read about it so far. That is some novelty, really.

(especially the food prices) - we are constantly paying more for lower quality products

Yes and no. Products are more expensive than 3,4 years ago but the prices have been stable for the last 1, 2 years.

PS. Be careful - I often do shopping alone or with my wife and I have a good memory. :):):):)
gumishu 11 | 4,953
3 Jan 2013  #76
what about your rent pawian, or the council tax??
OP pawian 155 | 8,618
3 Jan 2013  #77
I know you won`t believe it but it is lower.
Last year - 497.
This year - 494.

A few taxes went up a little but other went down. Hence the difference.

This is the rent with central heating, water, rubbish, cable, lift, repair and maintanance costs for our own 60 m flat.
Ironside 47 | 9,563
4 Jan 2013  #78
but I knorow that Polish economy was totally devastated by the dying communism of 1980s

How do you know it?

Everything what Solidarity experts, economists and politicians tried to do after 1989 can be called one giant improvisation.

I would call it demolition or/and sell out!

Mistakes were unavoidable

Really? Like let all those commies to take advantage of their position or letting selected people make money on the state property - officially sanctioned theft.

than Ukraine

Ukraine was part of the soviet Union an organic part. Poland was separated soviet country like Czech or Hungary but with any privet sectors and farmers. You comparison has no merit here.
Zibi - | 336
4 Jan 2013  #79
pawian: but I knorow that Polish economy was totally devastated by the dying communism of 1980s
How do you know it?

How could one not know it, Ironside? Are you 15 years old?
Ironside 47 | 9,563
4 Jan 2013  #80
This is discussion forum his gut feeling do not count! Are you twelfth Zibi? So far you have avoided my qestion/.

As for economy - implying that all what was build during communism times in Poland by the magic of 1989 become overnight worthless junk that Poles shoudl be grateful if somebody agreed to dispose off is a biggest lie and propaganda there was and you all 12 years old have just bought that lie and you are stuck with it for better and worse.

Unfortunately your mental or intellectual problem in overcoming such imprinted lie is not my concern. So in the future try ti be more specific and argumentative without resorting to so called common knowledge.
Zibi - | 336
4 Jan 2013  #81
Are you twelfth Zibi? So far you have avoided my qestion/.

Sorry to disappoint you. I remember how crappy Poland's economy was in 1989 and before. And I suspect Pawian was there to witness it first hand too. And I am glad things have improved by now, enormously.
Ironside 47 | 9,563
4 Jan 2013  #82
You are not listening.
OP pawian 155 | 8,618
4 Jan 2013  #83
How could one not know it, Ironside? Are you 15 years old?

Nope. Ironside must be about 30 years old. He left Poland 10 years ago when his parents won the green card in the American visa lottery. In 1989 he was a kindergarten kid (or had a nanny at home).

As for economy - implying that all what was build during communism times in Poland by the magic of 1989 become overnight worthless junk that Poles shoudl be grateful if somebody agreed to dispose off is a biggest lie and propaganda there was and you all 12 years old have just bought that lie and you are stuck with it for better and worse.

Of course, not everything was worthless. I guess only 90% industry was junk. :):):):)

And I suspect Pawian was there to witness it first hand too.

Yes, sad, but I was already an adult in late 1980s. And vividly interested in the problems of the country .

And I am glad things have improved by now, enormously.

Yes. Do you know in 1989 communists created the highest inflation in Poland ever?

1989 - 639,6%

It is hard to believe today, but it is true.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inflation
Ironside 47 | 9,563
4 Jan 2013  #84
Of course, not everything was worthless. I guess only 90% industry was junk. :):):):)

How do you know it? You still haven't answered my qestion.

Nope. Ironside must be

Stop fantasizing about me it is an unhealthy habit.
OP pawian 155 | 8,618
4 Jan 2013  #85
You still haven't answered my qestion.

In 1989, when you played hide and seek in the kindergarten garden, I was a young man fully aware of historical events taking place in Poland. I can even say: I was fascinated with changes going on our eyes.

Later I read a lot of publications on the period. And still am fascinated.

Simple, isn`t it??? :):):):):)

Stop fantasizing about me it is an unhealthy habit.

Everybody knows about that, come on.
Ironside 47 | 9,563
4 Jan 2013  #86
I see what you mean, you have been sold a lie and you don't even realize it. No wonder that after 20 years you stick to your imprinted propaganda's "truth", it wouldn't do good to your self esteem to admit that you have been blindfolded and fooled for so many years.
OP pawian 155 | 8,618
4 Jan 2013  #87
You are wasting your, my and all members` time with such silly answers/posts.

Do you realise it?? :) I am sure you do....... :) So why???? :):):)
jcarrett 3 | 10
4 Jan 2013  #88
Poland needs to give its citizen their liberty back. The amount of socialism that has still been in society after the collapse of the Soviet Union is tremendous. I could not believe that they can just pull random people over without any reason- that's preposterous. Poland needs to leave the EU and set up its truly own country with a much smaller government, less taxes, open-borders and no import or export tax. The libertarian way is the only way.
OP pawian 155 | 8,618
5 Jan 2013  #89
Interesting ideas. Do you think, if introduced, they would boost Polish economy more than the access to the EU?
Ironside 47 | 9,563
5 Jan 2013  #90
You are wasting your, my and all members` time with such silly answers/posts.

Silly? No!
Do you have any back up to your feeling that Poland's factories, manufactures and industrial capacity was a junk in 90% as you say. Do you have some work at your disposal based on numbers, data and facts not propaganda, wishful thinking and lies?

If you don't then your claims based on personal experiences are worthless - do you understand that? Poland's customer services, entertainment industry, distribution and food marked could be inefficient and in disarray. However those are not all what constitute economical strength of a country.

Can you estimate without such data a potential ability of Poland's economy to adjust and change without destroying, demolishing and selling its industrial base out. As it was a rhetorical qestion - of course not!

so you silly claims to have all the answers because you have some recollections of 1989 events are hilarious.


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